India-China 2020 Border conflict

[omaebakabaka]

You do realise J&K is not like rest of Indian states.. It's like a issue of national security. How would've they fought when there was no support given to them? How can unarmed 10 people fight 100-200 armed people & they also have their families to look after.
Even police stations were empty coz there was so much fear of armed mobs.
Fortunately for KP's Kashmir was under its best most Patriotic Governor ever Sh Jagmohan... That helped them in getting safe exit passage.
Local politics was non existent.

Look what happens to Hindus in Kerala, WB where they are supposedly in majority but don't have any political backing... Kashmir is whole lot of a different universe compared to that.

Sorry I will not share that pity with you. One nation one law, just yesterday someone was arguing about border areas/states should not be open to other people from India....do we have one nation or many? WTF is this thinking? If thats how it is then expect J&K, Kerala and all else as exceptions and soon you will have many capitals.

I am not going to argue the difference between brave and others, when certain lines are crossed one has to be of mindset to die than live. Someone has the tag here "DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR". You can justify your arguments and fill in the blanks. There are fighters and then there are other people....

 

[Synergy]

LAC row: Hope China won’t make further attempts to unilaterally change status quo, says MEA

isn't me or that statement actually sound like surrender and acceptance of new LAC?

LAC row: Hope China won’t make further attempts to unilaterally change status quo, says MEA

The Chinese side should sincerely work with the Indian side for complete disengagement at the earliest from all friction areas including Pangong lake," MEA spokesperson Anurag Srivastava said at the weekly briefing.

indianexpress.com

nope. it's stating complete disengagement and that means status quo ante.

still we've not agreed upon anything other than April status quo.

 

[bajiraopeshwa]

we also have AWAC's and SAM's it is not like we will not secure the skies.

Yes, an ingress and egress is impossible. But was thinking of a scenario where the bomber takes off from Tibet, fires its payload and then flies back to the mainland with air2air refueling. This can perhaps happen only at the start of the conflict. Maybe this scenario does not make sense with a conventional payload

 

[Sanglamorre]

This will fall in less than 12 hours when & if leadership grows a backbone

View attachment 59486

Yeah that's great, but where's our promised underwater volcano eruption??

 

[Bhadra]

sounds like a brilliant plan..

if you are against a tinpot army led by tinpot leader...

Maybe the PLA thought they were, nothing else explains the foolishness of the plan. I keep going ove rit and can't make sense. Is there something obvious we are missing?

Don't seem to, so I will have to go with the simple answer. PLA was trapped in echo chambers and maybe were amplified by our porkies.

Your reading of Porki amplification about the idea of Kargil on karakoram could be true but man they had almost done it...
They reached the confluence of Galwan and Shyok...
They reached Y junction...
They had intruded almost three km at Hot Spring...
Do not forget about our 70 injured at Finger 4...
They had gathered strength in Moldo.

By deployment and disposition, by the sequence of events, by force level... That plan is workable ...

The only thing not explainable is that what stopped them.... ??
Not ITBP....
Not 3 Div or 14 Corps who had no strength to do so.. let us not fool ourselves,,,
What stopped 155mm Guns and SP How from booming and Tanks and Mechanised forces rolling into Chusul...
They were certainly not waiting for the Indian Army to come there and occupy those heights so that during Swargarohan they do not fall one by one in Kedarkahnd..

The PLA has shown our MEA their worth as also shown our National Security managers a mirror called ITBP... I am sure Mr Dobhal understands it that parochial bureaucratic cadre interests do not surpass national interests,,, for future if this ITBP business is not sorted out we are in for a big trouble..

 

[Jailor]

LAC row: Hope China won’t make further attempts to unilaterally change status quo, says MEA

isn't me or that statement actually sound like surrender and acceptance of new LAC?

LAC row: Hope China won’t make further attempts to unilaterally change status quo, says MEA

The Chinese side should sincerely work with the Indian side for complete disengagement at the earliest from all friction areas including Pangong lake," MEA spokesperson Anurag Srivastava said at the weekly briefing.

indianexpress.com

Its you, Its always you.

 

[omaebakabaka]

PAALF is their weakest chip.

That is the key, they have no combat experience in a very long time.

 

[Suhaldev]

Chinese never went behind LAC in 2013 Stayed behind Limit of Patrolling line which is away from LAC

Tensions at Depsang began much b4 May
Chinese blocking Indian patrol beyond bottle neck area



Hence, reports of problem started in Mid april is true and previous govt was incompetent was going for talks and still loosing land.

 

[mokoman]

News source?

Some credible info was released on weibo.

The chinese are going from "no one died" to "there were deaths"

weird how they are refusing to release any info Other deaths are released quickly.

 

[Suhaldev]

India may hold joint naval exercise with France, Australia

This gains significance given the current border tensions and recent aggressive deployments by the PLA Navy in the region, with analysts predicting that the Indian Ocean Region (IOR) will soon see a larger and dangerous Chinese presence.

economictimes.indiatimes.com

 

[Suhaldev]

Over 2500 social media accounts under watch for spreading #Chinese propoganda. IP address of A/Cs traced to Pak, HK, China and Russia.

 

[Haldilal]

Ya'll Nibbiars Ae Dar Accha Hai.

India lies about casualties in border clash with China - Global Times

t.co

 

[Haldilal]

Ya'll Nibbiars Connect the dot Suddenly Ceasefire Violation by Pakistan Army increased post FM level talk between India and China. 46 CFV reported in last 7 days. Core commander level meeting between PLA & IA not yet scheduled. Chinese propaganda machineries activated with full force.

BaBa.

 

[Bhadra]

A group of 6 PLA soldiers blong to Occupied Tibet k¡||ed 2 PLA officers & 2 others PLA soldiers when they did objectionable comments on shri Dalai Lama.Later all 6 Tibetan soldiers k¡||ed by other PLA soldiers. Incident take place near Spanggur Gap area on 15 Sept. (PLA Insider)

That is highly possible .... Their BDR have local Tibetan soldiers ... their forward post at places are visited by local porters including ladies ... I have seen one Tibetan Lady being raped by a PLA man on his sentry post deliberately in the sight of Indian soldiers.. only thing is I could not open fire..

They can be so mean in Psychological warfare... they are centuries suppressed and fucked up civilization and can resort to all lowly acts if free..

 

[hit&run]

We have beaten them into pulp that now they have pressurised 11-Ping to honour their dead soldiers publically.

The feeling of being compared with coward Pakistanis is hurting their conscience.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Yes, an ingress and egress is impossible. But was thinking of a scenario where the bomber takes off from Tibet, fires its payload and then flies back to the mainland with air2air refueling. This can perhaps happen only at the start of the conflict. Maybe this scenario does not make sense with a conventional payload

Then it can only fire ALCM's and hope they don't hit a mountain. Carpet bombing would be
highly unlikely or successful even with escorts.

 

[Tridev123]

They will have dozens of escorts tbf and we'll have a limited window to stop them.

Yes, the heavy bombers will usually not go alone and will be accompanied by fighter aircraft. The usual strategy will be to take out enemy SAM sites and redars and establish air dominance before risking the heavy bombers.

One advantage of having heavy bombers is that they can carry long range cruise missiles in greater numbers. Whereas a Su30 can carry one Brahmos type cruise missile, a bomber can carry probably several of them. Longer range cruise missiles of 1000km or > will be heavier because of extra fuel carried and not all fighters can carry them.

But they are vulnerable without escorts. A system like the S400 will spot them from far because of larger RCS and fire long range Sam's to neutralise it. A lot depends on the type of EW package and jammers carried by the bomber. So one cannot predict the outcome 100%.

Also AWACS killer missiles of 300 to 400 km fired by enemy fighters can target the bomber due to their large RCS. This means that the bomber can be targeted at a range where the escort aircraft will not be able to fire their AAMs at the enemy plane.

The US operates many stealth bombers like the B2 but how successful were they in reducing the RCS is unknown. Even with the best of stealth technology you cannot reduce RCS of such a large aircraft beyond a point.

There are many variables in the matrix and one cannot make a statement saying heavy bombers are useless. It is better to be cautious and not under estimate the enemy.

 

[omaebakabaka]

Yes, the heavy bombers will usually not go alone and will be accompanied by fighter aircraft. The usual strategy will be to take out enemy SAM sites and redars and establish air dominance before risking the heavy bombers.

One advantage of having heavy bombers is that they can carry long range cruise missiles in greater numbers. Whereas a Su30 can carry one Brahmos type cruise missile, a bomber can carry probably several of them. Longer range cruise missiles of 1000km or > will be heavier because of extra fuel carried and not all fighters can carry them.

But they are vulnerable without escorts. A system like the S400 will spot them from far because of larger RCS and fire long range Sam's to neutralise it. A lot depends on the type of EW package and jammers carried by the bomber. So one cannot predict the outcome 100%.

Also AWACS killer missiles of 300 to 400 km fired by enemy fighters can target the bomber due to their large RCS. This means that the bomber can be targeted at a range where the escort aircraft will not be able to fire their AAMs at the enemy plane.

The US operates many stealth bombers like the B2 but how successful were they in reducing the RCS is unknown. Even with the best of stealth technology you cannot reduce RCS of such a large aircraft beyond a point.

There are many variables in the matrix and one cannot make a statement saying heavy bombers are useless. It is better to be cautious and not under estimate the enemy.

What escorts? In a war time in supersonic era in an active aerial combat theatre, are the fighters going to slow down to bomber speed or going to fight air battles? Escort is only functional in mostly dominated airspace and peacetime. Not very practicle when opposing side has equal numbers to sport.

 

[Haldilal]

Ya'll Nibbiars ye dar acha hai the Melcchas have rattled to death that the CCP not recognized their causalities and given Martyrdom to them. The Melcchas are criticizing their CCP calling it unfair. Pilots who have died due to aircraft crashes get recognition in China, as did medical personnel who died combating COVID-19. But the PLA are expandable no one cares about them.

 

[Poseidon]

Ya'll Nibbiars Connect the dot Suddenly Ceasefire Violation by Pakistan Army increased post FM level talk between India and China. 46 CFV reported in last 7 days. Core commander level meeting between PLA & IA not yet scheduled. Chinese propaganda machineries activated with full force.

BaBa.

Add Qamar Bajwa visit to strike corps near IB.