India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[IndianHawk]

LMAO chinkies will end up loosing most of the surplus in 4-5 years.

 

[abhay rajput]

Sorry to barge in.Even if that is the stated reason, why now?I think its just a convenient excuse for them.Objective most likely is something else.

No it's not that simple. You need to create proper plan . We are talking about mountains here . Not a convenient place to drop troops and on top of that they deployed these troops in grey zone such that it will stop indian patrol in future. You need a very good plan which takes a lot of time. I am pretty sure that these are temporary in those harsh conditions but they will make it a new claim based on there position.

 

[captscooby81]

That proves again what Col Dinny said that Indian patrol were mostly upto Finger 5 and the minute they reach that the chinese approach from other side and start the banner drill . Some like Gen Panag were claiming that we were patrolling upto Finger 8 which i think was not the truth . If chinese had built road upto Finger 4 in 1999 where they can easily bring their vehicles how could have we gone for patrol till Finger 7 or Finger 8 . Reasons why we had used foot patrol over the ridges to cross over Finger 5

China basically denied us the access to the ridge and the other fingers with the current deployment


Watch the coupta video from 3.15 he talks about the finger 7 incident of october 2019

No that's not what I meant. I meant that indian patrol's find a new way to patrol bypassing finger 5 area where Chinese have temporary camp directly to the finger 7. . I am pretty sure this standoff is mainly about that. And now they are also objecting to infrastructure development along lac.

 

[IndianHawk]

 

[Hari Sud]

There is the study of belfer centre a think tanks which looks deeply into India china present force deployment and missile attacks.

Can you post it here. Moreover this study should not discourage others from trying to come up with a good scenario...... thank you.

 

[M.J.K]

Can somebody more smart write a fully educated essay on possible Chinese missile attack on our military bases. A good written scenario will suffice. It is speculated and only young people with not much knowledge always speculate that Chinese missile attack on Indian military bases in around LAC would devastate Indian defences.

Is it possible? ....

Do they have missiles smart And accurate enough to reach Indian bases and devastate them. Guess work based on Chinese publications is not accepted. They are copy masters. They love to make copies in large numbers, but copies are not smart enough and accurate enough. Numbers are intimidating but their reliability is always doubtful.

Only a few days back dooms sayers Indian boys were floored when a Chinese military analysts stated that India has 200,000 best trained and equipped mountain troops. How could China conquer such an highly appreciated force. It floored the dooms sayers of the Indian media. Hence I have stopped believing Indian analysts who are serving vested interests.

Please do take up this project Of missile attack. You may immortalize yourself with reliable information. Even the military analysts will welcome this study.

We can start with below baseline .This was written by Mr Doval himself in 2012.I have attached the Pdf too.

 

[M.J.K]

There is the study of belfer centre a think tanks which looks deeply into India china present force deployment and missile attacks.

I think this is the report you are looking for.

 

[janme]

IF this news is true then it proves that BJP is filled with ****** just like congress, instead of giving order to private sector atleast for ULH and completely disbanding the OFB they are AGAIN going for very costly imports through emergency purchase. Who knows if any of the ammunition including PINAKA rockets/AFSPDS rounds manufactured by OFB works. BJP needs to act fast and do the much required reforms, they can't hide behind the excuses anymore of how much one government will do.

 

[cereal killer]

Good news M777 can be the major difference between too armies. It is extremely effective for mountain warfare. I doubt Chinkies have anything remotely close to it.

 

[abhay rajput]

That proves again what Col Dinny said that Indian patrol were mostly upto Finger 5 and the minute they reach that the chinese approach from other side and start the banner drill . Some like Gen Panag were claiming that we were patrolling upto Finger 8 which i think was not the truth . If chinese had built road upto Finger 4 in 1999 where they can easily bring their vehicles how could have we gone for patrol till Finger 7 or Finger 8 . Reasons why we had used foot patrol over the ridges to cross over Finger 5

China basically denied us the access to the ridge and the other fingers with the current deployment


Watch the coupta video from 3.15 he talks about the finger 7 incident of october 2019

I don't trust mr coupta. My old man told me what is happening there.
You can't maintain your presence in those areas all year. There is a reason why till the past 20 years Chinese only have temporary camp there. It's purpose was to block indian patrol beyond finger 5 with banners . What we done last year spooked them quite good. And no general Panag is right in this we do patrol once in a while upto finger 8 and when we do some type of standoff happened . So we do that in winters.. when Chinese aren't there at finget 5. They come from finger 8 ... Now we have find a new way to patrol directly to the finger 7 bypassing there temporary camps basically meaning we can patrol upto finger 7 even in summer where Chinese are present at finger 5. That's one of the key reason why this time they come to some top of the mountains and are sitting there. That's pretty much sums up this stand-off.

 

[cereal killer]

IF this news is true then it proves that BJP is filled with ****** just like congress, instead of giving order to private sector atleast for ULH and completely disbanding the OFB they are AGAIN going for very costly imports through emergency purchase. Who knows if any of the ammunition including PINAKA rockets/AFSPDS rounds manufactured by OFB works. BJP needs to act fast and do the much required reforms, they can't hide behind the excuses anymore of how much one government will do.

When shit hits the fan you go for best possible substitute. The reforms will happen but at this moment it is all about national security. I am sure some domestic artillery procurement will already have been ordered by now in case GOI is sure China is preparing for war.

 

[another_armchair]

Here is a study on Scud missile launches by Iraq on Israel and coalition targets in Saudi Arabia during Gulf War - 1.

IRAQ’S USE OF SCUDS DURING OPERATION DESERT STORM

Between claims of 81 and 97 Scud missile attacks, the damage is minimal barring for one attack which killed 28 US troops and injured a little over 100.
Multiple sources claim the casualties were caused by a Patriot strike which resulted in debris scattering over the area causing casualties otherwise the Scud could have harmlessly flown over the area missing the purported target.

Iran's recent missile attacks on US targets in Iraq achieved little.

A simple study of warhead type(conventional/nuclear), blast radius etc would give us an understanding of how effective their missile attacks could be.

A regular 155 mm arty shell has approximately 6-7 kg of explosives. Air bursts cause maximum damage to troops and thin armor.

Targets in Saudi and Iraq were flat land.

Would be interesting what PLA throws at Indian positions. Arty and ballistic missile attacks would be less dangerous than saturation fire by 122mm rocket artillery with ranges of 20-50 km. Well, we wouldn't be sitting on our hinds either, would we?

The Chinese have grabbed heights this time which is considered a defensive position. If they refuse to vacate those areas which India claims as disputed/Indian territory, it will be a redux of Kargil and IA will have to use precision Arty shells like Excalibur, Krasnopol or good old LGBs or whatever the IAF picks for the mission if at all it comes to that.

 

[mokoman]

IF this news is true then it proves that BJP is filled with ****** just like congress, instead of giving order to private sector atleast for ULH and completely disbanding the OFB they are AGAIN going for very costly imports through emergency purchase. Who knows if any of the ammunition including PINAKA rockets/AFSPDS rounds manufactured by OFB works. BJP needs to act fast and do the much required reforms, they can't hide behind the excuses anymore of how much one government will do.

Seems to be SOP Of indian gov , regardless of political party.

Didnt same thing happened after Feb IAF - PAF engagement .

 

[patriots]

Unbelievable....................................

 

[another_armchair]

Seems to be SOP Of indian gov , regardless of political party.

Didnt same thing happened after Feb IAF - PAF engagement .

Govt. means MoD.

MoD means Bureaucracy.

How many wardi wallahs in MoD procurement and decision making?

In the end, the pen of the Babu decides what weapon our forces takes to battle.

I would love to see a few MoD babus tied to tank turrets as Arjun, T-90's and T-72's roar across the deserts of Rajasthan and Ladakh.

 

[yoggs]

This is the reason India informed US, Russia, Israel, Japan and Vietnam about LAC crisis.

Can understand US, Russia and Israel for weapons. But Japan and Vietnam, to use their Ports?

 

[WARREN SS]

Unbelievable....................................

Best id True If We Can Lease 20-30 Chinooks under new DPP

 

[scatterStorm]

I was wondering, how does high altitude impact small arms ballistics and such?

Adding more to what @Bhadra said, high altitude have less dense atmosphere, low oxygen too, so chemical based weapon will have slight loss of KE performances. However conventional gravity based warheads will just work fine, like mortar shells, HE rounds etc.

Brahmos will be less effective due to it being cruise missile. Cruise missiles don't go into ballistic trajectory. Hence we would require Parlay, Prahar or its new variant Pranash CRBMs.

 

[Bhadra]

It once again time to refer back to my post 4089.

This is an indication if true.. big indication that :
* India is absolutely firm on their demand that Chinese restore status quo to Apr 2020. Nothing less/
* Indication that Chinese are not ready to pull back.
* Indication that LAC is not the real issue but the issue is something else and the Chinese are determined to use their military as an instrument of coercion in attaining a diplomatic goal.
* If LAC be the issue then it is related to CCP declared gaol of securing all their national territories and boundaries by 2021. Then the Chinese will attempt to coerce India militarily to accept present LAC as boundry. That can only happen if India loses more territory consequent to military action and then accept the present LAC as boundry on the negotiation table.

* This objective could make the Chinese think of repeating 1962 model - quick intense and swift assault using mechanised forces in Ladakh while holding Indian Forces in East and Sikkim. Offensive in Ladakh gives China additional advantages on pressurising India on the issue of GB and CPEC.

* The aim and purpose could also be to halt any anticipated Indian offensive into GB and to protect their more than 100bn investment of CPEC.

*

 

[captscooby81]

First thing take this news with truck load of salt . M777A ordered which we placed only 29 guns have been delievered so far now who is going to deliver another 100 M777A guns in a month time ? Unless US Army transfers guns from its reserve storage ? is that going to happen ? Plus these 10k Excalibur rounds were the old order placed before i think may be GOI would have requested to fast track the delivery

Indian private industry is nothing great than our babudom rigged DPSU they are always work lethargic only and expecting them to deliver orders in next one month when they are still stuck in corona lockdown is highly unrealistic .

IF this news is true then it proves that BJP is filled with ****** just like congress, instead of giving order to private sector atleast for ULH and completely disbanding the OFB they are AGAIN going for very costly imports through emergency purchase. Who knows if any of the ammunition including PINAKA rockets/AFSPDS rounds manufactured by OFB works. BJP needs to act fast and do the much required reforms, they can't hide behind the excuses anymore of how much one government will do.