Wuhan Coronavirus Thread

[here2where]

Death certificate is an important document in India. No one will dare miss to have it for their dead family members. That data can never be fudged and can be easily accessed. The population census will happen next year if things get back to normal.

Now avoid posting such rants based on propaganda toolkits.

Go count your own dead bodies your 1st world doctors failed to save.

Dig a grave a sniff if they are still rotting, sell some pictures to CNN, we don’t care.

What I understand is death certificates are issued with reason as ‘bimari’ instead of covid related; hence the under-reporting.

 

[cannonfodder]

COVID-19 deaths in India: Why 10x claims of casualties doesn't pass the basic smell test - KushalMehra.com

India is in the middle of its second wave and our social media feeds have morphed into SOS helplines with citizens running pillar to post to arrange medicines and oxygen cylinders. Amid this, the pack of foreign correspondents and their desi counterparts, who in the first wave couldn’t...

kushalmehra.com

For dolts who are claiming 10X deaths.

{ Posting in full }

India is in the middle of its second wave and our social media feeds have morphed into SOS helplines with citizens running pillar to post to arrange medicines and oxygen cylinders. Amid this, the pack of foreign correspondents and their desi counterparts, who in the first wave couldn’t understand why COVID-19 wasn’t killing the natives in sufficient numbers, have made a triumphant comeback. With intrusive pictures of burning pyres that’d shame vultures, the ecosystem that lives for poverty porn is back with many of them claiming that India is grossly underreporting its COVID-19 death numbers.

John Burn-Murdoch of the Financial Times even claimed that the “numbers of Covid victims who have been cremated are 10x larger than official Covid death counts in same areas”.

Now, if you claim that the death toll is twice the government figure, it’s still understandable but if one claims it’s 10 times the number, it fails to pass the basic smell test.

To begin with, the under-reported death figures aren’t part of some grand global conspiracy. This has been happening and will continue to happen across the globe. For example, New York City was accused of underreporting its nursing home deaths by a few thousand that were added to the tally in early February 2021, this pushed their total nursing home resident deaths in the state up from 8,500 to nearly 15,000.

So, it’s quite natural that if one digs deeper, one will find that state governments are underreporting deaths. But that’s not the point. This piece doesn’t carry a brief for any government, nor is it an apologia to reduce the death count. The only thing we are bothered about is the truth.

Now let’s examine the lofty claim that the death rate is 10 times what’s being officially reported. For starters, the criticism of the government’s nefarious schemes has to be consistent. Critics would’ve us believe that the same governments (state and central), which can’t provide basic facilities during the second wave are somehow Machiavellian enough to under-count death rates by a factor of 10!

If the death count was actually 10 times, it’d suggest that both state and central governments, which have a plethora of different political parties, somehow managed to come together on the same page and keep the official numbers down.
And they somehow managed to do so under immense scrutiny from NGOs, media, activists, and the foreign press.

Also, numbers don’t lie.

Also, just to give you some perspective, the current number of deaths as of this moment is 1,98,899. If the number was 10 times, it’d suggest that 20 lakh (or 2 million) people in India had succumbed to COVID-19.

Even a flat earther would think twice before making the aforementioned claim.

By the way, we had the same narrative last year during the 1st wave albeit with a different religion. In 2020 we were flooded with stories of the Muslim burial grounds being overburdened and running out of space and there are dead bodies everywhere.

So is it possible that there were underreported deaths during the 1st wave? Yes, but the key question is by how much? If it was 10 times do you understand the amount of time & in the case of Muslims the amount of space that would be required to bury people? By the way, such stories had cropped up in Mumbai too. But then after a while, it was clear that the chaos was partly because of the spike (which is expected), but, it was primarily because burial grounds were overburdened with COVID-19 protocols.

Another way to decipher all of this is to look at the death rates of 2018 to 2020. We can study the trends and wherever we find gaps we can try to use basic logic to decipher what is happening. So what points should be considered to break this down?

1. What is the spike in terms of absolute numbers of deaths?
2. In which period did this spike happen?
3. Can these numbers be given to COVID completely? If yes, why?

If someone says Yes to point 3 what they are trying to say is that every extra death in India has happened only because of COVID!!! Does that mean deaths by other causes are reported perfectly? Of course, the third point is outrageous, since it’s impossible to believe that Indians have become immune to every other disease.

Let’s look at the data. In Mumbai, 21,000 more deaths (around 23%) were reported in the 2020 calendar year compared to 2019. It was 1,11,942 in 2020 and 91,223 in 2019. The month of May 2020 had by far the highest amount of deaths registered (14328) compared to 7335 deaths from May 2019.

Now here are some points that we should remember when we further analyse this data:

1. When we calculate the excess mortality data we must keep in mind the standard year-on-year rise of deaths by 2 to 2.5%.
2. One must also remember that these are the total number of deaths in the whole year. These numbers do not indicate or consider deaths by various other causes. For eg, during the 1st wave, the entire health infrastructure had collapsed and patients suffering from various other chronic illnesses like cancer, kidney failure, hypertension, and diabetes were denied basic healthcare access. Also, the lockdown had temporarily reduced the rate of deaths by road accidents for a while, but it had also resulted in an increase of deaths by suicides. To get a real picture one might have to look at the age-wise distribution to get an even better idea (COVID-19 does tend to harm the 60 and above age group more).

The official COVID-19 fatality number of Mumbai was 11,116 for the year 2020. So when we take points number 1 and 2 into consideration and try to break down the excess number of deaths, it would be fewer or not more than 2 times the official count.

Another point we need to remember in the case of Mumbai is that the 1st wave had hit the slums disproportionately more than the non-slums. This can be seen by looking at the sero survey conducted by BMC that showed 57% of the people in slums had antibodies to Covid-19 as against 16% in non-slum pockets. How do we know whether the sero survey was right? Well during the second wave the infection spread is completely lopsided in comparison to the 1st wave. Unlike the 1st wave, the 2nd wave in Mumbai has found 90% are concentrated in high-rise buildings while slums account for just 10%. Slum-dwellers do not have the same level of access to quality healthcare in comparison to non-slum dwellers. This is another factor that should be considered when we try to understand the overall mortality narrative.

Let us consider another state for our analysis. The state of Kerala released its all cause-mortality data and as per that Kerala recorded over 16,000 fewer deaths in 2020 compared to the average of the previous five years. The point to be noted here is that Kerala had and still has the 2nd highest number of infections in the entire country.

If one was to consider all these factors the only rational conclusion that can be derived is that the deaths at most could be 2 times what the governments (state and central) claim. It cannot be beyond that. And if someone wants to make the 10 times claim then they should provide the evidence for the same.

Taking some news reports and amplifying them to suggest the entire country is crumbling is not data crunching, it’s simply pandering to the ‘bhay ka mahaul’ narrative without giving facts to substantiate it. In a huge country like India, it’s always possible to find any story to fit one’s narrative but that doesn’t make it the universal truth.

The only way to figure out the real Covid-19 mortality numbers for 2021 would be looking at the annual death data and then trying to make sense out of that after a year in 2022.

As Carl Sagan once said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Nothing substantiates the 10 times claims and stories of crematoriums might excite a naïve audience back home, but it certainly doesn’t pass the muster.

In fact, one would’ve to use a metaphorical blade of two philosophical razors to truly slice through the ridiculous claims of the death porn enthusiasts: Hitchen’s and Hanlon’s. While Hitchen’s states that what can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence, Hanlon’s states: “Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity.”

A close observation would show that we can reject the claims simply because they are being made either from malice or stupidity, neither of which is a great skill for data observation.

Kushal mehra make good videos and logical points. His channel is charvaka podcast. Let other enjoy their poverty porn. It will be remembered.

 

[captscooby81]

One thing this 2nd wave has proved is our countries politics need some serious upgrade . Opposition is shit complete piece of shit there is hardly any cooperation or coordination with govt in any single policy ever since this govt came to power .

Every single move by govt was criticised just for politicisation and which also happened in this Chinese virus pandemic .

From giving stupid rants about vaccine vaccine for 18+ opposition tried to corner govt and govt turned the game by putting ball back in opposition court by opening up 18+ vaccination for state govt's . Now state govt know very well if they divert their 25 % quota vaccination to 18+ instead of 45 plus they will get screwed because deaths will keep increasing in 45+ age group .

So state govt has left with no option but to delay vaccination for 18+ group as they will now have to rush to vaccinate 45+ group first .

Now GoI knows that this 18+ segment with its too much instagram knowledge will be extremely paranoid or super cool to deal with this virus . So simply open up the vaccination to private hospitals at higher cost which helps BB and SII offset the lower pricing vaccines they are giving to GoI

For 18+ who are wondering where to take vaccines , Here is where you should be heading tomorrow but hey its not free so start to sacrifice one of your PVR movie ticket + popcorn price to get vaccinated if you are in a hurry or else wait till GoI open up vaccine below 45 years


Max healthcare likely to start vaccination for 18 plus across NCR tomorrow; Covishield dose likely to be priced at Rs 800-900 including administration charges
@CNBCTV18Live
#Vaccines #COVID19

Max healthcare: ‘Presently vaccines will be available at Max facilities at Panchsheel Park, Patparganj, Shalimar Bagh, Rajinder Place (BLK-Max Hospital), Noida, Vaishali.Citizens will be required to register on CoWin app book an appointment slot before coming for the vaccination’

#CNBCTV18Exclusive | 'Will start a ltd vax rollout for 18-44 yrs tmw', says, Exec Chairperson
@HospitalsApollo
. Kamineni says Apollo will charge ₹800/dose for Covishield & ₹1,200/dose for Covaxin. The cost includes hospital admin charge of ₹200.
@ShereenBhan

Fortis Hospitals will administer Covaxin from tomorrow at Rs 1250/dose; this includes cost of the vaccine and administration charges
@CNBCTV18Live

 

[captscooby81]

Are you saying there is no other disease death happened since March 2020 ? on average india has 20k deaths this was pre covid days . Now covid deaths gets added to that extra numbers . Tell me before 2020 how many news channels covered cremation grounds ? One of my construction site was close to a cremation ground i used to see 2-3 funerals on average in 2018.

This is exactly like those japanese encephalitis deaths of gorakhpur hospitals which got covered once BJP came to power . Deaths were getting reported every day like 20-30 but one sudden day of 100 deaths makes media vultures run their to cover the story and they consciously ignore the fact that same amount of deaths were happening since 2011 in other non BJP govt ruled days .

What I understand is death certificates are issued with reason as ‘bimari’ instead of covid related; hence the under-reporting.

 

[hit&run]

like i said ignorance

As Covid sweeps India, experts say cases and deaths are going unreported

India, home to the world's worst ongoing coronavirus outbreak, has reported more than 17.6 million cases since the pandemic began last year.

www.cnn.com

As Covid-19 Devastates India, Deaths Go Undercounted (Published 2021)

Fatalities have been overlooked or downplayed, understating the human toll of the country’s outbreak, which accounts for nearly half of all new cases in a global surge.

www.nytimes.com

Cremation count shows massive underreporting of Covid toll in Bengaluru | Bengaluru News - Times of India

Between March 1 and April 26, the state government reported 1,422 Covid-related deaths in Bengaluru. Data collated by TOI from 12 dedicated crematoria

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

from you own news

Non-stop cremations cast doubt on India's counting of COVID dead

Gas and firewood furnaces at a crematorium in the western Indian state of Gujarat have been running so long without a break during the COVID-19 pandemic that metal parts have begun to melt.

www.reuters.com

Few points for you with warning:

Stop spamming the thread with links of Western tabloids and propaganda mouth pieces.

The ToI article has not given any methodology, sample size and official links which one can compare.

Only a half literate person these days will blindly use articles published by tabloids as primary source.

I have categorically said it that the data is not fudged in India. It will be made available in due course of time. The official stats are not one window data someone from high office is disseminating. Birth and Death registration registers are maintained by the state government to be specific local municipalities and the numbers can be easily accessed with or without RTI act.

The casualties are happening and no one is denying. Neither the state nor the centre has any interest to hide the numbers like that mutant New York Governor whom CNN pimped and assisted while he hid the numbers and practically wiped down every old age care facility in the city.

Last but not least stop this necrophilia which you are indulging here on our forum. More indulgence may shorten your stay abruptly.

 

[IndianYonko]

Karnataka numbers are going berserk. Today they had 48k+ cases an increase of 13k from yesterday. Banglore urban alone is contributing 26k; Yup Only 4 states have more cases than Banglore Urban: MH, UP, KL, KA.

 

[IndianYonko]

Are you saying there is no other disease death happened since March 2020 ? on average india has 20k deaths this was pre covid days . Now covid deaths gets added to that extra numbers . Tell me before 2020 how many news channels covered cremation grounds ? One of my construction site was close to a cremation ground i used to see 2-3 funerals on average in 2018.

This is exactly like those japanese encephalitis deaths of gorakhpur hospitals which got covered once BJP came to power . Deaths were getting reported every day like 20-30 but one sudden day of 100 deaths makes media vultures run their to cover the story and they consciously ignore the fact that same amount of deaths were happening since 2011 in other non BJP govt ruled days .

30k scrolls reports at 27k+. Caution : Scroll.

 

[here2where]

‘What happens to marginalised people?’
Govt must think of free Covid vaccination for all, says SC
‘Adopt a national immunisation model so that no one is left out’

Govt must think of free Covid vaccination for all, says SC

‘Adopt a national immunisation model so that no one is left out’

www.telegraphindia.com

Another one from these guys - “ostriches dont bury their heads in sand; indian govt does”

 

[lcafanboy]

Thread please...

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread

Acclaimed for cutting short the Ebola epidemic in West Africa and South America's Zika Virus epidemic, key specialists from the US government are set to reach India soon. They will sort through COVID-19 data; review the country’s existing models for the spread of infections and aim to identify...

www.moneycontrol.com

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread
How many of you think that second wave of Corona virus is a Bio warfare unleashed by China along with its ally CONgress?
Even @Hellfire is pointing same..

i have a feeling that we may soon see skirmishes again at LAC or even a full fledged war with China...

 

[captscooby81]

No surprise their lockdown effects will start showing after 10 days only . Right now they are heading towards peak . so funny for a state which had neither election nor any mela .

Once this 2nd wave storm is controlled . GoI should launch a serious case investigation with ICMR across country to understand the real spike for 2nd wave .blaming political rallies and religious festivals is just easier way to put blame on one particular group to wash away ones own responsibility

We need the reason so that we can prepare for 3rd wave

Karnataka numbers are going berserk. Today they had 48k+ cases an increase of 13k from yesterday. Banglore urban alone is contributing 26k; Yup Only 4 states have more cases than Banglore Urban: MH, UP, KL, KA.

 

[Cheran]

‘What happens to marginalised people?’
Govt must think of free Covid vaccination for all, says SC
‘Adopt a national immunisation model so that no one is left out’

Govt must think of free Covid vaccination for all, says SC

‘Adopt a national immunisation model so that no one is left out’

www.telegraphindia.com

Another one from these guys - “ostriches dont bury their heads in sand; indian govt does”

Looks like one day these people might want to "select" PM/CMs/President too.

 

[mokoman]

Thread please...

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread

Acclaimed for cutting short the Ebola epidemic in West Africa and South America's Zika Virus epidemic, key specialists from the US government are set to reach India soon. They will sort through COVID-19 data; review the country’s existing models for the spread of infections and aim to identify...

www.moneycontrol.com

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread
How many of you think that second wave of Corona virus is a Bio warfare unleashed by China along with its ally CONgress?
Even @Hellfire is pointing same..

i have a feeling that we may soon see skirmishes again at LAC or even a full fledged war with China...

@Hellfire seems to be losing his marbles

Looks like one day these people might want to "select" PM/CMs/President too.

I think they soon will.

still , would be nice if atleast BPL category people get it at reduced rates or free.

subsidize it by increasing price for pvt hospitals.

 

[Nicky G]

Thread please...

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread

Acclaimed for cutting short the Ebola epidemic in West Africa and South America's Zika Virus epidemic, key specialists from the US government are set to reach India soon. They will sort through COVID-19 data; review the country’s existing models for the spread of infections and aim to identify...

www.moneycontrol.com

US prepares to deploy CDC's 'disease detectives' in India with the objective of choking the virus spread
How many of you think that second wave of Corona virus is a Bio warfare unleashed by China along with its ally CONgress?
Even @Hellfire is pointing same..

i have a feeling that we may soon see skirmishes again at LAC or even a full fledged war with China...

The sheer speed of this wave along with it being a more deadly mutation clearly indicates of this being a weapon. Plus the geographic point brought out in the thread.

Basically, the Covid was a joint project of Americunt deep state and chini lizards. Main objective was getting Trump out and along with it to push out Modi and install their salves Pappu alleged Gandi.

The larger goal is obviously the remade economy of the world with leftist control. Any leader who'd not agree has to be gotten rid of for their plan to work.

It's not a conspiracy theory. It's simple, always ask the simple question, cui bono? Who benefits?

Who benefited in the US? Who is benefitting here?

Not sure what our apu agencies have informed the government. But if Modi does not buckle down and forget his peaceful image BS, he could likely be out or reduced to being dependant on others to form the next government.

I don't see anything of the sort happening though. Babaji seems to be in some other world.

All of this nonsense of Modi isn't Trump and thus he can't be removed are sheer bluster. The deep state in west are very dangerous with almost unlimited resources. Underestimate them at your own peril.

Basically, this is going to be a dark decade world over, for those who value genuine human rights, equality and freedom. The fascist left backed by globalists is poised to take over the world and very few leaders stand in the way.

The climate change BS is the next on the agenda.

 

[hit&run]

Enough of this necrophilia.

India is second largest in testing COVID swabs.

Having issued 10s of MLC death certificates, presented myself to 10s of courts proceedings to submit first respondent report as attending consultant I known how important and individualistic task it is for on duty Doctor to mention cause of death. The cause of death of a covid positive patient can never be fudged and there are never any instructions to change the same.

To hide the cause you have to totally destroy the admission file which contains History work up detailed by the relative of the patient and patient himself, clinical work up, clinical details, working diagnosis daily 3 to 4 times status update, same details seperatedly recorded by Nurses and visiting specialist, test orders and their reports.

Stop behaving like pedestrians while indulging into Shekhar Gupta’s hunch and guesstimates.

No Doctor will dare to change the cause of death once the report is COVID positive and the same report filed in admission file. Not to mention these days along with hard copy a digital summary is also recorded. A patient admitted for a week can have a file more than 15-20 pages. The file also contains receipts in case of private hospital or private visit for charging purposes. No hospital can legally or for the clinical purposes will touch the file.

Even if consecutive reports become negative the primary cause along with secondary cause will get mentioned in the certificate.

 

[Nicky G]

Nothing to look here, this is not a super spreader event, only Kumbh and Modi rallies are.

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

like i said ignorance

As Covid sweeps India, experts say cases and deaths are going unreported

India, home to the world's worst ongoing coronavirus outbreak, has reported more than 17.6 million cases since the pandemic began last year.

www.cnn.com

As Covid-19 Devastates India, Deaths Go Undercounted (Published 2021)

Fatalities have been overlooked or downplayed, understating the human toll of the country’s outbreak, which accounts for nearly half of all new cases in a global surge.

www.nytimes.com

Cremation count shows massive underreporting of Covid toll in Bengaluru | Bengaluru News - Times of India

Between March 1 and April 26, the state government reported 1,422 Covid-related deaths in Bengaluru. Data collated by TOI from 12 dedicated crematoria

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

from you own news

Non-stop cremations cast doubt on India's counting of COVID dead

Gas and firewood furnaces at a crematorium in the western Indian state of Gujarat have been running so long without a break during the COVID-19 pandemic that metal parts have begun to melt.

www.reuters.com

We kNow , we know now please go to count the dead bodies of usa .
The very grim mark of 500000

 

[Nicky G]

Good thread of all morons who demonized vaccines.

 

[Cheran]

@Hellfire seems to be losing his marbles



I think they soon will.

still , would be nice if atleast BPL category people get it at reduced rates or free.

But i believe, all NDA states & others like Kerala etc are also giving free (?) (Has this changed?)

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

We kNow , we know now please go to count the dead bodies of usa .
The very grim mark of 500000

Not from us 100 percent

 

[angryIndian]

My main point was that the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) has infiltrated western leftist media and is using it to further its own end goals, such as breaking up the quad and pushing India and the US further apart, as well as regime change in India, by CCP influencers writing negative news stories targeting the current Indian government using their western media proxies (and thereby shifting the blame to the west as opposed to the CCP).

Western media's potrayal of India is absolutely spot on however hard it maybe for you to digest.
They are not targeting but questioning the government which should have been done by our own media.