India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[Narasimh]

 

[Concard]

India conducted a 2 front war exercise in 2018. Here is the analysis published in Indian express by GD Bakshi

The Indian Air Force has just conducted a massive war drill. In sheer scope and scale this matches the legendary military manoeuvres like Brasstacks (1987) and Op Parakram (2001-02). It was a massive exercise and involved over 1150 aircraft that generated a blistering rate of 11,000 sorties in 13 days. Some 1400 officers and 14,000 men were pulled out of training establishments to participate in this gigantic exercise.

In the intense Bangladesh war of 1971, the IAF had generated a sortie rate of 500 per day and some 7000 sorties overall in 14 days in both theatres. In just the first three days of this exercise the IAF notched up 5000 sorties and launched 11,000 sorties overall (including 9000 by its fighter aircrafts alone) in 13 days. The Chinese media was awed and commented that only the US Air Force was hitherto capable of generating such massive sortie rates. For some strange and inexplicable reason however, the Indian media totally blanked out this exercise. For all those 13 days the focus was exclusively on rape.

Exercise Gagan Shakti was a highly professional and well thought out war drill. Its aim was to validate our war plans and streamline SOPs and procedures. It played out the worst case scenario of a two-front war. In Phase One, the western front against Pakistan was activated. In just 72 hours (three days ) the IAF generated an incredible 5000 fighter sorties. This was twice the number of sorties the Pakistani Air force can generate and would have sufficed to decimate that Air Force. The IAF also undertook maritime ops in the Arabian sea and IOR that were vectored by the Navy’s Boeing MR aircraft.


In one such operation Su- 30 aircraft flew an incredible 4000 km non-stop with the help of midair refueling. It also launched special heliborne operations and the paradrop of a battalion group. Having dealt with Pakistan the IAF switched around to face the Chinese front. It took just 48 hours to switch resources to the north and east by using its heavy lifter aircraft like C-17s and IL-76s, rail and smaller aircraft and civil air line resources.

To avoid the Chinese missile saturation attacks on known airfields, the IAF deliberately operated from scattered satellite airfields and ALGs. Inter-valley transfer of troops and resources was practised and all conceivable scenarios played out. Mass casualty evacuation drills were also rehearsed to cater for the contingency of even a nuclear strike.A SU-30 simulated a Bramhos cruise missile attack over The Malacca straits.

So far, the SU-30s had been operating on a 50 per cent serviceability rate. These glitches have been fully ironed out and a serviceability rate of 80 per cent plus has been achieved with massive help from the PSUs like HAL, BDL , DRDO etc. The SU-30s, the Mirages, Jaguars, the Mig- 21s, Mig- 29s, the Hawks and even the indigenous LCA were pushed to the limits and managed to generate an incredible rate of six sorties per day for each aircraft. With the radars and air guided weapons an incredible serviceability rate of 97 per cent was achieved. Incidentally, this included some legacy systems that were over 40 years old. Combat Support elements like the Airborne Early Warning Aircraft and air-to-air refuellers put in a stellar performance and achieved a tremendous combat multiplier effect.

The air force used surge tactics in a short but intense conflict scenario to make up for its glaring shortage of aircraft and its rapidly dwindling squadron strength. This exercise pushed men and machines to their limits but proved a point. Despite the shortage of aircraft and the government’s refusal to release resources, our air – warriors would move heaven and earth to give a bloody nose to our adversaries. They would fight with what they have- and still triumph!

Such a massive tri-services exercise needs a great deal of planning and coordination. Advanced HQs of the Air Force were co-located with Army commands. Tactical Air Centres and Maritime Air Ops centres were set up and the Army provided huge amounts of troops , tanks and transport to depict targets. Live delivery of munitions was actually practiced at the Pokhran, Tilpat and other field firing ranges. This mammoth exercise entailed over nine months of planning and preparation. The complete and total apathy of the Indian media however, made such a huge mobilization of men and machines virtually a wasted effort. The electronic medium was ideal to generate and publicize such images and carry them to our adversaries to China, Pakistan and the increasingly hostile regime in the Maldives.

In the Sundarji era, such large scale military exercises were used to send a salutary, media directed message to the adversaries. Simply put it said – don’t mess with us. It deterred hostile activity by a massive display of raw military power. The messaging was done through the Indian media. Such massive mobilisation of resources can only be done rarely. It is a great pity that the Indian media blithely ignored this huge exercise and thus wasted its entire deterrent potential. The Indian people are Gandhian in outlook and non-violent in character. What a waste of national effort it seemed because the media simply failed to convey its message of deterrence to China, Pakistan and the Maldives. Imagine the psychological impact of masses of SU-30s, Mirages, Migs and Jaguars on the TV screens in South Asia and beyond. The media is the message and it was vital to convey this message of deterrence to our adversaries.

The IAF and its Chief need to be congratulated for its massive display of exemplary professionalism. The Indian media has poured scorn by pointedly ignoring these massive war-games – which would have been headlines news in any other country. Air forces the world over are awed by these figures. Any other country would have lauded such a valiant effort by its armed forces. Our media and people have unfortunately ignored both the massive Naval and Air force exercises in a row.

India’s stunning exercise Gagan Shakti shows how force can be used without war to deter adversaries

For some strange and inexplicable reason however, the Indian media totally blanked out this exercise. For all those 13 days the focus was exclusively on rape.

indianexpress.com

What is your opinion on it?

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Chinese nationalist defence analyst is discussing on Weibo whether to cut off Water supplies(brahmputra and indus) to India or not (lol), Yeh log feel kr gye hai after getting befitting response from our army.

if they try this will be an all out war but in reality they have no such capability how is this clown considered an analyst?

 

[Chanakya 002]

Yes they would be at ladakh but I think they would be relieved by IA companies at the posts

They are moved forward as reserve and for raki

 

[Lancer]

Musharraf was shit scared of that base & raised concerns to the Tajik government of the fact that Indian planes if stationed there would be able reach Pakistan within minutes using the air base. Not to mention it can also be used to threaten Hotan Air base in Xinjiang as well.

It's one of my little pet projects/dreams to have 1-2 squadrons of customized Indian PAK-FA's there. Imagine that...

 

[LETHALFORCE]

It's one of my little pet projects/dreams to have 1-2 squadrons of customized Indian PAK-FA's there. Imagine that...

Pakfa was scrapped after Russians decided China will also be a customer

 

[garg_bharat]

We should never fall for their mirage they are building chinis are only going through ladakh and AP not through pak it is an deceptions

India should prepare for the worst even if worst case scenario never materializes.

A lot can be achieved with good planning and putting local industries to good use.

 

[Lancer]

Pakfa was scrapped after Russians decided China will also be a customer

You sure it was after that? When was it decided China would be part of it? Because as far as I remember, there was bickering and various issues regarding that project b/w India and Russia for several years.

Nonetheless, the Chinese have the Flanker as well - but that's where the customization aspect comes in.

 

[Chanakya 002]

Will anyone be willing to supply us a few squadrons of fighter jets in emergency situation?

If pakis get involved, whats the chance that some country will get involved from our side too. Israel? US? Japan?

Only Israel with few F16. May be around 20 jets

 

[another_armchair]

There was talk of India buying Iron Dome.

DRDO jumped in with QRSAM.

4 years thence, QRSAM continues to undergo testing with 2021 being expected date of induction while Iron Dome continues to shield Israel from Hezbollah's Grads and misc rockets.

Bhai, mature system hai. Sasta hai. Utha lo.

Tragically though, we saw how effective the Spyder systems are.

 

[mokoman]

if they try this will be an all out war but in reality they have no such capability how is this clown considered an analyst?

They maybe able to flood Assam and AP . Release water suddenly from their dams .

We may be able to do same to Pakistan , in case of a 2 front war . except it will be far worse for them .

 

[LETHALFORCE]

You sure it was after that? When was it decided China would be part of it? Because as far as I remember, there was bickering and various issues regarding that project b/w India and Russia for several years.

You sure it was after that? When was it decided China would be part of it? Because as far as I remember, there was bickering and various issues regarding that project b/w India and Russia for several years.

Nonetheless, the Chinese have the Flanker as well - but that's where the customization aspect comes in.

after Brazil refused to join Russians were looking towards China. India wanted an exclusively Russian -Indian plane since they were financing most of it Russia wanted to include others and also export to whom they wanted

 

[Blue Water Navy]

There was talk of India buying Iron Dome.

DRDO jumped in with QRSAM.

4 years thence, QRSAM continues to undergo testing with 2021 being expected date of induction while Iron Dome continues to shield Israel from Hezbollah's Grads and misc rockets.

Bhai, mature system hai. Sasta hai. Utha lo.

Tragically though, we saw how effective the Spyder systems are.

Wikipedia says that India is buying Iron Dome.

 

[Bhadra]

I am still confused why Galwan river is so important?
Terrain wise, its like impossible to make a regimental push.

Do not worry .. You are not alone in not understanding it. All those Generals and experts also do not understand it.
First thing = In mountains Vallies and passes are the only avenues of movement across mountain ranges hence most important.

See the Maps and the blue lines.

Galwan River provides an ingress into Aksaichin one side and into Shyok River vally on the other. The valley leads us directly to Northern portion of Aksaichin near Chinese raod G-219 . The Chinese have constructed a raod into that valley. The immidiate northern brach near Shyok takes us directly behind all Chinese posts in Gogra, PP17. PP19, Depsand and DBO.

Therefore it is the most vital valley in enire Aksaichin. Anyone who has control of this valley can come into Shyok valley from Aksaichin or Vice versa. It is the spine of Chinese control of Aksaichin.

 

[garg_bharat]

if they try this will be an all out war but in reality they have no such capability how is this clown considered an analyst?

Diverting water of Brahmputra has been a strategy of China. It has not been done yet and it cannot be done in a hurry. Though technically possible.

West flowing rivers cannot be diverted by China.

 

[another_armchair]

Wikipedia says that India is buying Iron Dome.

That Wiki entry needs to be updated to *No Firm Orders Yet*

 

[Akula]

Chinese nationalist defence analyst is discussing on Weibo whether to cut off Water supplies(brahmputra and indus) to India or not (lol), Yeh log feel kr gye hai after getting befitting response from our army.

Apne Pakistani aur Bangladeshi dosto ko yeh Cheeni pyasha kyu bana rahe hai.

 

[scatterStorm]

This you all watch how in calm and composite way Retired Air Marshal tells you very valid points which happened may be video must have been already seen by you all but it's worth again if your brain has gone post hyper solar eclipse


Sorry for putting this here, but I guess today I can do it as today even moon came between earth and sun

I've already posted my observations of how MKI allowed the Aamraam to bleed its kinematic performances. Because you simply can't beat a super-maneuverable fighter in KE performance, it will use its agility and maneuverability to always keep the enemy loose the D1max advantage.

Update: F16 can also do that, every fighter has its own advantages and disadvantages. What matters are better training and knowing your machine and arsenal inside out.

"You keep nudging and you allow enemy fighter to loose its precious arsenals and then you play your aces".

This shows, how well trained our Fighter pilots are.

Rest assured, PLAF who thinks they are fighting because they got better missiles, jets in numbers will never know when they get hit and from where.

1. Its our playing ground, we know the terrain much better than them.
2. Our fighter pilots have more flying hours clocked then PLAAF fighter pilots and Pakis Pilots combined.
3. Our fighter pilots are well trained in BVR combat. (scarcity kya kya nahi kerwati)
4. The only advantage for them is, they have numbers. Presently there J10 can only walk a mile with less payload.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Diverting water of Brahmputra has been a strategy of China. It has not been done yet and it cannot be done in a hurry. Though technically possible.

West flowing rivers cannot be diverted by China.

It will be an act of war where response should be a nuclear strike on all Chinese cities imo

 

[Tridev123]

If we reach a stage where we are worried about our AF...

Well, aren't you forgetting our ace in the hole...Our Navy?
It won't be sitting twiddling it's thumbs,

The Navy no doubt will have an important part to play. But the impact of sea denial on Chinese Merchant shipping will not be immediately felt as the Chinese will be having reserves of strategic materials like petroleum. These reserves have to decline.

The main battle will be fought on land across the Himalayas. It will be an Air - Land battle as using Air power is to our benefit. We have to cut off the supply lines of the PLA which run from mainland China to the Tibetan plateau. Other wise the Chinese will continue to pump in reinforcements and war fighting material using the Railway line and road network already established. Their air bridge capability may not be significant. If our land forces have to gain the advantage we should not allow replenishment of losses by the PLA. We have a great advantage in having shorter supply lines. The road and rail network on both sides will be hit but I believe we can repair and recoup faster than the Chinese.

Ideally the Chinese forces in Tibet should be isolated from the Chinese mainland. We cannot even think of taking out their supply lines without using the Air Force. The long legged Su 30 mki armed with the Brahmos Cruise missile is ideal for the role.

The truth is the Air Force will have a more decisive role than the Navy.