India-China Border conflict

[mist_consecutive]

@mist_consecutive are our current tanks enough to beat type 99s? Any info on the type 99 is quite polarising

No, both in quality and quantity. If open-source and other tank experts are to be believed, Type 99 is a solid tank, on paper at least. It outclasses T-90 in almost every field.

Their cyberwarfare capacity and capability both exceed ours .

And that conclusion is based on what? 50-cent troll bot army reputation? They were not able to stop Galwan casualties' truth from spreading and had to arrest citizens. We thought bad news won't be able to penetrate Chinese firewalls.

I will say it again. Cyber-warfare is overrated.

Regarding IAF capability they don't have major advantage as you suggested China don't need to employ 30 sqd against us .

We can utilise our airbases yes but We always have pressure from PAF and we barely have 30 sqd right now. China is rightly equipping them with J 10 eyeing us.

They have their own strategy to balance things out.

For an absolute advantage preparation need to be done before the war not expecting this and that will help us out. We saw what happened to Ukraine hoping the same.

Unless Pakistan and China establish a stronger supply chain (which is quite difficult, if not improbable), and China takes the helm of feeding Pakistan with critical resources while it fights us, Pakistan won't survive one week into full-fledged warfare.

 

[mokoman]

India's ATGMs are mainly 9M111 and 9M113, which are laser semi-active guidance. For the current major Chinese armored vehicles, they are equipped with laser warning equipment, which can determine the incoming direction of ATGM, release smoke, and align the turret front. attack direction
At the same time, 99A also has a laser countermeasure device, which can make this second-generation anti-tank missile directly blind.

india has wire guided ATGM as well .

everything is great on paper . russian tanks have these well , doesnt seem to have protected them against even Ukrainian ATGMS

i think like the Russians , Chinese significantly overestimate their own capability . withdrawal at pangong tso F4 , being just an example

 

[mist_consecutive]

I have a question, why do you think the existence of the plateau will only be bad for China, as you said, there are fewer airports in China, and the aircraft take-off load on the plateau is lower,
But there are many better effects for China
1 The existence of plateaus greatly increases the range of air defense missiles. Air defense missiles usually spend a lot of energy on climbing heights, and the existence of plateaus can solve this problem.
2. Since most of the Himalayas are on the Chinese side, China can build the radar station on the top of the Himalayas, thereby reducing the influence of the curvature of the earth and achieving a better detection range, while on the Indian side, due to the existence of high mountains, it is difficult to see behind the mountains. Case,
India needs to send a small number of its own early warning aircraft to the front line to solve this problem, but it has to face the threat of China's long-range BVR, such as the 300KM PL21

Are you Chinese, or perhaps from the land of goat-lovers ? You seem to be out of touch with reality.

First, I said nothing about take-off load.

How many airports does China have close to LAC ? Around 5-7 if I include airports being built in 2-3 years in future aswell. We have 20+ fighter-capable airports with HAS, not including landing strips and ALGs.

With the lack of airports in Tibet, China's fighter operational areas and range will be greatly restricted, amplified by the fact that it lacks A2A refuellers aswell.

Chinese airforce still operates old Soviet-style, guided and mission-controlled by ground controllers, and more like an extension of its behemoth army. Its doctrines are outdated and lack global training or war exposure.

 

[Jimih]

Are you Chinese, or perhaps from the land of goat-lovers ? You seem to be out of touch with reality.

First, I said nothing about take-off load.

How many airports does China have close to LAC ? Around 5-7 if I include airports being built in 2-3 years in future aswell. We have 20+ fighter-capable airports with HAS, not including landing strips and ALGs.

With the lack of airports in Tibet, China's fighter operational areas and range will be greatly restricted, amplified by the fact that it lacks A2A refuellers aswell.

Chinese airforce still operates old Soviet-style, guided and mission-controlled by ground controllers, and more like an extension of its behemoth army. Its doctrines are outdated and lack global training or war exposure.

Chinese CCP bot for sure.

 

[mist_consecutive]

Anyone knows the location?

Depsang Plateau.

 

[prasadr14]

Wire guide ATGM? What model? TOW?
Unless it is a thermal imaging guided missile,
Russia's main force, T72B3, T80UD, and T80BVM, do not have laser warning equipment.
And Russia's problem is that tanks are not advanced enough?
No, the lack of C4ISR system construction,
Insufficient synthesis of troops,
The level of information technology is not enough.
That's Russia's biggest problem. That's why I said that the 99A is equipped with a battlefield surveillance system and a data sharing system.
And this is what the Indian army lacks the most.

Your whole premise is wrong.
India will not attack China.
Let me rephrase that, we will not go to war with China, instead we will do what we are best at. Engaging Chinks like we engage Pakis. Sniper attacks, cut heads and bring them back etc etc. We are pretty good at it and we can keep that tactic going for decades - for proof, look at our western border.

Chinkis on the other hand have a lot to prove. Their ardent internet supporters think they can smash India under an hour.
So, any battle plan you make must consider the scenario of China attacking India.

So, please go ahead and explain how in the world would China India, where and with what?

 

[mokoman]

Wire guide ATGM? What model? TOW?
Unless it is a thermal imaging guided missile,
Russia's main force, T72B3, T80UD, and T80BVM, do not have laser warning equipment.
And Russia's problem is that tanks are not advanced enough?
No, the lack of C4ISR system construction,
Insufficient synthesis of troops,
The level of information technology is not enough.
That's Russia's biggest problem. That's why I said that the 99A is equipped with a battlefield surveillance system and a data sharing system.
And this is what the Indian army lacks the most.

Insufficient synthesis of troops,
The level of information technology is not enough.

i think ur fooled by chinese military PR vids.

all that drone / sat / outpost survillance and u couldnt detect indian army moving to capture peaks around the pangong tso india-china border . didnt occur to ur generails that such a possibility would exist .

all this talk of battle field superiority only exist on paper and PLA military vids .

 

[mist_consecutive]

First of all, I am Chinese

Alright, you get one decent reply from me then.

The first question is that there are fewer airports in China than in India.
In terms of two parts, first of all, the eastern front Aksai Chin, India's airport actually undertakes the combat readiness task for northern Pakistan and the combat readiness task for China, which means that India faces pressure from two directions during the war, Secondly, on the west line to the south of Tibet, what India needs to consider is not only the airport in Tibet, but also a large number of airports in Sichuan and Yunnan.
That is to say, the advantage of more airports in India is not obvious. Of course, after 2020, China is also building a large number of airports.

Tracking China's Sudden Airpower Expansion On Its Western Border

Satellite images raise concerns over Beijing's incredible pace of expansion of its airpower infrastructure along its western flank.

www.thedrive.com

Northern Pakistan has only one airport, Skardu (which is actually much west of LAC ), and it falls under the jurisdiction of Srinagar AFB (western side ). It won't tip the air power balance of LAC.

By both directions of the war, if you mean 2-front war (i.e., more local players jumping into the war). you will need to consider the USA, France, and Britain sending their CBGs to the Arabian Sea to finish off Pakistani airpower (which at that point, is just Chinese mercenary airforce).

Second, South-western Chinese airbases (Sichuan and Yunnan Provinces), are a good 1000km away from India, and that too by crossing over Myanmar.

After the 2020s, China is building 3 more airports and upgrading the existing ones. That will still be inadequate, however.

The second question is relatively simple. The problem of the Chinese Air Force. Anyone who knows a little about PLAAF knows the military reform of the Chinese Air Force after 2012.
PLAAF is no longer a weakened version of the Soviet Air Force
Of course, I think the use of Soviet long-range aviation still has a high learning value

PLAAF Senior Pilot Reveals Poor Performance in Joint Exercise With RTAF | AIN

A report details the performance of PLAAF aircraft in Falcon Strike 2015.

www.ainonline.com

Thaliand is not really a military power, a relatively peaceful country with a hobby military. India got relatively more experience, an active conflict zone, multitude of different aerial platforms and frequent exercises with top military powers.

If you don't believe it, you can go to the annual US State Department China military assessment report

Ain't nobody got time to read a 200 page document. Show me exerpts and highlights if you want a counter.

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

In Indo China conflict, India will get unequivocal support from west. China will not get unequivocal support from anyone except pakistan.

We can fight the long war. West will be more than happy to hand out old shelved equipment free or at steep discounts. Our strategy against pak is to be quick and decisive, and against china is to be slow, draggy, defensive. Let them bleed themselves trying to march in.

 

[Automatic Kalashnikov]

In Indo China conflict, India will get unequivocal support from west. China will not get unequivocal support from anyone except pakistan.

We can fight the long war. West will be more than happy to hand out old shelved equipment free or at steep discounts. Our strategy against pak is to be quick and decisive, and against china is to be slow, draggy, defensive. Let them bleed themselves trying to march in.

Equipment like what?

 

[ym888]

In Indo China conflict, India will get unequivocal support from west. China will not get unequivocal support from anyone except pakistan.

We can fight the long war. West will be more than happy to hand out old shelved equipment free or at steep discounts. Our strategy against pak is to be quick and decisive, and against china is to be slow, draggy, defensive. Let them bleed themselves trying to march in.

In fact,

Militarily India has to face Pakistan first

 

[mist_consecutive]

In fact,

Militarily India has to face Pakistan first

Yeah, and ? You worried our boots will get dirty ?

 

[Covfefe]

In fact,

Militarily India has to face Pakistan first

In fact,

You haven't understood your Western Xinjiang slaves well enough. They won't get into a war for you, and will stab you in the back for dollars any day. Dasu dam, remember?

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

Equipment like what?

Carl gustavs. 155mm rounds. 105 mm rounds. ATGMs. Drones. Anti drone systems. Its a long list.

And if we are lucky, more advanced systems as well, depending on how GoI plays it. Could mean things like older fighters (mirages), or even things like shelved f-16s if war goes on for > 1 year, which allows training of pilots on those platforms. FA18s if we go for those in naval operations, they can be trained here itself then.


Non tangible things as well, Intel, IW, drawing forces away with force deployments on the other side, sanctions, covert ops.

 

[gajapati]

In Indo China conflict, India will get unequivocal support from west. China will not get unequivocal support from anyone except pakistan.

We can fight the long war. West will be more than happy to hand out old shelved equipment free or at steep discounts. Our strategy against pak is to be quick and decisive, and against china is to be slow, draggy, defensive. Let them bleed themselves trying to march in.

Indo china border is the worst place to show military superiority given the topography ... Specially against a major power like india which can throw 400 thousands soldiers , armor brigades and activate 300 fighter jets at will .. using those low flying jaguars as land attack fighter jets dropping cluster bombs .. There was lots of talks on ATGMS in internet in recent Ukraine war .. Well.. indian army had 80 thousand ATGMs as per open source infos in 2010.. now they are showing requirement of more 50 thousands ... You cant win throwing barrage of rockets and ballistics .. There is no easy win ...

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

Indo china border is the worst place to show military superiority given the topography ... Specially against a major power like india which can throw 400 thousands soldiers , armor brigades and activate 300 fighter jets at will .. using those low flying jaguars as land attack fighter jets dropping cluster bombs .. There was lots of talks on ATGMS in internet in recent Ukraine war .. Well.. indian army had 80 thousand ATGMs as per open source infos in 2010.. now they are showing requirement of more 50 thousands ... You cant win throwing barrage of rockets and ballistics .. There is no easy win ...

400k is lowball number lol. India also has massive reserves. Total capacity is 35-40 lakhs, without new civillian volunteer recruits.Even assuming need for troops on IB and LOC, it is still a ton.

Also, No need to use jags for it. HTT MK2 coming, 7 hardpoints and purpose built for ground attack.

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

I think you should look at authoritative reports, not some obscure tabloids

Flankers vs Gripens: What Happened at the Falcon Strike 2015 Exercise?

A Chinese test pilot’s lecture in December 2019 about the exercise sparked renewed discussion over the details.

thediplomat.com

Due to its non-alignment policy, India has gained a lot of foreign exchange opportunities, but this does not mean that IAF is stronger than PLAAF

Dissecting a dogfight: Sukhoi vs USAF at Red Flag 2008

Contrary to the USAF view of how Exercise Red Flag 2008 panned out, the Su-30MKI made a stellar debut in American airspace.

www.rbth.com

I have no idea how the articles attached are relevant to the points you are trying to make. Did you just randomly attach articles to make your points seem more credible?

 

[ym888]

In fact,

You haven't understood your Western Xinjiang slaves well enough. They won't get into a war for you, and will stab you in the back for dollars any day. Dasu dam, remember?

No, I respect Pakistan army, I did not say Pakistan fought for China.

I mean India and Pakistan are more combustible and prone to war.

I don't think there will be a war between China and India

I think China is very secure militarily,

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

No, I respect Pakistan army, I did not say Pakistan fought for China.

I mean India and Pakistan are more combustible and prone to war.

I don't think there will be a war between China and India

I think China is very secure militarily,

And? I dont think India will have much trouble in a war with pak.

 

[ym888]

And? I dont think India will have much trouble in a war with pak.

the last time India and Pakistan fought an air war was three years ago