India-China 2020 Border conflict

Abhay Rajput 02

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Is it possible to lay precision artillery fire over an area by using coordinates from a sattelite.

I have read extensively of Russians using both mini and MALE drones to locate Ukraine strongholds and lay down very precise and concentrated firepower by only using a few artillery units.

I'm the case of china India border I feel both the environment and the lack of air superiority will prevent the Chinese from using any sort of drones. Their use might be minimal if used at all.

But is it possible for them to use their satellites?
If you know enemy's positions , you can always calculate the trajectory to hit them. Can be done.
 

shade

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Decision makers have lot more info and more parameters to consider and if it was congress we would not have heard a peep about loss of land and would have continued. But now full army is deployed and so on. Just hope they don't relax the guard.....this is a loss of face for China and demoralizing to their image as they are unable to show the world that they are some sorta power that can squash us.
Domestically their image is well managed by state owned media outlets, internationally nobody cares about Chinese landgrab.
They have succeeded partially with their objectives, and will be back again to attain the other half if the buildup at the border is reduced to "normal" levels, which it will be, eventually.
If anything this is a loss of face for Modi government, but then the MoU-with-PRC-signing opposition won't raise a finger against this even though they chimp out at every other given opportunity.
This will continue with escalating severity as the years pass by, they get stronger and GoI gets even more scared, eventually ending up with them waging a war on us directly, dumping the earlier Sun Tchutiyapa of "winning without fighting".
Sweeping this yellow problem under the rug isn't a solution.
 

omaebakabaka

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There is no hope from congress. Most of the land we lost was during congress regime. They are completely in bed with ccp . Its as simple as that. But its still a loss of land as time passes by for us . Besides once this is over , babus will force the army to reduce troops strength and the same story will repeat again. It has happened before many times. But this time there are ofcourse certain exception .
Brother, you are predicting the future already, it might very well happen as you say or it might not. It has not ended yet to conclude one way or the other.
One thing is clear, galwan incident is not hidden from the public vs ARunachal or Depsang intrusions and discussed down to the location of heights and control areas. So we will have plenty to speculate in the future and judge BJP on its impotency or cleverness.
 

hit&run

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Thanks, Both the detailed replies are appreciated.
Keeping head high both on ascent and descent becomes a necessity. Many soldiers in Kargil died with bullets shot in their eyes. Pakistani’s were pounded hard while running back, actually NLI was wiped out on the slopes. Direct fire mode of Bofors guns was used to soften Pakistani defences on tops.

Metaphors do not work when land is contested by battling troops both on planes and mountains.

People take it lightly but being battle hardened is only priced attribute that decides winning or losing. It is same like a Batsman’s form. You throw anything at him he finds a solution to beat it. India is at advantage in this regard. The details people crib ad-nauseam are only good to paddle agenda or flaunt egos. The only question remains is the intent of the political class. Military victory is assured when given a go.
 
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Bhadra

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Much more than meets the eye. Thats what i was talking about in my rant , there are other areas also near bhutan , HP AND UK BORDERS also. These babus have lost so much land and hide it from the public, and increases trade with them. More like every time they did salami slicing we gave them trade concessions . And some people here defends these babus. Yesterday it was 1 km , today its 10km tomorrow it will be 20 km.
Strange are the ways of mind and perceptions. that generate statements like you have made.

After 1962 India gained a territory of 83,743 Sq km in Arunachal Pradesh.
India gained a territory of 7,096 Sq km in Sikkim
No territory has been lost on Uttarakhand and Himachal.
India gained a significant amount of territory from the line where 1962 War ended in Ladakh.

Do not be so self-hating that you are unable to see your achievements...

Indian Army has given you J&K, Goa, Hyderabad, Mizoram, Manipur, Tripura, Nagaland Assam and you can say Punjab where the Babus had fucked up everywhere. It is not a mean feat. The only Army in the world post-WWII to have launched an operation of the magnitude of 1971 and liberated a country of the size of Bangladesh as a consequence of a military campaign. No Army in the world post-WWII has such an impressive record. Only one needs friendly eyes to see that.

सुखानि दुःखोपशमाय भोगान्
सुखाय जानाति विमूढचेताः।
तान्येव दुःखानि पुनः सुखानि
जानाति विद्धनविमूढचेताः॥

The deluded look at objects of enjoyments as giving happiness by removing the unhappiness. The wise clearly see that the same object which gives happiness now will become a source of unhappiness.
 

Bhadra

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Cag me aag lagai jaa chuki hai.

Refer kerala goof up by cag.

Cag is an accountant that's it. Nothing more nothing less.
Kiss kiss ko Chor Bologe ??
Every body connected to OFB and DRDO is Chor....
General chor hai...
MoD Chors Hai
CAG Chor hai...

Only DRDO and OFB are "doodh ke dhule"... stupid fellows..

Rebutt logically and point to point...
 

bhaskara

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Biskoot ready karo parle g ya tiger

Hell just finish of the invaders! They encroached our land and we are doing meetings with them? They wouldn’t have been so kind as to hold meetings with us if we had infiltrated
 

Dessert Storm

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Strange are the ways of mind and perceptions. that generate statements like you have made.

After 1962 India gained a territory of 83,743 Sq km in Arunachal Pradesh.
India gained a territory of 7,096 Sq km in Sikkim
No territory has been lost on Uttarakhand and Himachal.
India gained a significant amount of territory from the line where 1962 War ended in Ladakh.

Do not be so self-hating that you are unable to see your achievements...

Indian Army has given you J&K, Goa, Hyderabad, Mizoram, Manipur, Tripura, Nagaland Assam and you can say Punjab where the Babus had fucked up everywhere. It is not a mean feat. The only Army in the world post-WWII to have launched an operation of the magnitude of 1971 and liberated a country of the size of Bangladesh as a consequence of a military campaign. No Army in the world post-WWII has such an impressive record. Only one needs friendly eyes to see that.

सुखानि दुःखोपशमाय भोगान्
सुखाय जानाति विमूढचेताः।
तान्येव दुःखानि पुनः सुखानि
जानाति विद्धनविमूढचेताः॥

The deluded look at objects of enjoyments as giving happiness by removing the unhappiness. The wise clearly see that the same object which gives happiness now will become a source of unhappiness.
This post sir is worth 'going viral'. The facts may be known to many but the 'realisation' is so nicely put by you.🙏
Is it possible to lay precision artillery fire over an area by using coordinates from a sattelite.

I have read extensively of Russians using both mini and MALE drones to locate Ukraine strongholds and lay down very precise and concentrated firepower by only using a few artillery units and the results wad very good.

In the case of china India border I feel both the environment and the lack of air superiority will prevent the Chinese from using any sort of drones. Their use might be minimal if used at all.

But is it possible for them to use their satellites?
Don't know why some against MQ 9Bs then. They would be a huge asset. A recon flying at 45-50k inside Indian territory can pinpoint targets
 

FalconZero

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Few points from the article :
With no signs of disengagement on the ground in Ladakh, where India and China have been locked in a stand-off since April, both sides will stay dug in during the region’s bitter winter too, the sources added. The Chinese, they added, have deployed around 50,000 soldiers and equipment, including missile systems, tanks and artillery, at the border.

The sources’ comments come as the ground situation in Ladakh remains the same despite the Chinese seemingly adopting a reconciliatory approach during different levels of dialogue

According to the sources, there is no question of believing Chinese words of peace unless their deeds on the ground match up. The sources also said China has given them a number for the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) soldiers killed in the Galwan Valley clash — a number Beijing has yet to publicly acknowledge.

The Chinese, sources said, have told the Indian side that five of their soldiers, including a commanding officer, had died in the clash. “If the Chinese are saying five, we can easily double it if not triple it,” a top South Block officer said.
 

Cheran

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Well well


My guess as to what the larger phenomenon is:-
China's insistence that India acknowledge it as the next super power & fall inline or face consequences

If so, the next question is, if we are "sitting down for a solution", what is the solution? :)
 

vampyrbladez

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I think people like you are more dangerous to our nation than the people who ask good questions. The reason is that blind propaganda is not going to fly in a real war. We don’t have to make things up or be insecure like the Pakistan and PLA to claim false victories. We have to fix our problems and become strong. We have lots and lots of issues. Just look at today’s CAG report on how several deals are showing that we are poorly prepared for engaging with a hi-tech and well prepared enemy. If you cannot help in that and just are inclined to shoot your mouth off, then you’d be unwelcome in this country, which we are trying to make strong, real strong in real terms and not in bleating out baseless propaganda - the domain of the weak-hearted like yourself. War is not a Bollywood movie. Real people will die en mass. And we owe it to them to be our very best militarily and economically. You are a good example of someone who needs to be sent to mandaTory military training.
People like you are a cancerous remnant of the old regime. Spreading agitprop and fake news under the guise of concern trolling.

'False victories' are for Pakis and ChiComs and woke chuttads like you who promote them.

Prove to me how February 27, 2019 was a loss for us when we fulfilled every single objective and showed the world an old dog can learn new tricks!
 

sorcerer

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Well well


My guess as to what the larger phenomenon is:-
China's insistence that India acknowledge it as the next super power & fall inline or face consequences

If so, the next question is, if we are "sitting down for a solution", what is the solution? :)
We made our point very clear!
India wont take chinese sitting down any place on Indian soil.

India, China need to adjust to each other's rise: S Jaishankar
 

Synergy

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Not China, but we ourselves have raised the costs of management of borders significantly by creating difference between border management and Defence of Borders.

For example - there are fifteen battalions of ITBP in Ladakh. For those fifteen battalions, there six SAGs, about fifteen Commandants, Two to three IGs, One Command HQ in Chandigarh and lot of other associated staff and organisation.

This expenditure is being borne when those fifteen battalions could have been simply placed under command existing Army Brigades in Ladakh and entire Army setup used for administration and logistic functions for those fifteen battalions.

But everyone has established their shops in Ladakh and doing whatever they want. We have thus seen instances when ITBP gives a secret Map to the journalists in their exuberance for cheap and false media story.

Whenever a illmeaning journalist like Sekhar Gupta says something like Cost, economy, agencies, border management - one must always suspect some one has payed him to tout a particular line for a particular purpose. After the cost I am sure he will make a case for having another fifteen battalions of ITBP for Ladakh and removal of "costly" army from there.

Such has been the misdeeds of this darbari pen selling Padam Awardee journalist.
though I'm unable to recall correctly as per which convention, but as far as I can remember, according to Geneva convention border control and management should be vested upon MHA and paramilitary or police force, not under MoD and Army.

that's why we see every border is guarded by paramilitary or police forces those are controlled by MHA of respective countries.

it's a norm so BSF and ITBP can't be put under Army's command except under extraordinary circumstances.



(Edit : not sure if already pointed out. I'm on page 320).
 
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sorcerer

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China is paying a big price for its Himalayan blunder

The truth is that without the element of surprise, China is not equipped to dominate India in a military confrontation. And India is making sure that it will not be caught off guard again. It has now matched Chinese military deployments along the Himalayan frontier and activated its entire logistics network to transport the supplies needed to sustain the troops and equipment through the coming harsh winter.

Xi seems to be hoping that he can simply wear India down. At a time when the Indian economy has registered its worst-ever contraction, Xi has forced India to divert an increasing share of resources to national defense. Xi could use America’s preoccupation with its coming presidential election to carry out a quick, localized strike against India without seeking to start a war.


But it seems less likely that India will wilt under Chinese pressure than that Xi will leave behind a legacy of costly blunders. With his Himalayan misadventure, he has provoked a powerful adversary and boxed himself into a corner


Chinese Xidiot!
 

sorcerer

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Investment Between China and the US Fell to Lowest Level in a Decade in First Half of 2020

Investment between China and the US fell to their lowest level in almost a decade in the first half of 2020,
A former Chinese commerce minister told CNBC last week that a complete decoupling of the two economies is almost impossible, but a partial separation is already underway

 

vishnugupt

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After 1962 India gained a territory of 83,743 Sq km in Arunachal Pradesh.
India gained a territory of 7,096 Sq km in Sikkim
No territory has been lost on Uttarakhand and Himachal.
India gained a significant amount of territory from the line where 1962 War ended in Ladakh.
If this is what conclusion you have drawn from 1962 war then please do me a favor ?
Send me that weed you are on. seems like, you are having unlimited supply of Angle dust right from heaven.
 

shaileshmd

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Chinese artillery fire pinning down the IA.
I would think this is not as simple as it sounds. As one of the commenters has shown on a map, precision targeting at various points with the use of satellites and the drones requires very high end imaging systems. The USA uses drone based Harpoon missiles to take care of the targets. I have no doubts they have very precise artillery technology in their hands. Artillery ammo is much cheaper compared to the precision missiles costing over 1/2 to 1 million dollars. Artillery fire results may be quite poor. It could also attract significant counter firing of artillery from the enemy with the weapons locating radar systems.
 

Knowitall

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China is paying a big price for its Himalayan blunder

The truth is that without the element of surprise, China is not equipped to dominate India in a military confrontation. And India is making sure that it will not be caught off guard again. It has now matched Chinese military deployments along the Himalayan frontier and activated its entire logistics network to transport the supplies needed to sustain the troops and equipment through the coming harsh winter.

Xi seems to be hoping that he can simply wear India down. At a time when the Indian economy has registered its worst-ever contraction, Xi has forced India to divert an increasing share of resources to national defense. Xi could use America’s preoccupation with its coming presidential election to carry out a quick, localized strike against India without seeking to start a war.


But it seems less likely that India will wilt under Chinese pressure than that Xi will leave behind a legacy of costly blunders. With his Himalayan misadventure, he has provoked a powerful adversary and boxed himself into a corner


Chinese Xidiot!
The article simply fails to understand the situation on the ground and the author is living in his own fantasy world. he managed to get a few things right but most things wrong.

what he got right is that china cannot hope to defeat us in this conflict. A recent article by a IAF officer explain that IAF is ready for a 10 day intensive war and its indigenous war supplies can last for over 60 days and that is a lot.

similarly Indian army and navy are prepared for a conflict with china with the army now having enough supplies to last us the whole winter.

these are the only things he got right.

Everything else is wrong.

There is no Himalayan blunder it is a well thought out plan. They cannot hope to defeat us in a battle so they have moved large amount of weapons as a way to intimidate us. They are bluffing to us right now a bluff that needs to be called out.

this is their sun tzu bullshit they are trying to appear strong when they are weak. their deployments are not to fight us but plant fear in the minds of the GOI.

As of now the chinese have got what they came for and are reinforcing those lands as we speak.

by not responding and fighting them back India will end up paying a high price and this will be our Himalayan blunder.
 

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