Indian Special Forces

[Blood+]

Lets not forget the Paras and the Sikhs at Jaffna. Stuck in open ground, ambushed from all sides, out numbered. still adapted and some how tried to Charlie Mike. Prabhakaran sadly only took a round to his leg.

The Sikhs got wiped out to the last man precisely because their commanding officer failed to adapt, unlike the Paras.

My two paisa


1) Large Number of our Soldiers are illeterate so Instruction is given via "Physical Repetition" of a task. See our Arty Soldiers jump around while loading a Gun. But there is a method to this madness. The Repetition of training becomes muscle memory - that muscle memory OVERRIDES Fight or Flight instinct in real combat.

^ This is an extremely valid point.

2) ON TOP of that - the Average Indian NCO/JCO is has decently high IQ to get the job done. Its one place where the cultural instinctual leaning towards "Jugad" actually help.

True. They have to, considering the dire shortage of commissioned officers in the Army.

 

[Kumaoni]

@rkhanna Jaffna helidrop for all its failures was absolutely legendary. 100 paras vs thousands of ltte guerillas. I shudder to think what would happen to paras if they faced a similar situation now.

Hwoever i did not know they even managed to hit prabhakaran. That’s actually impressive

 

[Kumaoni]

Nah, apples to oranges, ratio is completely off.

Afaik Jaffna was outnumbered by at least 50:1

100paras and 30 sikhs vs 5000 ltte

 

[Blood+]

Afaik Jaffna was outnumbered by at least 50:1

100paras and 30 sikhs vs 5000 ltte

Nah, that was the total number of LTTE fighters in that general area; not all of them took part in the battle. Plus, the setting was completely different. The Americans were scattered in small 'chalks' over a very large area, completely isolated from one another and surrounded by high-rise buildings.
So, while there are some superficial similarity but they were not comparable for the most part.

 

[rkhanna]

The Sikhs got wiped out to the last man precisely because their commanding officer failed to adapt, unlike the Paras.

Actually incorrect assesement - They landed in the middle of a stadium and were immediately pinned down. Their comms were gone. They held and returned fire in the process died to the last man. The Paras were able to manouver because of the Sikhs and got close enough to Prabhakaran.

On the other side a Rescue force was hastily put together including putting a tank on rail tracks to break through the LTTE wall.

There was very little the Sikhs could do. Returning fire itself showed outstanding training with death was guaranteed.

 

[Blood+]

And that was done by strategic adjustment of the artillery guns.

Strategic adjustment BEFORE the fight, as opposed to DURING the fight.

rangerguy said we cannot adjust in wartime, which is purely false and nonsense.

I don't think he said we cannot adjust at all, but rather we'll be slower to adjust owing to the prevailing mindset, which would be a fair assessment at least as far as the exercises are concerned.

As recent as 2020 taking of mountain tops and another incident in 2019 which was accidentally released in my possession:

Mountain/ high altitude warfare is bread and butter of the Indian Army, no wonder they are one of the best in that regard.

 

[Kumaoni]

Nah, that was the total number of LTTE fighters in that general area; not all of them took part in the battle. Plus, the setting was completely different. The Americans were scattered in small 'chalks' over a very large area, completely isolated from one another and surrounded by high-rise buildings.
So, while there are some superficial similarity but they were not comparable for the most part.

The indian accounts say otherwise.

 

[Kumaoni]

Strategic adjustment BEFORE the fight, as opposed to DURING the fight.

I don't think he said we cannot adjust at all, but rather we'll be slower to adjust owing to the prevailing mindset, which would be a fair assessment at least as far as the exercises are concerned.

Mountain/ high altitude warfare is bread and butter of the Indian Army, no wonder they are one of the best in that regard.

Agreed with all but first point. The fired on us first and we took very heavy casualties..

 

[Blood+]

Agreed with all but first point. The fired on us first and we took very heavy casualties..

I know, but the artillery pieces were already in place for a long time. The whole scrap began due to a dispute during a fence-laying operation that quickly escalated out of hand. And the reason why our casualties mounted was largely due to the stupid decisions taken by a few hotheaded young officers. Here is an excerpt from Watershed 1967 Indias Forgotten Victory over China:

I don't know how you would see it, but to me, this was not a display of bravery but one of utter insanity, for the lives of those men were wasted, not spent.

 

[Blood+]

The indian accounts say otherwise.

I AM talking about Indian sources. In fact, even the total 5000 figure is disputed.

 

[mokoman]

I AM talking about Indian sources. In fact, even the total 5000 figure is disputed.

propaganda spun by chinese is that most of the casuality was on indian side. keep posting that picture of indian medics/soldiers moving injured troops with armed PLA standing guard .

 

[Blood+]

Actually incorrect assesement - They landed in the middle of a stadium and were immediately pinned down. Their comms were gone. They held and returned fire in the process died to the last man. The Paras were able to manouver because of the Sikhs and got close enough to Prabhakaran.

Not at all!! That Sikh platoon could have played no role whatsoever for the simple fact that they spent the entire time being sitting ducks in an open field on the pretext of holding the LZ despite being informed by Major Sheonan of 10 Para SF that further reinforcements would not be forthcoming and being advised to either join the Paras or take up positions in the surrounding buildings!!
But Major Birendra Singh, in all his wisdom, chose to ignore everything and decided to just sit there in that field like a retard (and these are not my words but the words of the GoC 54th Infantry Division himself!!) with a predictable outcome. Come next morning, the entire platoon got wiped out one by one, except for one soul. It was basically a turkey shoot—nay, a dodo shoot!!

There was very little the Sikhs could do. Returning fire itself showed outstanding training with death was guaranteed.

Well, they could always bugger out and take position in one of the adjoining buildings, just as the Paras did!! It doesn't take an Einstein to figure this out, now does it??

 

[Blood+]

propaganda spun by chinese is that most of the casuality was on indian side. keep posting that picture of indian medics/soldiers moving injured troops with armed PLA standing guard .

We were talking about LTTE here. I never said anything about PLA casualties anyway, because we all know how big of a beacon of truth they are.

 

[rkhanna]

Not at all!! That Sikh platoon could have played no role whatsoever for the simple fact that they spent the entire time being sitting ducks in an open field on the pretext of holding the LZ despite being informed by Major Sheonan of 10 Para SF that further reinforcements would not be forthcoming and being advised to either join the Paras or take up positions in the surrounding buildings!!
But Major Birendra Singh, in all his wisdom, chose to ignore everything and decided to just sit there in that field like a retard (and these are not my words but the words of the GoC 54th Infantry Division himself!!) with a predictable outcome. Come next morning, the entire platoon got wiped out one by one, except for one soul. It was basically a turkey shoot—nay, a dodo shoot!!


Well, they could always bugger out and take position in one of the adjoining buildings, just as the Paras did!! It doesn't take an Einstein to figure this out, now does it??

Parts of what you have said are fair. but innacurate because the context is innacurate. Will explain later when i have a bit more time.

 

[Blood+]

Parts of what you have said are fair. but innacurate because the context is innacurate. Will explain later when i have a bit more time.

Alright. But from what I've read about the incident, the Sikh LI platoon had plenty of time and opportunity to escape that kill box.

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

@airborneCommando

https://reddit.com/r/IndianDefense/s/A9pzwFCMNu there you go bro

 

[Kumaoni]

@airborneCommando

https://reddit.com/r/IndianDefense/s/A9pzwFCMNu there you go bro

View attachment 226003

Y can’t they go into ops like this wtf

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Y can’t they go into ops like this wtf

They will start too I think the news about para upgrade is true

 

[airborneCommando]

@airborneCommando

https://reddit.com/r/IndianDefense/s/A9pzwFCMNu there you go bro

View attachment 226003

Sir this 2022

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Innovation!!!