Skirmishs at LOC, LAC & International Border

[sthf]

We buy Rafales at $100 million a pop but can't afford to buy a frikkin good sniper rifle... or for that matter even $200 helmets!

Afford - Yes

Want to - No

Not enough malai in these small procurement for Army and MOD.

 

[WARREN SS]

Dragunov is thoroughly outdated rifle in 2017. Modern assault rifles are more accurate than Dragunov.

This is a symptom of a much deeper malaise. Second largest Army in the world doesn't have a dedicated sniper program and is using decades old semi automatic DMR like some Iraqi or Syrian militia.

Don't How Dragnov SVD (indian version) is out dated Its Effectively used By Russian military in large Numbers


DMR vs AMR is Another debate

I still prefer Semi-auto Dmr Over bolt action It makes more casualty

It Was army brass Which rejected NTW -20

But there Really better Alternative available for DMR nowdays

BUT I want replace It With My personal favorite
Alexander Arms Ulfberht semi auto

 

[Kchontha]

That was BSF Jawan from Rajouri Sector who was sniped yesterday, this one is today's incident in Poonch.

My heart ached to hear these types of news. RIP jawan. And I have been hearing these sort of things for the past years.

How good are pakistani snipers? It seems like that they give us maximum damage

At the moment it seems like porkies snipers are at upper hand at the moment in terms of training and equipments. It also seems like they have a dedicated, well equipped and well trained sniper unit among the BAT team.

Dragonov is Pretty Decent Rifle in LOC Post are hardly 400-500 meters away. BSF has NTW-20 in its inventory some use Barett as well

Modern sniping engagement is not done in 400-500 meters distance with DMR like Dragunov and galatz. Gone are the days of 7.62 sniper rifles.
Nowadays millinery snipers tend to be employed at the greatest possible distances so that range advantages like increased difficulty to spot and engage the sniper can be exploited.
A new trend in military sniping is about equipping the snipers with larger caliber that offer relatively favourable hit probabilities at greater range, such as the anti personnel .339 lapua magnum or 8.6. This will allow the sniper to take fewer risks, and spend less time finding concealment when facing enemies that are not equipped with similar weapons.

 

[sum1]

How good are pakistani snipers? It seems like that they give us maximum damage

Why the assumption that Pakis also arent being sniped down?

We definitely wont get any news from their end on this and IA definitely wont comment on these matters too

 

[Vijyes]

We buy Rafales at $100 million a pop but can't afford to buy a frikkin good sniper rifle... or for that matter even $200 helmets!

There was a discussion a few days ago on the topic. I feel we haven't invested in good sniper rifles, because of the lack of a proper training school, which should be given impetus asap.

Dragunov is thoroughly outdated rifle in 2017. Modern assault rifles are more accurate than Dragunov.

This is a symptom of a much deeper malaise. Second largest Army in the world doesn't have a dedicated sniper program and is using decades old semi automatic DMR like some Iraqi or Syrian militia.

Sniper rifles have not advanced much as snipers require bolt action rifle. The precision of rifles was very high even in WW2 days. Rifles are simple tools and it has already saturated. Since, bolt action rifle is a must to avoid unnecessary moving parts and hence not affect accuracy, there is little scope to improve.

If the firing is from the bunkers itself, then normally 50BMG will be used. But field snipers will find such 50BMG rifles to be heavy.

 

[WARREN SS]

Modern sniping engagement is not done in 400-500 meters distance with DMR like Dragunov and galatz. Gone are the days of 7.62 sniper rifles.
Nowadays millinery snipers tend to be employed at the greatest possible distances so that range advantages like increased difficulty to spot and engage the sniper can be exploited.
A new trend in military sniping is about equipping the snipers with larger caliber that offer relatively favourable hit probabilities at greater range, such as the anti personnel .339 lapua magnum or 8.6. This will allow the sniper to take fewer risks, and spend less time finding concealment when facing enemies that are not equipped with similar weapons.

Army Has NTW-20 for tha role In limited numbers

BSF have more than 1000 +
BSF also known to use Barret Now days

 

[sthf]

Don't How Dragnov SVD (indian version) is out dated Its Effectively used By Russian military in large Numbers

Russian military is also planning to replace the same in large numbers. Russia uses it as a DMR and has a very effective sniper program.

India has none.

But we are missing the topic here so let's continue it some other time.

 

[Bornubus]

AHH... ISPR has tried their ass best to show " WOW, MASHALLAH KAFIRO KI MAUT,ALLAH HU AKABR" Types video but the fact is that our Boys are ok and all hearty and nothing much in terms of damage has taken place. Multiple angles zoomed in footage i shall reply to all this sweetly with my new upcoming video which is ready along with many other of its kind simply showing how we are baking poor paki asses.
Stay Tuned.

Sure we will ......


One more thing caught my eye is the OP/Bunker as it's similar to the the one where senior Gen or even COAS observe the other side, whenever they visit forward posts.


==================

 

[WARREN SS]

Russian military is also planning to replace the same in large numbers. Russia uses it as a DMR and has a very effective sniper program.

India has none.

But we are missing the topic here so let's continue it some other time.

Actually Officers Trained for Basic Sniping in IMA or OTA days

best shooters are specially selected and and are give training on DMR in battle schools, Mhow or in CIJW Schools . A specific sniper course is there in Infantry School Mhow , but it is mainly for soldiers and not officers


only NSG And Special forces are Trained for Heavy sniping Roles

It is SAD even Indian Police Now days Has dedicated Sniping schools for there Units

 

[aditya g]

Regarding perceived upper hand by Pak Army on sniping at LoC and IB;

1. It is easier for pak army to snipe at our jawans as we are deployed in a counter infiltration pattern where there are open foot patrols.

Paki snipers have luxury of stalking and waiting for these troops to make a mistake, possibly from the comfort if their post.

2. Lt Gen Panag in his article mentioned there are 2 snipers assigned to each coy and also Ghatak platoon. But in our situation we are better off with a DMR given the close battle scenarios with jehadis day to day.

3. Aside from SVD we also employ Galil Sniper, though use case for both rifles is same.

4. One should concede that Pak Army has procured better equipment for snipers.

In surgical strike interview one of the operators was assigned sniper role. so it's not that we do not employ sniping tactics

@Mikesingh @Kunal Biswas @hammer head

 

[sorcerer]

Army commanders to discuss on Dokalam face-off, India's

security challenges

New Delhi, Oct 3 Top army commanders will deliberate extensively on the Dokalam standoff and security challenges along the borders with China and Pakistan at a six-day conference beginning October 9.

The commanders will also carry out a review of the evolving security architecture in the region and ways to bolster the Army's operational preparedness to effectively deal with any possible challenge, official sources said.

They said the top commanders are also likely to analyse the security situation in Jammu and Kashmir with a focus on bolstering counter-terror operations.

The sources said there will be in-depth discussions on the 73-day face-off between Indian and Chinese troops in Dokalam and the current situation in the nearly 4,000-km-long border with China.

The standoff began on June 16 after the Indian side stopped the construction of a road by the Chinese Army on June 16 in Dokalam. On August 28, India's External Affairs Ministry announced that both sides have decided on "expeditious disengagement" of their border troops from the disputed area.

Days after the face-off ended, Army Chief Bipin Rawat had said China has started "flexing its muscles" and warned that the situation in India's northern border could snowball into a larger conflict.

The sources said the top commanders are also likely to discuss the security situation in Jammu and Kashmir.

The conference will be addressed by Defence Minister Nirmala Sitharaman.

The army commanders' conference is an important event in the planning and execution of various key decisions relating to the country's security and strategic interests.

There will be subject-specific deliberations during the last three days of the conference which is also likely to discuss implementation of the modernisation process in the Army.

The conference is also expected to discuss implementation of the ambitious reform process in the Army which was unveiled on August 30.

The government had announced that major reforms will be carried out in the Army to enhance its combat capability which will include redeployment of nearly 57,000 officers and other ranks as well as ensuring better utilisation of resources.

The reform initiatives were recommended by a committee headed by Lt Gen DB Shekatkar (retd) which had a mandate to recommend measures for enhancing of combat capability and rebalancing defence expenditure of the armed forces.

https://www.outlookindia.com/newsscroll/army-commanders-to-discuss-on-dokalam-faceoff-indias/1159839

 

[sthf]

Lt Gen Panag in his article mentioned there are 2 snipers assigned to each coy and also Ghatak platoon

If I remember correctly, Lt. Gen. Panag said that there used to be sniper section in an infantry battalion but that is not the case anymore.

 

[Guest]

How good are pakistani snipers? It seems like that they give us maximum damage

Unlike Pakis who sit inside their bunkers, our Jawans have to patrol the area to prevent infiltration, so they are exposed to such firing.

To prevent this there are two ways.

1. Destroy multiple Paki posts and kill lots of Pakis to the extent of mini war so that they are deterred.

2. Develop heavily armored Exo-skeletons that can survive such sniper shots and land mine blasts.

 

[aditya g]

If I remember correctly, Lt. Gen. Panag said that there used to be sniper section in an infantry battalion but that is not the case anymore.

Correct.

2 Allocated to Ghatak Platoon
2 to Alpha Coy
2 to Bravo Coy
2 to Charlie Coy
2 to Delta Coy
-----
10 Snipers ~ 1 section
-----

 

[Suryavanshi]

Regarding perceived upper hand by Pak Army on sniping at LoC and IB;

1. It is easier for pak army to snipe at our jawans as we are deployed in a counter infiltration pattern where there are open foot patrols.

Paki snipers have luxury of stalking and waiting for these troops to make a mistake, possibly from the comfort if their post.

2. Lt Gen Panag in his article mentioned there are 2 snipers assigned to each coy and also Ghatak platoon. But in our situation we are better off with a DMR given the close battle scenarios with jehadis day to day.

3. Aside from SVD we also employ Galil Sniper, though use case for both rifles is same.

4. One should concede that Pak Army has procured better equipment for snipers.

In surgical strike interview one of the operators was assigned sniper role. so it's not that we do not employ sniping tactics

@Mikesingh @Kunal Biswas @hammer head

Might as well start our own Spartan project

 

[WARREN SS]

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1522151/soldier-martyred-mustil-pass-khyber-border-crossfire/?9888

 

[patriots]

gd mng guys

another ceasefire violation....... everyday we are fighting war with Pakistan ....

 

[pankaj nema]

https://www.dawn.com/news/1361576/coas-bajwa-chairs-seven-hour-huddle-at-general-headquarters

COAS Bajwa chairs ‘seven-hour’ huddle at General Headquarters

 

[NeXoft007]

3 Army Jawans injured at LoC Poonch coz of ceasefire violation by Pakistan.

 

[Flame Thrower]

Might as well start our own Spartan project

Looks like straight out of cartoons...

A typical soldier could carry 20 kgs of gear (flat ground) on long patrol. This includes his gun, armor, ammo and other stuff.

This suit alone might weight more than 20kgs. Anyone would say that this helmet limits visibility.

Even if we assume these are for elite forces like Para, Marcos, Garud

I doubt they would go this cartoon suit.

My cousin is in AF and qualified for 21k airdrop with full load.

He explained that carrying 18k load for 16 hrs was hell. He felt his helmet too heavy even in high threat environment.

I go with his words, don't ask more.

Gurus, If I miss something on this armor, please add.