India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[captscooby81]

Sir the intention has been clearly shown by us to china long back . The last and only time any country used nukes was WW2 after that so many wars happened no one bothered to drop that bomb again . Nukes are created as deterrence . USA and Russia built 1000s of nukes to deter each other . Chinese did to deter USA , Pakis created nuke to deter us from our superior conventional force power and for whom did we created nukes and Agni 5 missiles ? not at all for pakis . Those are for chinese more than nuke best would be SLBM test of K-4 or A5 test with extended range that is better message than doing nuke test and getting into sanctions drama

I will leave which major weapons that bring serious threats to existence of world peace should be tested to the experts but if we fail to test and to prove our capabilities now, we will then end up being minion in this power game.
Chinese have targeted our credibility. This is the time to question theirs, by any method deem fit. By pushing back PLA or any other means which China experts can suggest.
US is pressurizing us and trying to make us their sidekick by USCIRF comments and attempting to negotiate on behalf of India to China, Solution: Do not give into US pressure - test the major weapons !

Testing series of major weapons will prove that we are not to be fucked with.

 

[M.J.K]

Nothing meaningful will Chinese gain from putting up forces on our Himalayan border. We have to understand that it is about positioning. We have to weed off Chinese pressure without being pawn of any other power. That is the primary objective. Not regaining control of Aksai Chin or anything else.
In SCS and East Sea we are getting into pond where it is a multiparty issue, not just ours. Hence telling Chinese we can complicate this issue for you. That would be major headache for them.
If things escalate in SCS then others have to join without India and China asking. Thus sending the message that China and India cannot solve their own issues. Hurting China credibility most, it will hurt bit of us but then we will be able to equate ourselves with China.

I they are already eating up our land since 1962 apart from what they gained during 1962 war.I would say they are doing something in Himalayas.If we cant deal with them in our own backyard and send a message here they will not consider us more than a nusiance in SCS, where they can overpower us, embarrass us with ease and don't expect Quad to help us they are expecting us to help them.

 

[Suryavanshi]

I hope all guys are enjoying the magic show .

be ready for next show of Modi ji

@LETHALFORCE are ye banda kon he pata karo, jo koi bhi he bahut annoying he.

 

[Blue Water Navy]

SCS is their backyard we cannot do any thing meaningful militarily than the US or Japanese or the Vietnamese .We can do a few statements but that doesn't threaten them it merely annoys them.

Though i am not sure whether it is us holding ourselves back from selling brahmos to vietnam and philiphines or russia or vietnamese and philippines themselves.

But what if India Govt. releases a statement saying that we will deploy in SCS. The PLA will piss in their pants because unlike any other country Indian Navy can also fight with their buffer regiments like Chinese fisher man boats and what not's. US Navy will wait to act on a Asian fishing boat but Indian Navy will send Marcos to secure the boat.

 

[abhay rajput]

I really don't understand the nuclear test solution what is the point of doing more test if we don't have intention to use nukes at all , By doing these test are we showing to chinese we will use nukes ? if that's what we want to achieve the onus is already on china to call our nuclear development bluff , Exactly like how the onus of calling paki tactical nuclear bluff is on us . Let china take the gamble push the country to brink of extinction and then see if a nuke doesn't fly over to peking or not .

The keyword here is proven vs unproven. We have proven 25kt bombs. Chinese have proven mt bombs since a long time. It's like sending soldiers to war with pistols instead of rifles. It will still be a deterrence but how good against a authoritarian regime like China which have killed millions of its own people. We never will use nukes but it's good to have options in worst case scenario. It will greatly help our political leadership in decision making that we also have the means to end China as we know it if comes to that. And that will only happen when politician will themselves see it. it will also put pyschological pressure on China not to extend it to full fledged war and they will think 100 times before firing any ballistic missile against us, which will help greatly us in short skimirsh with them. Afterall we still have some parity with them in tdon't think that 25kt bombs are any deterrence to China. That's all . Also I am in no way saying we should use nukes. And here are some thoughts on our nuclear weapons by our scientists.

Pokhran II not fully successful: Scientist | India News - Times of India

India News: "Yield of the thermonuclear explosions was more a fizzle than a big bang," said K Santhanam, senior scientist and DRDO representative at 1998 Pokhran

m.timesofindia.com

To this day there is a reason we haven't signed ctbt . Read very carefully why this top DRDO scientists have to say

 

[Hiranyaksha]

Sir the intention has been clearly shown by us to china long back . The last and only time any country used nukes was WW2 after that so many wars happened no one bothered to drop that bomb again . Nukes are created as deterrence . USA and Russia built 1000s of nukes to deter each other . Chinese did to deter USA , Pakis created nuke to deter us from our superior conventional force power and for whom did we created nukes and Agni 5 missiles ? not at all for pakis . Those are for chinese more than nuke best would be SLBM test of K-4 or A5 test with extended range that is better message than doing nuke test and getting into sanctions drama

Yep nuclear is for deterrence. But deterrence only comes when we have the proven capability. If experts says that 80 years old nuclear technology is mastered by India and is proven to (by some other, simulation, means) and accepted by world, then yes there is no need to conduct any nuclear test. If not then we need to because sanctions will be off within months and we are anyhow not doing much business in this recession/depression.

 

[Varun2002]

they are already eating up our land since 1962...

Then it's time they got some indigestion.

 

[Hiranyaksha]

I they are already eating up our land since 1962 apart from what they gained during 1962 war.I would say they are doing something in Himalayas.If we cant deal with them in our own backyard and send a message here they will not consider us more than a nusiance in SCS, where they can overpower us, embarrass us with ease and don't expect Quad to help us they are expecting us to help them.

My friend nation boundaries are fluid. They keep changing now and then. We are a civilizational power we have expanded the kingdom from Afghanistan to Indonesia. And now shrunken to the given size and population set to work with. So don't sulk about it now. We need to gain position of power then our sphere of influence can be extended to our neighbours and beyond. Every major disaster presents the opportunity to grab the seat of power. It will be utter foolish of us to let it go.

 

[M.J.K]

But what if India Govt. releases a statement saying that we will deploy in SCS. The PLA will piss in their pants because unlike any other country Indian Navy can also fight with their buffer regiments like Chinese fisher man boats and what not's. US Navy will wait to act on a Asian fishing boat but Indian Navy will send Marcos to secure the boat.

If its a fishing boat they are going to send i agree with your assessment. But why would they send a fishing boat against a warship of ours if they plan to embarrass us and we are not sending fishing boats there.

 

[Bhadra]

The best veteran is one who goes to CSD collects his monthly quota of liquor gulps it and crashes to his sleep they are best they don't have opinion, solution, advice or giving lecture to serving ones.i know one like that who sits in my home and hardly bothers to even discuss about any topics . Last time i tried to get his opinion he said my opinion should only matter when i have power to put them in action once i am retired i have no bloody business in giving opinions on matters i have no authority to act .

Forget Veterans we have new breed in social media called Army brats they keep coming in every topic and push their views and you cant counter them because they fathers served the country . how does that make your views better than someone else just because you have a stamp of armed forces family ? they bring that army brat tag just to push their stupid point of view without it being countered .

A group Iis defined or rather forms around a shred identity interest or goals. The group acts and reacts in a certain manner considering their affinity to a shared or common identity. Veterans and ex-servicemen in that sense is a group even if it is centered around drawing their liquor quota and enjoying that in the evening.
If Doon Schoolboys of St Stephens Boys or a Bengali Society and a Tamil meeting are considered valid groups and entitled to express themselves parochially, Veteran children voicing their concern is not immoral even if they have half-cocked opinion.

In the dynamics of democracy and social mobility, such groups play an important part and can not be decried against. What is most important here is communication and engagement with such groups towards positivity.

Half of the Army still is sustained by these so-called brats otherwise recruitment into Army is not a choice for the sons of bureaucrats, politicians, baniyas and well to do classes.

Just wait and watch, this veterans community is going to be a force to reckon with. Verans will emerge as protectors of values for their serving brothers.

 

[M.J.K]

My friend nation boundaries are fluid. They keep changing now and then. We are a civilizational power we have expanded the kingdom from Afghanistan to Indonesia. And now shrunken to the given size and population set to work with. So don't sulk about it now. We need to gain position of power then our sphere of influence can be extended to our neighbours and beyond. Every major disaster presents the opportunity to grab the seat of power. It will be utter foolish of us to let it go.

I agree with every thing you said friend but how do we grab the seat of power with out kicking the guy who is already ahead of you? he is not going down on his own.We are still punching way below our capacity.

 

[Suryavanshi]

So I guess China Occupying the no mans land is a breach of Equilibrium we had so far.

How come we didn't stop it when the base was being Constructed?

 

[abhay rajput]

So I guess China Occupying the no mans land is a breach of Equilibrium we had so far.

How come we didn't stop it when the base was being Constructed?

They have base since 1999. During Kargil we pulled back troops, they built the road and put a temporary camp at f5.

 

[captscooby81]

What is Macho posturing ? China makes movie on capturing Taiwan and didn't don't it yet does it make their govt macho posturing one ?

The govt projects security and sovereignty also as national goal does that make it macho ?

I read it all mate.

Is this the reason u were pissed off at this government mate?

And also do u think this macho posturing is good if they intend to act on it?

 

[right wing]

It is not made up by me. It came up in multiple media. Please sue them I a court.

Yes and we know the standard of media portals like print,wire,bs and Hindu..being a knowledgeable and respectable man as u are,you may exercise caution while quoting them as this is an open forum and people look upto u.

 

[abhay rajput]

Yep nuclear is for deterrence. But deterrence only comes when we have the proven capability. If experts says that 80 years old nuclear technology is mastered by India and is proven to (by some other, simulation, means) and accepted by world, then yes there is no need to conduct any nuclear test. If not then we need to because sanctions will be off within months and we are anyhow not doing much business in this recession/depression.

Exactly that's what I am saying. It took p5 nations a lot of test to perfect nuclear bombs and people think we can do that in just few test. I mean people should remember that we are still creating 1960s tech like slbm . I personally believe that even NORTH KOREA have more bigger, smaller, and proven bombs.

 

[Hiranyaksha]

I agree with every thing you said friend but how do we grab the seat of power with out kicking the guy who is already ahead of you? he is not going down on his own.We are still punching way below our capacity.

This game of musical chair is not in the stage where only one chair is left to be seated. Which is why everyone is talking about multipolar world.
Second Do you get into punching fight with a bull ? Can you even win a punching game with a bull ? So you never play that game with a bull. Matador goes into the arena with a different objective, that is too awe and capture the praise of the audience by taming a much powerful bull. Chola Kingdom subdued China for ages by capturing Indonesia and hence ensuring Indian dominance.
We have to be creative.

 

[right wing]

A group Iis defined or rather forms around a shred identity interest or goals. The group acts and reacts in a certain manner considering their affinity to a shared or common identity. Veterans and ex-servicemen in that sense is a group even if it is centered around drawing their liquor quota and enjoying that in the evening.
If Doon Schoolboys of St Stephens Boys or a Bengali Society and a Tamil meeting are considered valid groups and entitled to express themselves parochially, Veteran children voicing their concern is not immoral even if they have half-cocked opinion.

In the dynamics of democracy and social mobility, such groups play an important part and can not be decried against. What is most important here is communication and engagement with such groups towards positivity.

Half of the Army still is sustained by these so-called brats otherwise recruitment into Army is not a choice for the sons of bureaucrats, politicians, baniyas and well to do classes.

Just wait and watch, this veterans community is going to be a force to reckon with. Verans will emerge as protectors of values for their serving brothers.

LOL all blaming the others' while conveiniently forgetting the quota the fauji kids get.

 

[WARREN SS]

The keyword here is proven vs unproven. We have proven 25kt bombs. Chinese have proven mt bombs since a long time. It's like sending soldiers to war with pistols instead of rifles. It will still be a deterrence but how good against a authoritarian regime like China which have killed millions of its own people. We never will use nukes but it's good to have options in worst case scenario. It will greatly help our political leadership in decision making that we also have the means to end China as we know it if comes to that. And that will only happen when politician will themselves see it. it will also put pyschological pressure on China not to extend it to full fledged war and they will think 100 times before firing any ballistic missile against us, which will help greatly us in short skimirsh with them. Afterall we still have some parity with them in tdon't think that 25kt bombs are any deterrence to China. That's all . Also I am in no way saying we should use nukes. And here are some thoughts on our nuclear weapons by our scientists.

Pokhran II not fully successful: Scientist | India News - Times of India

India News: "Yield of the thermonuclear explosions was more a fizzle than a big bang," said K Santhanam, senior scientist and DRDO representative at 1998 Pokhran

m.timesofindia.com

To this day there is a reason we haven't signed ctbt . Read very carefully why this top DRDO scientists have to say

Firstly DRDO was not Incharge Of Pohkran

Sanatham was Test site field Engineer not BARC or Atomic Energy Commission and the Department of Atomic energy.

He was Pissed At Kalam And BARC for not given him credit

He was humiliated by Top Brains Rajagopala Chidambaram & Anil Kakodkar on Scientific grounds
when they asked Facts on his claim
Kakodkar ignoring facts on n-tests, says Santhanam

“Figures don’t lie, but liars will figure. He chose to ignore facts for his own reasons,” Mr. Santhanam told PTI when his comments were sought on remarks made by Mr. Kakodkar in a TV interview.

Mr. Kakodkar had said yesterday that DRDO scientists had provided only “logistic support” to the nuclear test and that it would not be correct to assume Mr. Santhanam knew everything, as information was given only on a need-to-know basis.

Kakodkar ignoring facts on n-tests, says Santhanam

Sci-Tech News:Kakodkar ignoring facts on n-tests, says Santhanam

www.thehindu.com

 

[captscooby81]

I would value any day army brat like Major Mariappan saravan or captain Vijayant thapar or Major Vivek Gupta . Than someone like me who is not wearing the uniform and serving the forces . But want to grab his father's rank and file to push his political views or opinions . If I have a point to make on a topic I would do it on my own basis rather throw a point and tag my father's group captain rank to add more value to it . I am pointing to those type of brats . remember That girl with placard who said Pakis didn't kill my father but bullet did ?

I never thrown my father's rank anywhere in my 15 years of career to push a point . Neither I ever did it here in this forum in last 4 years .

It's my father's rank he earned it with his sweat and blood . I have no fucking rights to claim it to push my opinions

A group Iis defined or rather forms around a shred identity interest or goals. The group acts and reacts in a certain manner considering their affinity to a shared or common identity. Veterans and ex-servicemen in that sense is a group even if it is centered around drawing their liquor quota and enjoying that in the evening.
If Doon Schoolboys of St Stephens Boys or a Bengali Society and a Tamil meeting are considered valid groups and entitled to express themselves parochially, Veteran children voicing their concern is not immoral even if they have half-cocked opinion.

In the dynamics of democracy and social mobility, such groups play an important part and can not be decried against. What is most important here is communication and engagement with such groups towards positivity.

Half of the Army still is sustained by these so-called brats otherwise recruitment into Army is not a choice for the sons of bureaucrats, politicians, baniyas and well to do classes.

Just wait and watch, this veterans community is going to be a force to reckon with. Verans will emerge as protectors of values for their serving brothers.