Indian Army Artillery

[Aniruddha Mulay]

A better investment than Swathi will be long range recon drones, they have almost replaced radars as the new form of counter battery fire.

They might not work that well against china, but against pak, with little to no shorad, it will wreak havoc.

Don't we already have some 30 Swathi WLR in service and another 12 on order?

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

Don't we already have some 30 Swathi WLR in service and another 12 on order?

42 cant guard the whole border.

 

[Blood+]

Ahh fellow battle order enjoyer.

Guilty as charged.

 

[AnantS]

They provide you the general co-ordinates of target. You put that into your gun firing solution and fire off the dumb rounds.

Drones here are basically replacing the FOP.

So am I correct in my guess for retaliating via non guided shells - WLR shall provide better range and accuracy ? That WLR's role has been completely substituted by drones?

ok found and article which explains some in vague terms

How Drones Are Making Ukrainian Artillery Lethally Accurate

Ukraine has repeatedly inflicted heavy losses on Russian forces from long range with normally imprecise indirect artillery fire. Smart use of low-cost drones is a key factor in their success.

www.forbes.com

 

[Chinmoy]

So am I correct in my guess for retaliating via non guided shells - WLR shall provide better range and accuracy ? That WLR's role has been completely substituted by drones?

ok found and article which explains some in vague terms

How Drones Are Making Ukrainian Artillery Lethally Accurate

Ukraine has repeatedly inflicted heavy losses on Russian forces from long range with normally imprecise indirect artillery fire. Smart use of low-cost drones is a key factor in their success.

www.forbes.com

Not really.

As I mentioned, drone could replace FOP, but not a WLR.

WLR is used to get a location of the enemy firing position. Drone on other hand could be used to guide your fire accurately. There might be positions which a overflying drone could miss all out. In those places, WLR plays a vital role.

WLR and Drones could complement each other or Drones could work as a supplement of WLR. But we can't go on and say that drones could replace WLR. We require both in good numbers.

 

[AnantS]

@Chinmoy "That WLR's role has not been completely substituted by drones?" Is what I wanted to say. I mistyped in my earlier post. Thanks for confirming.

 

[Fatalis]

https://www.financialexpress.com/business/defence-mod-initiates-the-procurement-process-for-another-set-of-nbspk-9-vajra-howitzers-3145237/

 

[prateikf]

We need to grab this opportunity at the earliest. Hope some MOD official doesn’t say that follow on order can’t be applied since K-9A2 is a new howitzers and RFI/RFP needs to be issued again as in the case of Mirage-2000/MMRCA saga which hasn’t ended even now after more than 2 decades.

Hanwa Group offers upgraded K9 Vajra self-propelled howitzer to Indian Army

Hanwha Group's defense division has unveiled its upgraded K9 Vajra self-propelled Howitzer (SPH) to the Indian Army, showcasing a range of new features and advancements. The South Korean company claims that the enhanced version, named the K9A2, represents a groundbreaking development in...

myind.net

 

[prateikf]

It looks deadly. Would be a great addition to our artillery if inducted

 

[Chinmoy]

We need to grab this opportunity at the earliest. Hope some MOD official doesn’t say that follow on order can’t be applied since K-9A2 is a new howitzers and RFI/RFP needs to be issued again as in the case of Mirage-2000/MMRCA saga which hasn’t ended even now after more than 2 decades.

Hanwa Group offers upgraded K9 Vajra self-propelled howitzer to Indian Army

Hanwha Group's defense division has unveiled its upgraded K9 Vajra self-propelled Howitzer (SPH) to the Indian Army, showcasing a range of new features and advancements. The South Korean company claims that the enhanced version, named the K9A2, represents a groundbreaking development in...

myind.net

Bad Idea.

As of now, we should stuck with the follow on order of 100 more guns. After that may be we should see these if L&T can't come up with indigenous version.

 

[prateikf]

Bad Idea.

As of now, we should stuck with the follow on order of 100 more guns. After that may be we should see these if L&T can't come up with indigenous version.

Yes the upgraded version of K-9 is being offered for the 100 as a follow on order . K-9A2 is an upgrade of K-9 vajra. Would you buy a 2nd generation Honda city if a 5th generation is in the market ? No right . Same way the army too needs an upgraded version and not an older one.

 

[Chinmoy]

Yes the upgraded version of K-9 is being offered for the 100 as a follow on order . K-9A2 is an upgrade of K-9 vajra. Would you buy a 2nd generation Honda city if a 5th generation is in the market ? No right . Same way the army too needs an upgraded version and not an older one.

Now if you think that buying a car and a SPGH is same, then no one can help you. But for others, they would consider points like these:

A significant improvement in the K9A2 SPH is the introduction of a full-automatic turret. This advanced turret system autonomously handles ammunition feeding, loading, and propellant charge, ensuring a 100% automatic process.

Furthermore, the K9A2 incorporates Composite Rubber Tracks (CRT), marking another notable addition.

A change in track would mean retesting the whole system under various weather condition. It means the file for 100 numbers which has already moved would be stalled for another 5 years.

On top of that, a change in turret would mean a whole new training regime. It would mean another delay in induction.

So if you have got anyone who could make the users understand that buying K9 Vajra is similar to buying Honda City, it would make things simple.

 

[prateikf]

Now if you think that buying a car and a SPGH is same, then no one can help you. But for others, they would consider points like these:





A change in track would mean retesting the whole system under various weather condition. It means the file for 100 numbers which has already moved would be stalled for another 5 years.

On top of that, a change in turret would mean a whole new training regime. It would mean another delay in induction.

So if you have got anyone who could make the users understand that buying K9 Vajra is similar to buying Honda City, it would make things simple.

But we need modern things and not outdated ones. If we sign on the contract now and buy the old one’s they would be obsolete by the time they are inducted. Not to forget that both China and Pak are inducting the latest versions. A simple solution to the issue is why not upgrade the existing K-9 vajra to K-9 A2 standards and thus solve all the issues you have raised. If we induct the older version we would need to upgrade them later at twice the price. See how much the Mirage-2000 program cost us and is still not complete. We could induct the K-9A2 and upgrade the rest too. Something similar was done while buying 140 SU-30 MKI. We asked them to take back the original 40 SU-30 and got 40 MKI instead. We didn’t buy an older version of SU-30 back then.

 

[Chinmoy]

But we need modern things and not outdated ones. If we sign on the contract now and buy the old one’s they would be obsolete by the time they are inducted. Not to forget that both China and Pak are inducting the latest versions. A simple solution to the issue is why not upgrade the existing K-9 vajra to K-9 A2 standards and thus solve all the issues you have raised. If we induct the older version we would need to upgrade them later at twice the price. See how much the Mirage-2000 program cost us and is still not complete. We could induct the K-9A2 and upgrade the rest too. Something similar was done while buying 140 SU-30 MKI. We asked them to take back the original 40 SU-30 and got 40 MKI instead. We didn’t buy an older version of SU-30 back then.

No. That's a wrong perception.

We could expect the next trance of K9s by 2025 to 26. By that time K9A2 would only mature as a platform. Going for a new deal would only mean renegotiation which would drag the process even further down the line.

 

[prateikf]

No. That's a wrong perception.

We could expect the next trance of K9s by 2025 to 26. By that time K9A2 would only mature as a platform. Going for a new deal would only mean renegotiation which would drag the process even further down the line.

Ok let’s see what the Army and MOD decide. Both options are on the table though.

 

[Fatalis]

 

[Fatalis]

 

[another_armchair]

OFB/AWEIL unveiled its 155/52 Bofors/Dhanush derivative.

It is a proven system. The Army knows in and out of it. They won't have to train on a new gun.

It is time the gun is put to trials and inducted given how Army continues to drag its feet over inducting ATAGS by finding some fault or the other in the system.

The orders can be divided between Kalyani, Tata so that they can be compensated for the 'sunk' costs in R&D of ATAGS.

It is the only way to drop the curtains on this decades old charade and repeated randi rona to press(by faujis and middle men planted stories) that we lack adequate arty firepower.

 

[jik60]

This is an old video 5 months back, from my liked inventory, but the interview of DG Arty, in the end, is very important, we now can see that Dhanush has been deployed in Ladakh

 

[another_armchair]

Jugal Purohit ke baal safed ho gaye magar ATAGS AON(acceptance of necessity) se aage nahi badha.