India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[Suryavanshi]

You are again simply ignoring History and repeating yourself.. .
1962 was the worst time to attack India as the Chinse were almost famined, there were intraparty squabbles in CCP, there was an international crisis going in in the form of Cuban Missile crisis, USSR had threatened China that in the event of they attacking India, USSR will respond on USSR- China border, USSR had just commenced supply of newly made MIG -21 to India....

But the Chinese attacked with a bang..

Mao was a Mad Man.
Todays CCP is way more calculative then that.

 

[revenge002]

It's simple just like in history kingdom tells there people that they possess external threat and people and kingdom need to prepare in all front like food (storage) equipment training of soldiers so they counter external threat.Here we are facing a country who has full of resources in all front human capital to natural resources,so now our kingdom and People need to realise this threat and prepare in all front where they possess threat to us.eg- These chiniks are winning gold medals in every international Olympiad like see every medal tables of last decades we are nowhere to find.Our enemy is strong in all front and m***** follow only one ideology communism.

 

[IndianHawk]

First World War occurred on collapse of the World economy..
The Second World war was triggered by the great depression of 1939 ... Germany devalued the currency so much that the war damages of WWI could be paid in a single day and others looked at their face bewildered... one needed a suitcase full of currency to buy a beer...

India needs to be on guard if Indians wish to protect their newly found BJP led Nationalist resurgence .... that is what is under threat from all sides - Pakistan, Nepal, China, Communists, Left and libarts, Ayyar or Ayangers.. Sonia and Monia... All wish Modi lead India down...

Pakistan and Nepal both are bankrupt and debt ridden. Left has no political stronghold anymore .

Even china is struggling with global backlash. Our enemies are not as strong as people think. But you are time this is time to consolidate national forces and move forward with strength.

 

[captscooby81]

Mig-21 came after 1965 war not before 1962 war .

If China is going to hit us again to repeat what it did to Nehru in 1962 to Modi in 2020

Xi has taken over as the permanent chairman and president till death , Just above him Putin has cemented his place as russian empire forever . The only big democracy in this part of world is India .A big Dictator neighbour to a democratic leader is not going to go down ever so well .

Expect any action to happen by October end November early week , When USA will be busy with its elections campaign and trump certainly exiting white house china will use that 3 months of chaos coming up in US election to carry out any adventure .

Can we place some order for Arty guns with Tata and kalyani and get some 40-50 delivered by october it will add some better support to our forces

USSR had just commenced supply of newly made MIG -21 to India....

But the Chinese attacked with a bang..

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Even china is struggling with global backlash. Our enemies are not as strong as people think.

Thats also the pronlem... If China thinks that things are only going to get worse, and it is currently at the peak power differential with India, it might attack India.. so that India will never challenge them again. We need to be on our guard.

 

[IndianHawk]

Mao was a Mad Man.
Todays CCP is way more calculative then that.

Ccp are idiots. They have doomed Chinese demographics and condemned china to future of old geriatric nation.
They have made enemies out of 3 of works largest 5 economic powers ( USA India and Japan).
And they have made friends with backstabbing porkies .( The greatest example of Chinese stupidity even when they saw what happened to USA for trusting Pakistan). Lol.

Don't expect anything but stupidity from ccp. They are grandmasters of losing chess.

 

[ezsasa]

Refer to all my posts on the subject.
Have not I been telling that to all?

100m this side, 100m that side is a dream. One can not even say 4 km inside because there is no agreed fixation of even the perceptions of LAC. Leave aside experts like Ajay Shukla who does not know anything except ass of a tank.. Galwan is too far off his career graph...

Shiv Shankar Menon is one of the most acknowledged and experienced China experts amongst Indian diplomats and since his young age has been on China desk including his stay in Tibet and China with his diplomat father. I have seen him working on many experts committees as director and JS as a member of the India China Expert group ceased with the problem of identification of LAC. One can take whatever he says as that of "Horses Mouth"

and he is funded by US Govt now..

 

[ezsasa]

Ccp are idiots. They have doomed Chinese demographics and condemned china to future of old geriatric nation.
They have made enemies out of 3 of works largest 5 economic powers ( USA India and Japan).
And they have made friends with backstabbing porkies .( The greatest example of Chinese stupidity even when they saw what happened to USA for trusting Pakistan). Lol.

Don't expect anything but stupidity from ccp. They are grandmasters of losing chess.

as long as no body underestimates CCP.... if they actually manage to displace USA, their idiotic methods will end up becoming the textbook.

 

[IndianHawk]

Thats also the pronlem... If China thinks that things are only going to get worse, and it is currently at the peak power differential with India, it might attack India.. so that India will never challenge them again. We need to be on our guard.

China has no power differential over india specially in tibet.

Chinese airforce is still mostly obsolete with shitty avionics and even shittier weaponry. J10 crashed more than any other modern jet frequently. Half the fleet remains unavailable thanks to maintainace prone Russian engine. Jets with Chinese engine have even worse record .

Same goes for most of their military equipment lot of is untested stuff which never faced any real competition.

After balakot Chinese awacs in pak proved to be useless . Chinese uav sold to UAE crashed more then they ever flew. In comparison our military gear is selected after extreme competition from both west and Russia and is battle tested mostly.

Beside tibet has no advanced airfields and supply lines run on single roads stretched hundreds of kilometers.

Chinese are neither ready nor capable of fighting a modern war that too against a major power like India.

That's why I say I will take them seriously when they capture the tiny Taiwan.

 

[Rassil Krishnan]

Mao was a Mad Man.
Todays CCP is way more calculative then that.

The old india also actually believed in being less militiarist and was not prepared along the border too.

There was a complete qualitative and quantitative difference between india of today and then.

Yes china can attack but india itself should be weak along the lac for china to attack as an opportunity.

Hell even pre NDA government position along lac was enough for that.

You need overwhelming superiority not near parity to initiate and win land along lac.

However intrusions and disturbances will still happen.

 

[captscooby81]

Though i like what you are trying to say by asking stop dhoti shivering , its too much to call CCP as idiots and they do only stupid things , They took a country to $14 Trl economy and also built one of the biggest naval forces (they don't have many experience manpower to handle them) . Let's not underestimate our enemy and get another bad experience like 1962 . Lets keep our guard up and ready to mobilise what ever we need inside the country to face the coming challenge from dragon

I personally feel this virus outbreak is a planned move by CCP to weak america for good and take over the gap which trump has left globally for a global power .

Just that our bad luck we tend to be CCP neighbour and we obviously coming in between their rise to global power so they would like to settle with us one more time like 1962 so that we don't do anything for 2-3 decades .

Ccp are idiots. They have doomed Chinese demographics and condemned china to future of old geriatric nation.
Don't expect anything but stupidity from ccp. They are grandmasters of losing chess.

 

[Bhadra]

Mig-21 came after 1965 war not before 1962 war .

You are right and I am right.

Wiki-

"Development of what would become the MiG-21 began in the early 1950s, when Mikoyan OKB finished a preliminary design study for a prototype designated Ye-1 in 1954. ..... It made its maiden flight on 16 June 1955 and its first public appearance during the Soviet Aviation Day display at Moscow's Tushino airfield in July 1956.

" India is the largest operator of MiG-21s. In 1961, the Indian Air Force (IAF) opted to purchase the MiG-21 over several other Western competitors. As part of the deal, the Soviet Union offered India full transfer of technology and rights for local assembly.[9] In 1964, the MiG-21 became the first supersonic fighter jet to enter service with the IAF. Due to limited induction numbers and lack of pilot training, the IAF MiG-21 played a limited role in the Indo-Pakistani War of 1965.[10] However, the IAF gained valuable experience while operating the MiG-21 for defensive sorties during the war."

Now sir, you are right that MIG 21 first saw operational Service with IAF in 1965. But I am right that USSR had agreed to give their latest MIG -21 to India in 1961 ... that indeed alarmed China and it is recorded in many histories of Sino- Indian conflict... I never said they were used in the 1962 War..

 

[IndianHawk]

as long as no body underestimates CCP.... if they actually manage to displace USA, their idiotic methods will end up becoming the textbook.

All this corona and it's backlash is also counts as brilliance of ccp. Anyway there was always a limit to which world will tolerate ccp.

Major powers of world are staunchly democratic still .
USA India Japan Germany UK France are the 6 biggest economies out of 7 largest in the world.

Even after them most bigger economies are democratic.

And wester world is still far richer per capital at 30000 dollars + gdp per capita . While china is barely as rich as Russia now. So china is not anybodies goal to reach. Infact chinese level is the average gdp per capita of world nothing special really. Unfortunately we are even more poor.

China was tolerated till it was not killing anyone outside china now that's gone.

Without co-operation from India and Europe china can't supplant usa and guess who are ccp making enemies with ? Another brilliant move .

 

[Shashank Nayak]

China has no power differential over india specially in tibet.

Chinese airforce is still mostly obsolete with shitty avionics and even shittier weaponry. J10 crashed more than any other modern jet frequently. Half the fleet remains unavailable thanks to maintainace prone Russian engine. Jets with Chinese engine have even worse record .

Same goes for most of their military equipment lot of is untested stuff which never faced any real competition.

After balakot Chinese awacs in pak proved to be useless . Chinese uav sold to UAE crashed more then they ever flew. In comparison our military gear is selected after extreme competition from both west and Russia and is battle tested mostly.

Beside tibet has no advanced airfields and supply lines run on single roads stretched hundreds of kilometers.

Chinese are neither ready nor capable of fighting a modern war that too against a major power like India.

That's why I say I will take them seriously when they capture the tiny Taiwan.

I am talking about comprehensive national power here. China is far ahead of India right now. If the war drags on for more than a month, without India making significant gains, then China's edge in manufacturing and India's relative weakness in armaments manufacturing will start tilting the balance in favour of China( Assuming no third party involvement) . That is why we need to be sharp and prepared..

 

[Assassin 2.0]

China and CCP is here to stay doesn't matter what other countries are goin to say.
India ain't gonna stop trade with Chinese and multiple Asian countries will not stop that either.
Africa is dead poor they will gladly accept any FDI investment. West USA in particular will work to slow down Chinese economy but china is also one of the biggest consumer of goods and material.
Heck even in mobile processors huawei kirin is doing fairly well.

 

[MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00]

No only rafale will come.
Competition is of Medium Weight Fighter aircraft.
F-15 lies in Su-30MKI category.

F-16 was rejected by IAF after trials. (dunno why people like that oldie so much rafale with meteor can always defeat that F-16.)

Nibbers don't get excited there is no point of buying F-16 we ain't gonna get it for free like porkis. So it's better to go with much more advanced platform.

I don’t care about F-16. The Indian Government has already expanded the competition criteria from Medium Fighters to Twin-Engined Heavy Fighters as well. That’s why Boeing Decided to enter there F-15 Advanced Eagle to the competition.

 

[ezsasa]

All this corona and it's backlash is also counts as brilliance of ccp. Anyway there was always a limit to which world will tolerate ccp.

Major powers of world are staunchly democratic still .
USA India Japan Germany UK France are the 6 biggest economies out of 7 largest in the world.

Even after them most bigger economies are democratic.

And wester world is still far richer per capital at 30000 dollars + gdp per capita . While china is barely as rich as Russia now. So china is not anybodies goal to reach. Infact chinese level is the average gdp per capita of world nothing special really. Unfortunately we are even more poor.

China was tolerated till it was not killing anyone outside china now that's gone.

Without co-operation from India and Europe china can't supplant usa and guess who are ccp making enemies with ? Another brilliant move .

what if CCP doesn't measure their goals in GDP per capita terms, what if their goal is measured by survival of CCP and prosperity of CCP members alone?

 

[IndianHawk]

Though i like what you are trying to say by asking stop dhoti shivering , its too much to call CCP as idiots and they do only stupid things , They took a country to $14 Trl economy and also built one of the biggest naval forces (they don't have many experience manpower to handle them) . Let's not underestimate our enemy and get another bad experience like 1962 . Lets keep our guard up and ready to mobilise what ever we need inside the country to face the coming challenge from dragon

I personally feel this virus outbreak is a planned move by CCP to weak america for good and take over the gap which trump has left globally for a global power .

Just that our bad luck we tend to be CCP neighbour and we obviously coming in between their rise to global power so they would like to settle with us one more time like 1962 so that we don't do anything for 2-3 decades .

Let's understand their economic success. They are as successful as India only that they started reforms 13 years Earlier. We are trailing them exactly by a decade on economic parameters.

All they did is provide land and removed labour laws for Westerner to use to mass manufacturing and kept building infra fast kudos to them. We are also getting there.

But military is different matter . They haven't fought a single war in 40 years and since west doesn't sell weapon to them there domestic weapon develop without any real competition . Only poor countries by then too.

Even bankrupt porkistan wanted french and Italian Avionics for junk17 but India scuttled that so it had to accept Chinese junk.

J15 copy was not supported by Russian so 20% of fleet has crashed .

List is endless.

One of there destroyer was once adrift in Indian ocean because engine gave up.

I could go on and on.

The point is it takes decades of experience to build actually combat capable weapons. Unless you get huge Tot and massive competition the path that we have chosen .

 

[cereal killer]

Mig-21 came after 1965 war not before 1962 war .

If China is going to hit us again to repeat what it did to Nehru in 1962 to Modi in 2020

Xi has taken over as the permanent chairman and president till death , Just above him Putin has cemented his place as russian empire forever . The only big democracy in this part of world is India .A big Dictator neighbour to a democratic leader is not going to go down ever so well .

Expect any action to happen by October end November early week , When USA will be busy with its elections campaign and trump certainly exiting white house china will use that 3 months of chaos coming up in US election to carry out any adventure .

Can we place some order for Arty guns with Tata and kalyani and get some 40-50 delivered by october it will add some better support to our forces

Interesting observation I too agree India needs to procure more artillery to effectively counter China effectively in a limited border war. What is the current status of Howitzer M777 guns?

 

[Bhadra]

The old india also actually believed in being less militiarist and was not prepared along the border too.

There was a complete qualitative and quantitative difference between india of today and then.

Is that right?
Indian Army was the largest institution of India of 1.7 million on the conclusion of WWII.

The Indian army was singularly responsible for extending Indian territories from Burma to Durand Line and Himalayas to Srilanka.

India Army had just defeated Japanese aggression in Singapore, Burma and North East.
Indian Army was experienced in frontier warfare for the previous fifty years.

But Nehru and his cronies simply dismantled that machine till someone realized Indian national consolidation simply can not take place without Indian Armed Forces. If Indian Army was not there no princely state would have joined India, there would be no Junagarh, Goa, Hyderabad and Kashmir with India..

So do not blame India. Blame the ICS Baboons, the spy Police Babus who wanted to play generals and Leftist intellectuals of MEA and Nehru for what humiliation India faced in the absence of a strong Armed Forces.