India China LAC & International Border Discussions

[ezsasa]

First, what is the accuracy of their MLRS? Normal ballistic missiles with INS still have a rough accuracy of 40-80m CEP (And that means 50% probability missile will fall within the radius of 40-80 from target).

And that is the reason, artillery is always used in barrages, to increase the probability of shells/missiles landing on the correct target.

However, in the mountains, 80m offset means a huge distance and can mean more than 160 mtrs away.
Plus, mountain acts as a natural barrier, offering numerous natural bunkers/shelters in form of terrain, rocks, and crevices.

Steep valleys of Ladakh are very difficult to accurately target with artillery unless it has a top-down approach like cruise missile BrahMos.


But wait, don't just fall for the heavily exaggerated figure of range just yet!
Let's look at the claimed rocket first.

PCL 191

Notice the length of the missile ~ 6-7m.

Now look at BM-30 Smerch, Soviet MLRS

Length of the missile - 7.2m, thickness - 0.3m, range ~ 70-90km, warhead - 243kg.

Indian Prahaar missile -

Length of the missile - 7.3m, thickness - 0.42m, range ~ 150km, warhead - 200kg.

Now look at PC-191 claimed range - 350 km for a thickness of 0.35m.

Which means Prahaar has 35% more fuel space than PC-191 but has less than half the range of PC-191?

So, either PC-191 is carrying a grenade as a warhead, or this is just Chinese propaganda.

PCL-191 can fire eight 370 mm or two 750 mm.

China’s Massive New Rocket Artillery System Could Devastate Taiwan

While failing to make headlines as larger and more strategic Chinese weapons systems have, the DF-41 ballistic missile being a prime example, the People’s Liberation

militarywatchmagazine.com

 

[mokoman]

First, what is the accuracy of their MLRS? Normal ballistic missiles with INS still have a rough accuracy of 40-80m CEP (And that means 50% probability missile will fall within the radius of 40-80 from target).

And that is the reason, artillery is always used in barrages, to increase the probability of shells/missiles landing on the correct target.

However, in the mountains, 80m offset means a huge distance and can mean more than 160 mtrs away.
Plus, mountain acts as a natural barrier, offering numerous natural bunkers/shelters in form of terrain, rocks, and crevices.

Steep valleys of Ladakh are very difficult to accurately target with artillery unless it has a top-down approach like cruise missile BrahMos.


But wait, don't just fall for the heavily exaggerated figure of range just yet!
Let's look at the claimed rocket first.

PCL 191

Notice the length of the missile ~ 6-7m.

Now look at BM-30 Smerch, Soviet MLRS

Length of the missile - 7.2m, thickness - 0.3m, range ~ 70-90km, warhead - 243kg.

Indian Prahaar missile -

Length of the missile - 7.3m, thickness - 0.42m, range ~ 150km, warhead - 200kg.

Now look at PC-191 claimed range - 350 km for a thickness of 0.35m.

Which means Prahaar has 35% more fuel space than PC-191 but has less than half the range of PC-191?

So, either PC-191 is carrying a grenade as a warhead, or this is just Chinese propaganda.

Like you said ,

"MRL are still rarely able to properly shoot at rear slope positions in mountain warfare because the MRL crew cannot determine the trajectory as well as a howitzer's crew can do by adding or removing propellents increments."

from

The Modern Weaponry of the World’s Armed Forces

The Modern Weaponry of the World’s Armed Forces is a treatise of military weaponry. It depicts about fortypresent-day weapon systems possessed by various nations, describingthreeto fourweapons of each category with images, specifications, origin, development and design briefly. The weapon...

books.google.co.in

 

[AMCA]

Rajya Sabha TV interview of CTA President
@Drlobsangsangay
will be telecast on Tuesday at 10pm, and 11.30 AM on Wednesday.
The head of the Tibetan Gov't in Exile, Dr. Lobsang Sangay, does regular interviews with the press. But it's noteworthy that this one was conducted by India's state-owned media.

 

[ezsasa]

Rajya Sabha TV interview of CTA President
@Drlobsangsangay
will be telecast on Tuesday at 10pm, and 11.30 AM on Wednesday.
The head of the Tibetan Gov't in Exile, Dr. Lobsang Sangay, does regular interviews with the press. But it's noteworthy that this one was conducted by India's state-owned media.

India's road to Aksai chin goes thru Free Tibet.

 

[IndianHawk]

The fear of China has put the global spotlight on India ⁠⁠— its raked up three Comprehensive Strategic Partnerships in the last 24 months | Business Insider India

India has elevated its bilateral ties with Indonesia, the US, and most recently, with Australia to the level of a Comprehensive Strategic Partnership in the past 24 months.The anti-China sentiment has pushed India into the spotlight especially with the its border dispute along the Line of Actual...

www.businessinsider.in

 

[IndianHawk]

The fear of China has put the global spotlight on India ⁠⁠— its raked up three Comprehensive Strategic Partnerships in the last 24 months | Business Insider India

India has elevated its bilateral ties with Indonesia, the US, and most recently, with Australia to the level of a Comprehensive Strategic Partnership in the past 24 months.The anti-China sentiment has pushed India into the spotlight especially with the its border dispute along the Line of Actual...

www.businessinsider.in

Good for us . More comprehensive partnerships. More port access . More bilateral multilateral excersices. And gradually more arms export.

 

[ninja hattori]

any day palki wins the best roaster award ..

 

[ninja hattori]

and here it goes the old roast of there seven sins video

old still gold

 

[aghamarshana]

Rajya Sabha TV interview of CTA President
@Drlobsangsangay
will be telecast on Tuesday at 10pm, and 11.30 AM on Wednesday.
The head of the Tibetan Gov't in Exile, Dr. Lobsang Sangay, does regular interviews with the press. But it's noteworthy that this one was conducted by India's state-owned media.

India's road to Aksai chin goes thru Free Tibet.

What do you infer from this? Do explain ur observations.

 

[doreamon]

Asking as a layman- why wouldn't cheaper options like Akash or Nag/Pinaka etc be as effective in these areas?

Akash is air defence missile.. Nag anti tank. They r nt MRL

 

[IndianHawk]

and here it goes the old roast of there seven sins video

old still gold

They really went all out on doklam. It was painful to watch them humiliate themselves. Lol.
This time they are playing it safe until now.

 

[Karthi]

First, what is the accuracy of their MLRS? Normal ballistic missiles with INS still have a rough accuracy of 40-80m CEP (And that means 50% probability missile will fall within the radius of 40-80 from target).

And that is the reason, artillery is always used in barrages, to increase the probability of shells/missiles landing on the correct target.

However, in the mountains, 80m offset means a huge distance and can mean more than 160 mtrs away.
Plus, mountain acts as a natural barrier, offering numerous natural bunkers/shelters in form of terrain, rocks, and crevices.

Steep valleys of Ladakh are very difficult to accurately target with artillery unless it has a top-down approach like cruise missile BrahMos.


But wait, don't just fall for the heavily exaggerated figure of range just yet!
Let's look at the claimed rocket first.

PCL 191

Notice the length of the missile ~ 6-7m.

Now look at BM-30 Smerch, Soviet MLRS

Length of the missile - 7.2m, thickness - 0.3m, range ~ 70-90km, warhead - 243kg.

Indian Prahaar missile -

Length of the missile - 7.3m, thickness - 0.42m, range ~ 150km, warhead - 200kg.

Now look at PC-191 claimed range - 350 km for a thickness of 0.35m.

Which means Prahaar has 35% more fuel space than PC-191 but has less than half the range of PC-191?

So, either PC-191 is carrying a grenade as a warhead, or this is just Chinese propaganda.

I don't interested in excuses like this , what if Chinese claims are true , These Artilleries can diffuse a wide swath of land , CEP is 80 or 100 they can damage our assets beyond imagination . This attitude is the sole reason we are still lagging in fire power . Instead of excuses we should bring quality Weapons to counter Chinese .

 

[WARREN SS]

I don't interested in excuses like this , what if Chinese claims are true , These Artilleries can diffuse a wide swath of land , CEP is 80 or 100 they can damage our assets beyond imagination . This attitude is the sole reason we are still lagging in fire power . Instead of excuses we should bring quality Weapons to counter Chinese .

How Many Is Operational ??Have u checked

As Far I know Its Just Introduced Last year in dec

China's new rocket launcher system is its most powerful ever, and it's looming over the Taiwan Strait

'Mystery' hardware that appeared during China's National Day parade in October may be the PLA's most powerful multiple launch rocket system ever.

www.businessinsider.com

We actually Have Weapon in Same Category Like Prahaar or Pragati

 

[tarunraju]

Rajya Sabha TV interview of CTA President
@Drlobsangsangay
will be telecast on Tuesday at 10pm, and 11.30 AM on Wednesday.
The head of the Tibetan Gov't in Exile, Dr. Lobsang Sangay, does regular interviews with the press. But it's noteworthy that this one was conducted by India's state-owned media.

This is really a holy shit moment. RSTV is by definition not a government mouthpiece, since it's run by the RS (where this govt lacks a majority). The VP may be a BJP-wallah, but RSTV has an all-party editorial oversight. Therefore if RSTV is able to come out with content like this, it indicates that the Indian polity is heading toward a wartime political consensus. So the moment there are real hostilities, the RS will cooperate in matters such as Declaration of War, Declaration of Emergency, Constitution of War Cabinet, War Chest, etc.

Man, Modi is really gearing up for a 2-front war. A formal declaration of war means Modi has the legal power to nationalize and mobilize any asset toward the war effort (this wasn't needed in limited wars such as Kargil).

 

[ezsasa]

What do you infer from this? Do explain ur observations.

No inference. Just a wish..... FREE TIBET....

 

[Varun2002]

NewsX TV, which is a pro-Dharmic channel, has a very good feature today( June 8th/2020) on India's border with China, which should really be a border with Tibet.
Rishabh Gulati is an excellent anchor and commentator for the channel.

 

[garg_bharat]

India should be ready for the worst. China is making moves all around and not only on India's borders. We are seeing a China that everybody hoped will never come to pass but has. My view is that war is the likely outcome. What happens after war cannot be easily predicted now.

If India has to face China alone then it is a bad situation definitely. However if West helps then it may not be so bad. India will need recon assets of West as well as weapons to counter this. India does have manpower.

 

[Bhadra]

EXIT THE DRAGON : ENTER AMIT SHAH



Amit Shah, Rajnath Singh talk tough, say India won’t bow to ..​

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

NEW DELHI: Amid a tense stand-off with China, two members of the Cabinet Committee on Security-home minister Amit Shah and defence minister Rajnath Singh-on Monday asserted India wouldn't give into muscle-flexing by China to grab land in the Ladakh sector.
The ministers, while addressing virtual rallies of BJP workers, said India would make no concessions to anyone at the cost of its national interest and national pride.
Shah struck a combative note and said India, like the US and Israel, had the capability to carry out pre-emptive strikes to defend its territory as he recalled India's action across the LoC in retaliation to terror attacks in Uri and Pulwama.
"We've also seen terrorist attacks like it used to happen earlier, but PM Modi did not sit silent like previous PMs. He answered with air strikes and surgical strikes by entering Pakistan and teaching them a lesson. "This showed the world that India will not endure encroachment of its borders," Amit Shah said while addressing party workers of Odisha.
Rajnath Singh asserted that any bid to hurt the dignity and sovereignty of the country would not be tolerated
*****************



Rahul Gandhi

@RahulGandhi
https://twitter.com/RahulGandhi/status/1269841585325268992

सब को मालूम है ‘सीमा’ की हक़ीक़त लेकिन,
दिल के ख़ुश रखने को, ‘शाह-यद’ ये ख़्याल अच्छा है।https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1269587598302797824?s=20 …

ANI

@ANI

 

[Shashank Nayak]

EXIT THE DRAGON : ENTER AMIT SHAH



Amit Shah, Rajnath Singh talk tough, say India won’t bow to ..​

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

NEW DELHI: Amid a tense stand-off with China, two members of the Cabinet Committee on Security-home minister Amit Shah and defence minister Rajnath Singh-on Monday asserted India wouldn't give into muscle-flexing by China to grab land in the Ladakh sector.
The ministers, while addressing virtual rallies of BJP workers, said India would make no concessions to anyone at the cost of its national interest and national pride.
Shah struck a combative note and said India, like the US and Israel, had the capability to carry out pre-emptive strikes to defend its territory as he recalled India's action across the LoC in retaliation to terror attacks in Uri and Pulwama.
"We've also seen terrorist attacks like it used to happen earlier, but PM Modi did not sit silent like previous PMs. He answered with air strikes and surgical strikes by entering Pakistan and teaching them a lesson. "This showed the world that India will not endure encroachment of its borders," Amit Shah said while addressing party workers of Odisha.
Rajnath Singh asserted that any bid to hurt the dignity and sovereignty of the country would not be tolerated
*****************


Rahul Gandhi
@RahulGandhi

सब को मालूम है ‘सीमा’ की हक़ीक़त लेकिन,
दिल के ख़ुश रखने को, ‘शाह-यद’ ये ख़्याल अच्छा है।https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1269587598302797824?s=20 …
ANI
@ANI

Bhadra bole Mota Bhai qyun statement nahi de raha... Mota bhai ne baat sun li, aur air strike ki dhamki de di...

 

[Bhadra]

Bhadra bole Mota Bhai qyun statement nahi de raha... Mota bhai ne baat sun li, aur air strike ki dhamki de di...

Mota Bhai must address issues that are under MHA and not under MoD.
Mota Bhai must answer why LAC is with ITBP and how and Why ITBP has failed to preempt such big Chinese intrusion..?
Thirdly. he must clarify what is the status of the India China border and why should MHA be managing that border in peacetime ??
What is "peace" on that border... how is it "peace" time when the enemy can grab whatever he wants and keep it. How can that be prevented by "policing" it.