India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[Shashank Nayak]

Can CAS be done using just 20 mm gun? Rudra has neither ATGM nor rockets, and people here are wondering why LCH is not being ordered.

MOD should first arm their existing Rudras. Then dream about LCH.

Rockets have been cleared .. The problem is with HELINA ATGM

 

[IndianHawk]

On 19 August 2018, HeliNa was successfully test-fired from a HAL LCH at the Pokhran test range.[60]

DRDO and the Indian Army tested HeliNa with a range of 7–8 km from the Integrated Test Range (ITR) in Chandipur, Odisha, on 8 February 2019 to check the maximum missile range and accuracy.[61] The HeliNa user trial was expected to be completed by 2020.[62]

SANTEdit
In November 2018, an upgraded version of HeliNa, called Standoff Anti-tank Guided Missile (SANT), was successfully tested at Pokhran.[63] The upgraded version of the missile is equipped with a new nose-mounted active radar homing seeker with extended range, up to 15–20 km.[64]

 

[IndianHawk]

On 19 August 2018, HeliNa was successfully test-fired from a HAL LCH at the Pokhran test range.[60]

DRDO and the Indian Army tested HeliNa with a range of 7–8 km from the Integrated Test Range (ITR) in Chandipur, Odisha, on 8 February 2019 to check the maximum missile range and accuracy.[61] The HeliNa user trial was expected to be completed by 2020.[62]

SANTEdit
In November 2018, an upgraded version of HeliNa, called Standoff Anti-tank Guided Missile (SANT), was successfully tested at Pokhran.[63] The upgraded version of the missile is equipped with a new nose-mounted active radar homing seeker with extended range, up to 15–20 km.[64]

Helina trails were to complete by this year end . It has been trialled successfully many times now . And in laddakh cold weather it will be accurate .

So just declare it ready for operations in laddakh and put it on rudra and lch!!

Also sant has been tested too which has range of 15-20 km do the rest of the trial over chinkies. I won't mind few dead chinkies for development purpose.

 

[Defcon 1]

Don't forget army now has emergency procurement powers . So army could use those provisions to purchase additional spikes and mount them to helos.

Emergency powers would be useless in this case since Spike is not yet integrated with Rudra. Integration can only be done with the help of DRDO and they would resist because of HELINA

 

[Sridhar_TN]

Meanwhile our friends in USA are getting worked up.
It's almost like USA is looking at every chance now to screw china.lol


Don't take it seriously though. Lol

Yeah right....sure. There will be no action taken whatsoever imo. Just rhetorical speeches and tweets. It’s all about self interest.

And seriously. Joint patrols? Lol. . Why on earth would India ever let any country’s soldiers on its soil? 250 years of colonization has cemented that paranoia of letting anyone inside our borders

 

[IndianHawk]

Emergency powers would be useless in this case since Spike is not yet integrated with Rudra. Integration can only be done with the help of DRDO and they would resist because of HELINA

Read my above post helina is almost ready .

All this talk about accuracy and max range are issue of hot desert .for laddakh there is no such issue. They can mount helina on rudra and lch and put them there

 

[IndianHawk]

Yeah right....sure. There will be no action taken whatsoever imo. Just rhetorical speeches and tweets. It’s all about self interest.

And seriously. Joint patrols? Lol. . Why on earth would India ever let any country’s soldiers on its soil? 250 years of colonization has cemented that paranoia of letting anyone inside our borders

A lot is going on though. Uighur sanction bill is already passed by Senate in USA. Tibet bill is presented in Congress.
Pompeo has declared Hong Kong autonomy is dead so hongkong special status is gone.

Chinese student with military ties will be expelled. Chinese companies being de listed.

Huwei chips are banned and it also lost case in Canada. UK will kick it out too.

It's on .we need a new thread to track us china cold war. I'm onto it.

 

[Mikesingh]

Can CAS be done using just 20 mm gun? Rudra has neither ATGM nor rockets, and people here are wondering why LCH is not being ordered.

MOD should first arm their existing Rudras. Then dream about LCH.

Rudras are being armed with eight Helina anti-tank guided missiles, four MBDA Mistral short-range air-to-air missiles or four 70mm Thales 12-round rocket pods and 2 torpedoes or depth charges and 4 anti-ship missiles planned for the navy version which is under development.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

A lot is going on though. Uighur sanction bill is already passed by Senate in USA. Tibet bill is presented in Congress.
Pompeo has declared Hong Kong autonomy is dead so hongkong special status is gone.

Chinese student with military ties will be expelled. Chinese companies being de listed.

Huwei chips are banned and it also lost case in Canada. UK will kick it out too.

It's on .we need a new thread to track us china cold war. I'm onto it.

That’s good to hear. But wait till that trade deal or some ‘deal’ is signed and some of those actions get reversed. Not to say it will happen, but it could. There is no honor system in this day and age. Self reliance is the only way.

The quad for eg consists of 3 nations that share no border with China. All I see on Twitter is everyone screaming activate the quad activate the quad. As though Japan, aus and the us are waiting for India’s call, and once actives they will swing into action.
None of that’s going to happen.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

Rudras are being armed with eight Helina anti-tank guided missiles, four MBDA Mistral short-range air-to-air missiles or four 70mm Thales 12-round rocket pods and 2 torpedoes or depth charges and 4 anti-ship missiles planned for the navy version which is under development.

Emergency powers would be useless in this case since Spike is not yet integrated with Rudra. Integration can only be done with the help of DRDO and they would resist because of HELINA

In all reality, is they wanted to integrate, they can. If the spike team is brought to India, and they sit together to integrate the ir pod of the lch or rudra with targeting information for the missile, the whole process would be over within a month. Trials and testing could take much longer, but hey. In a situation like this, testing the integration a few times in any test range should be good enoug

 

[IndianHawk]

That’s good to hear. But wait till that trade deal or some ‘deal’ is signed and some of those actions get reversed. Not to say it will happen, but it could. There is no honor system in this day and age. Self reliance is the only way.

The quad for eg consists of 3 nations that share no border with China. All I see on Twitter is everyone screaming activate the quad activate the quad. As though Japan, aus and the us are waiting for India’s call, and once actives they will swing into action.
None of that’s going to happen.

I have created new thread for this let me tag you.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

NEW DELHI: The Army top brass kicked off an operational review of the overall security situation on Wednesday, even as the military assessment was that Chinese soldiers will have to unconditionally withdraw from Indian territory in eastern Ladakh for the “conciliatory” messages now emanating from Beijing to have any real meaning.



Defence sources said it would be a folly to “read too much” into the statements made by the Chinese foreign ministry as well as its ambassador on Wednesday till there is actual de-induction of People’s Liberation Army soldiers who intruded 1-3 km into what India considers to be its territory in eastern Ladakh. “Words have to translate into action on the ground,” said a source.
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Envoy reaches out, says India and China pose no threat to each other
Around 1,200-1,500 PLA troops are currently engaged in the four to five virtually eyeball-to-eyeball confrontations on the northern bank of Pangong Tso (Tso means lake), Demchok and the Galwan Valley region across a broad frontage of the unresolved Line of Actual Control (LAC).
The PLA has also amassed additional troops within its territory near the face-off sites, diverting well over 5,000 soldiers from an exercise it was holding in the region.
With the Indian Army more than matching the Chinese deployments, there has been no breakthrough yet in the almost month-long military stalemate despite several rounds of talks between rival major-general, brigadier and colonel-level officers on the ground.

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India firm, won’t step back from areas where Chinese troops have intruded
Hectic diplomatic negotiations had also finally defused the major 73-day military face-off between Indian and Chinese soldiers in the Bhutanese territory of Doklam, near the Sikkim-Bhutan-Tibet tri-junction, in June-August 2017.
But the fallout has been that the PLA has permanently stationed troops and built military infrastructure and helipads in north Doklam since then. “This time, the confrontation is on what we perceive to be our territory,” said a source.
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India’s LAC infra upgrade unnerves China
This will be a top consideration in the three-day Army commanders’ conference, which is being chaired by General M M Naravane and attended by the senior Lt-Generals heading the six operational and one training commands of the over 12-lakh strong force. “There will be brainstorming on the operational situation and challenges along the border as well as administrative matters during the conference,” said an officer.
The worry is that China has been dragging its feet in either “clarifying” the 3,488-km long LAC stretching from Ladakh to Arunachal Pradesh, which would reduce face-offs, or setting up the long-pending hotline between top military commanders like the DGMO one between India and Pakistan.
Similarly, the Border Defence Cooperation Agreement (BDCA) inked between India and China in October 2013, which specifically prohibited either side from “tailing” each other’s patrols in areas where there is “no common understanding” over the LAC, has not also really been made operational on the ground till now. The top-level hotline, in turn, was first proposed in the BDCA and then agreed to during PM Narendra Modi’s visit to

 

[IndianHawk]

China can’t afford to retaliate against Canada for Meng Wanzhou decision, experts say | Globalnews.ca

Experts argue the coronavirus pandemic and tensions with Hong Kong have put China in a far weaker position globally than when Meng Wanzhou was first arrested, putting Canada at a potential advantage.

globalnews.ca

Canada china after huwei lost extraction case of it's cfo.

China is illegally holding some Canadians hostage in china.lesson don't visit china .

 

[fire starter]

I like this fear.

 

[cereal killer]

Yeah right....sure. There will be no action taken whatsoever imo. Just rhetorical speeches and tweets. It’s all about self interest.

And seriously. Joint patrols? Lol. . Why on earth would India ever let any country’s soldiers on its soil? 250 years of colonization has cemented that paranoia of letting anyone inside our borders

Absolutely this is just US propaganda. Not going to happen. US wants to maintain a unipolar world & considers China a big threat to its hegemony. India on the other hand wants a multipolar world where its interests are its priority. In the long run US & west views both China & India as its future challengers. The problem with China is it views itself as a leader of Asia & doesn't considers India as its equal & wants to dominate the region. India obviously doesn't want China to get all too powerful & tries to maintains balance. US wants to use India as a tool against China to keep itself as a sole superpower. I think Indian leadership is smart enough to know this.

 

[IndianHawk]

Absolutely this is just US propaganda. Not going to happen. US wants to maintain a unipolar world & considers China a big threat to its hegemony. India on the other hand wants a multipolar world where its interests are its priority. In the long run US & west views both China & India as its future challengers. The problem with China is it views itself as a leader of Asia & doesn't considers India as its equal & wants to dominate the region. India obviously doesn't want China to get all too powerful & tries to maintains balance. US wants to use India as a tool against China to keep itself as a sole superpower. I think Indian leadership is smart enough to know this.

USA is not a fool . They know very well china has grown too big for USA to remain a unipolar power.

That's why USA has been trying to build an alliance with India and accepted a nuclear deal sidelining all global rules and npt/ctbt.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

Absolutely this is just US propaganda. Not going to happen. US wants to maintain a unipolar world & considers China a big threat to its hegemony. India on the other hand wants a multipolar world where its interests are its priority. In the long run US & west views both China & India as its future challengers. The problem with China is it views itself as a leader of Asia & doesn't considers India as its equal & wants to dominate the region. India obviously doesn't want China to get all too powerful & tries to maintains balance. US wants to use India as a tool against China to keep itself as a sole superpower. I think Indian leadership is smart enough to know this.

Agreed. Issue also is, China is not just trying to dominate but bully and harass. That’s the issue. Trying to cause unusual amounts of border tension and constant land grab And encroachment is beneath a super power. You become a bully then.
Unwillingly they are showing the world how they would operate if they were to lead the new world order. And it definitely is not pretty.

In all honesty, would anyone prefer a US based world order or China based world order. The actions and results lately are for everyone to see.

 

[Sridhar_TN]

USA is not a fool . They know very well china has grown too big for USA to remain a unipolar power.

That's why USA has been trying to build an alliance with India and accepted a nuclear deal sidelining all global rules and npt/ctbt.

They’ve grown big economically. Militarily they are weaker than Russia.
But with enough time and money and if left unchecked, they could grow in the military domain too, in the decades to come.

This definitely worries the current powers to be.

 

[Bhadra]

I like this fear.

Nothing wrong in it if India wants it back.. Go India Go..

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Absolutely this is just US propaganda. Not going to happen. US wants to maintain a unipolar world & considers China a big threat to its hegemony. India on the other hand wants a multipolar world where its interests are its priority. In the long run US & west views both China & India as its future challengers. The problem with China is it views itself as a leader of Asia & doesn't considers India as its equal & wants to dominate the region. India obviously doesn't want China to get all too powerful & tries to maintains balance. US wants to use India as a tool against China to keep itself as a sole superpower. I think Indian leadership is smart enough to know this.

The whole world has benefited from US trade policies . If a new country replaces USA
will the same generosity exist?? I don't think India is viewed as a threat in the same league
as China which is an economic and military threat.