India-China Border conflict

[mist_consecutive]

 

[DingDong]

its opposite .

A jointly agreed demarcated border means less area for them to grab . once a border is settled it becomes harder to grab land . they are not such chutiyas that they will go against a border they themselves agreed to.

no border means they can eat entire Bhutan bit by bit .

Absolutely agree.

As a rule of thumb, ambiguity always favors the stronger side. Hence to correctly guess which side is feeling the heat, just observe which side is more desperate to settle the issue.

 

[mist_consecutive]

when did india-china agree to a demarcated border there ?

as per my understanding , China just agreed to see Sikkim as part of India .

do post here

Here you go.

China: An internal Account of “ Startling Inside Story of Sino-Indian Border Talks

web.archive.org

The analyst states that the Sino-Indian Memorandum on Nathula as a border trade point (2003) has signified China’s “de facto” recognition of India’s sovereignty over Sikkim. Quoting Indian side, Zhuhua mentions that at the time of border talks, Beijing handed over a ‘new’ official map to them showing Sikkim as a State of India. Foreign press reports pointed out that India as a quid pro quo, reiterated its recognition of the Tibet Autonomous Region as part of the People’s Republic of China (PRC) and its policy of not permitting any anti- China political activity by the Tibetans in India and also, internal opinions in China justified the changed stance of China on Sikkim on the basis of the need for Beijing to “struggle side by side with compromise” in order to win “support in other fronts”.

The analyst further points out that the Chinese Foreign Ministry website has deleted Sikkim from its list of “Countries and Regions” and its spokesperson has mentioned that Sikkim is no longer a problem in bilateral relations. Thus, overall, Sikkim has ceased to appear as ‘a historical legacy’ for China. The Blog at the same time notes that the Chinese Government has never issued any formal statement recognising Sikkim as part of India’s territory”, about which New Delhi has expressed dissatisfaction”.

Map handed over -> Confirmation of where the boundary lies.

 

[mokoman]

Here you go.

China: An internal Account of “ Startling Inside Story of Sino-Indian Border Talks

web.archive.org

Map handed over -> Confirmation of where the boundary lies.

they only accept Sikkim as part of India . border dispute was always there , from wikipedia

"China published a map showing Sikkim as a part of India and the Foreign Ministry deleted it from the list of China's "border countries and regions".[34] However, the Sikkim-China border's northernmost point, "The Finger", continues to be the subject of dispute and military activity"

there is a reason the doklam stand off occured near sikkim . India/Bhutan/China dont even agree on where the trijunction is .

like i said there is no demarcated border anywhere . neither in sikkim nor along rest of india/china.

 

[mokoman]

Absolutely agree.

As a rule of thumb, ambiguity always favors the stronger side. Hence to correctly guess which side is feeling the heat, just observe which side is more desperate to settle the issue.

exactly , it wont make much sense to us and we can hate them . but Bhutan is a tiny nation . they r not gonna build up an air force or build nukes in next 10-20 years . if anything they will get fucked more.

better to lose a hand now than an arm tommorow.

 

[Cheepek]

Chinese are crying

 

[DumbPilot]

Chinese are crying

burnol stocks

 

[another_armchair]

Chinese are crying

After India bailed out Nepal, Sri Lanka and ensured Bangladesh's head remains above the water, Ching-Chong Chinese ambassador goes into a veritable spitfest against India ahead of G-20 and the resident Chinese on DFI call us jealous of their success. LOL...

 

[Azaad]

After India bailed out Nepal, Sri Lanka and ensured Bangladesh's head remains above the water, Ching-Chong Chinese ambassador goes into a veritable spitfest against India ahead of G-20 and the resident Chinese on DFI call us jealous of their success. LOL...

Resident Chinese members are pimping for CCP.

 

[Cheran]

Playing Catch Up To China At LAC, BRO Completes 90 Border-Area Infra Projects

Defence Minister Rajnath Singh will inaugurate 90 infrastructure projects constructed by the Border Roads Organisation (BRO) in frontier areas on 12 September, as per an announcement by the Defence Ministry

swarajyamag.com

 

[DingDong]

Chinese are crying

Enemy is rattled, India must be doing something rather well to invite such rash statements. What is it?

 

[Cheepek]

Enemy is rattled, India must be doing something rather well to invite such rash statements. What is it?

It's frustration of losing influence in our neighbouring countries even after having a bigger purse.

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

My specific point was manufacturing quality and it gets better the more it gets produced unlike piecemeal orders
Coming to rnd their budget is far higher in this regards and even percentage the industrial espionage is not possible without domestic rnd and mic to perfect it

When we have limited info then better give it a fair estimate coz that won't surprise us and this thing I'd for sure IA gets right

Tell me it took Japanese and Koreans only 1 decade to beat Americans in automobile technology. Korean and Japanese arms are almost as good as the west. Why has the CCP not been able to improve its quality even after 40 years of manufacturing? Not a single world beating product has come out of China - in defense or anything else. The other thing is they are forced to develop everything by themselves. That takes a very long time. Meanwhile collaboration between countries gets quality products out quickly. You are overestimating China’s potential. All signs point to the Chinese struggling quite a bit in getting anywhere close to world class defence products or any product.

 

[jai jaganath]

Tell me it took Japanese and Koreans only 1 decade to beat Americans in automobile technology. Korean and Japanese arms are almost as good as the west. Why has the CCP not been able to improve its quality even after 40 years of manufacturing? Not a single world beating product has come out of China - in defense or anything else. The other thing is they are forced to develop everything by themselves. That takes a very long time. Meanwhile collaboration between countries gets quality products out quickly. You are overestimating China’s potential. All signs point to the Chinese struggling quite a bit in getting anywhere close to world class defence products or any product.

Defence equipments are far more complex and challenging compared to automobiles
Secondly their equipments perform poor in foreign countries bcoz of cost factor
There is a critical point in cost below it quality no matter what can't be good
More importantly their espionage is far more helpful than so called collaboration with west coz west won't share an iota in formal manner atleast
What I am saying they have got quality to their level of satisfaction they know their capabilities and form their tactics based on it
Again I am repeating the quality they export is not the quality they use bcoz they don't have that cost restriction which they have to give in export market
It depends what u consider world class equipments if it's USA then sorry no one can come close to them nor Russia nor china nor SK nor India
Coming to manufacturing scale yes their weapons might have improved a lot since 2000s, 2010s based on the logic of the huge amount they have manufactured
But yeah their export weapons != what they use

 

[DingDong]

Defence equipments are far more complex and challenging compared to automobiles
Secondly their equipments perform poor in foreign countries bcoz of cost factor
There is a critical point in cost below it quality no matter what can't be good
More importantly their espionage is far more helpful than so called collaboration with west coz west won't share an iota in formal manner atleast
What I am saying they have got quality to their level of satisfaction they know their capabilities and form their tactics based on it
Again I am repeating the quality they export is not the quality they use bcoz they don't have that cost restriction which they have to give in export market
It depends what u consider world class equipments if it's USA then sorry no one can come close to them nor Russia nor china nor SK nor India
Coming to manufacturing scale yes their weapons might have improved a lot since 2000s, 2010s based on the logic of the huge amount they have manufactured
But yeah their export weapons != what they use

Culture, people and vision play crucial role in the type and quality of Industrial production. That is why Google will most certainly not be able to compete against Intel in chip making and Intel won't create a search engine to rival Google despite both of them having lot of extra cash in hand.

ROSCSOMOS sent a mission to Venus back in 70s, NASA sent moon mission in 1960s-70s. Neither is able to repeat those missions. The reason being that knowledge has been lost, people who participated in those missions have either retired or died. Blueprints are not sufficient.

Espionage/copying does not help as much as you think. Had that been the case China would have replicated all the patented technologies.

I am not claiming that China cannot go up the value chain, however this is far more complicated process.

 

[Tactical Doge]

Culture, people and vision play crucial role in the type and quality of Industrial production. That is why Google will most certainly not be able to compete against Intel in chip making and Intel won't create a search engine to rival Google despite both of them having lot of extra cash in hand.

ROSCSOMOS sent a mission to Venus back in 70s, NASA sent moon mission in 1960s-70s. Neither is able to repeat those missions. The reason being that knowledge has been lost, people who participated in those missions have either retired or died. Blueprints are not sufficient.

Espionage/copying does not help as much as you think. Had that been the case China would have replicated all the patented technologies.

I am not claiming that China cannot go up the value chain, however this is far more complicated process.

Chinese will put a man on the moon within a decade or so

 

[DingDong]

Chinese will put a man on the moon within a decade or so

Turboprop engines are harder to design and manufacture than the rocket engines. The reason being that turboprop engines are designed for high reliability during continuous operation, low maintenance, human-worthiness. Likewise, defense equipment are not single use, they need to be fool-proof, easy to manufacture/operate/maintain and be extremely reliable.

I am not doubting China's capabilities, I am just saying that the technology gap between India and China is not as threatening as it is made out to be.

 

[jai jaganath]

Culture, people and vision play crucial role in the type and quality of Industrial production. That is why Google will most certainly not be able to compete against Intel in chip making and Intel won't create a search engine to rival Google despite both of them having lot of extra cash in hand.

ROSCSOMOS sent a mission to Venus back in 70s, NASA sent moon mission in 1960s-70s. Neither is able to repeat those missions. The reason being that knowledge has been lost, people who participated in those missions have either retired or died. Blueprints are not sufficient.

Espionage/copying does not help as much as you think. Had that been the case China would have replicated all the patented technologies.

I am not claiming that China cannot go up the value chain, however this is far more complicated process.

My that particular point was wrt collabs
Not saying espionage is best method to get something effective
Rest I agree
All I meant Collab with west won't benefit much only self development can help be it in any form

 

[mist_consecutive]

Gigachad move. Make this protest violent (intentionally), bring limelight, and shame China on the global stage.

 

[Cheepek]

Chinese are crying