Stumpp Schuele & Somappa Defence LTD

Lonewarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
3,570
Likes
12,150
Country flag
I have already discussed with mods.
We have a DFI Twitter account.
Let's make a Set of questions and request them to answer them and clear all the doubt regarding their claim.

Currently SSS is enjoying the cheers of Fanboys if they are genuine we support them if they talk hababaji we will peg them down.
And I've also said, simply ask them to mention all the patents.
 

Suryavanshi

Cheeni KLPDhokebaaz
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2017
Messages
16,330
Likes
70,171
And I've also said, simply ask them to mention all the patents.
They won't do it if we don't ask them.
The Twitter fanboy crowd doesn't bother with facts.
I am asking u again can u and Jhonny baba collab to make a set of Questions to be asked on DFIs Behalf?
 

Lonewarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
3,570
Likes
12,150
Country flag
They won't do it if we don't ask them.
The Twitter fanboy crowd doesn't bother with facts.
I am asking u again can u and Jhonny baba collab to make a set of Questions to be asked on DFIs Behalf?
But end of the day, will that make any difference?

They will claim whatever they wish to.
Just have a look at the latest tweets of Vivek Krishan.
 

Suryavanshi

Cheeni KLPDhokebaaz
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2017
Messages
16,330
Likes
70,171
But end of the day, will that make any difference?

They will claim whatever they wish to.
Just have a look at the latest tweets of Vivek Krishan.
Yes its gonna make a difference we are a reputed forum. We will sow a seed of wariness among the masses.

Are u in or nah?
 

ezsasa

Designated Cynic
Mod
Joined
Jul 12, 2014
Messages
31,595
Likes
146,430
Country flag
@ezsasa let's roll.

U get the user Id and password from @LurkerBaba

@Lonewarrior @Johny_Baba are gonna collect the data.
Twitter is not the best format for such Q&A, mail would be better format. SSS is under no obligation to answer as a private company. Our objective should be to promote local defence industry, not create controversy while they are in midst of their product development cycle. As pioneers they will have enough competitors who want to take them down at every given chance.

i defer to @LurkerBaba on this one.
 

Suryavanshi

Cheeni KLPDhokebaaz
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2017
Messages
16,330
Likes
70,171
Twitter is not the best format for such Q&A, mail would be better format. SSS is under no obligation to answer as a private company. Our objective should be to promote local defence industry, not create controversy while they are in midst of their product development cycle. As pioneers they will have enough competitors who want to take them down at every given chance.

i defer to @LurkerBaba on this one.
we have some substantial evidence against them, regardless we will first mail them and then if they dont reply we will go to twitter albeit with some tone down approach.
we aren't just any run off the mill Twitter Jingo, we are a legit forum with 100 active Members at any given time, nows the time to act like it.
 

AZTEC

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
286
Likes
1,530
Country flag
Fun Fact

The rifles made by SSSD are “extremely impressive, said Vladimir Onokoy, a Russian defense industry specialist and firearms instructor.
Here’s a video by Vladimir Onokoy for Kalashnikov concern (for those who have not yet seen him):
 

Lonewarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
3,570
Likes
12,150
Country flag
Fun Fact

The rifles made by SSSD are “extremely impressive, said Vladimir Onokoy, a Russian defense industry specialist and firearms instructor.
If a firearm manufacturers praises other manufacturer's product then it means either its way better than theirs or they are well aware that in given time frame by no means it will be a competition.
 

AZTEC

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
286
Likes
1,530
Country flag
If a firearm manufacturers praises other manufacturer's product then it means either its way better than theirs or they are well aware that in given time frame by no means it will be a competition.
I disagree. Vladimir commented in his personal capacity in a blog; he doesn’t appear to be sarcastic.

If SSSD was a fraud, NSG wouldn’t have agreed to conduct sniper trials.

Moreover, if Belgium can make FN SCAR, then India can also make a SCAR-equivalent. Why? Because, India can make sophisticated ASAT weapons which Belgium can’t.

Think about it. It’s as simple as that (whether you like it or not).

If SSSD is reverse-engineering components from foreign OEMs, then I fully support them. Why? Because that’s what USA, USSR, and more recently, China did. The fastest way for India to leapfrog it’s way to great power status is to steal/reverse-engineer foreign tech.
 

Lonewarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
3,570
Likes
12,150
Country flag
I disagree. Vladimir commented in his personal capacity in a blog; he doesn’t appear to be sarcastic.

If SSSD was a fraud, NSG wouldn’t have agreed to conduct sniper trials.

Moreover, if Belgium can make FN SCAR, then India can also make a SCAR-equivalent. Why? Because, India can make sophisticated ASAT weapons which Belgium can’t.

Think about it. It’s as simple as that (whether you like it or not).

If SSSD is reverse-engineering components from foreign OEMs, then I fully support them. Why? Because that’s what USA, USSR, and more recently, China did. The fastest way for India to leapfrog it’s way to great power status is to steal/reverse-engineer foreign tech.
Ok, so again these points. There's no point in arguing.

Lemme ask you one question.
You said, "If SSSD is reverse-engineering components from foreign OEMs, then I fully support them."
And what if they aren't?
 

Holy Triad

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Dec 16, 2018
Messages
4,110
Likes
24,158
Country flag
Just noticed after the vk singh sir holding rifle,the SSS receiver is significantly smaller than typical ak receiver.

Typical ak stamped receivers have gap between under the barrel n the receiver,even in modern ak12/15 receivers.



free floated lower hand guards use this space for attaching lower hand guards.


The reason the space exist because,the pronounced sloping bottom has to accommodate(or act has a) the mag well,
trigger group assembly and the pistol grip.


Sss reduced the height close enough to house the trigger group but not enough room to for mag well. So they added a new mag well.

The reduction of height also means,the position of typical ak pistol grip will be few centimeters higher,so I speculate they added an ar mount.



That new image shows that gas tube ends few centimeters before the trunion,looks like it is free floated(typical ak gas tube would be tightly secured with rear sight post).


Theoretically Free floating the gas tube along with barrel will improve the barrel harmonics.

Afaik Arsenals ak 20 have that feature.





Only thing baffling to me is,in that cad image, in the ejection port something strange going on.

We can see the what appears to be the chamber area which is visible. Usually ak bolt sits flush with the trunion.

One explanation is It's possible they took picture of half cocked position.

Otherwise the bolt appears to be a typical ak bolt.
 

AZTEC

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
286
Likes
1,530
Country flag
Ok, so again these points. There's no point in arguing.

Lemme ask you one question.
You said, "If SSSD is reverse-engineering components from foreign OEMs, then I fully support them."
And what if they aren't?
Then they would be out of business; they won’t earn money.

No professional military would purchase their firearms if what they are offering is only a cocktail of components from foreign OEMs; most professional militaries will first visit their factory before placing an order. It would be a rudimentary task for militaries to figure out SSSD’s production capabilities by surveying their factories.

It’s as simple as that.


Vivek Krishnan has probably dropped a slight hint in his interview with Livefist that they may be reverse-engineering stuff. Watch it carefully.

Nevertheless, SSSD has already said that they have decades of industrial expertise in manufacturing springs. What they have done is that they have TRANSLATED this expertise into firearm manufacturing.

It’s like translating from one language to another.

Is it really so hard to comprehend this?
 

Lonewarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
3,570
Likes
12,150
Country flag
Typical ak stamped receivers have gap between under the barrel n the receiver,even in modern ak12/15 receivers.
They also have that gap. There is approximately 12-14mm of gap from bottom of the barrel to inside of the handguard.

Sss reduced the height close enough to house the trigger group but not enough room to for mag well. So they added a new mag well
I don't think so. My intuitions tell it's there only for cosmetic reasons. Coz AFAIK, no one needs a "magwell" in an AK. Though unless you have developed some kind of novel drop free functionality for standard AK mags. AK mags are nose-in-rock-back, you just need a cutout in front and mag release in rear.

The reduction of height also means,the position of typical ak pistol grip will be few centimeters higher,so I speculate they added an ar mount.
They added AR grips because that's what they can get from Canada. In few pics the rifle is using standard AK grips made by Houge USA, but they know they can't use that because of ITAR.

That new image shows that gas tube ends few centimeters before the trunion,looks like it is free floated(typical ak gas tube would be tightly secured with rear sight post).
Indeed there is some weird sh*t going on there. But the gas tube is connected to the trunnion.

Only thing baffling to me is,in that cad image, in the ejection port something strange going on.

We can see the what appears to be the chamber area which is visible. Usually ak bolt sits flush with the trunion.

One explanation is It's possible they took picture of half cocked position.
It's using standard AK trunnion. And ya, the BCG looks slightly out of battery. And also interestingly, it seems to lack a bolt. You can clearly see the trunnion locking lugs in background.

Otherwise the bolt appears to be a typical ak bolt.
Indeed.
 

Holy Triad

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Dec 16, 2018
Messages
4,110
Likes
24,158
Country flag
hhmm i think it's standard sized, Gen V K Singh maybe having big hands who knows,
need something to scale tbh

Yeah, I might be wrong

Anyway I add one more point on this,

Notice the trunion mounting points,usually ak's use rivets to secure the trunion. Which is typically higher in the receiver point.

But in the sss's case its dab in the middle of it(secured with screws like in scar) Thats what made me to think about the "gap".

If it's a typical ak trunion,Either it sits pretty low or the receiver dimension smaller as I mentioned.

We need hq pics with next to something to scale to be sure
 

Johny_Baba

अज्ञानी
Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
3,754
Likes
19,210
Country flag
found another pic of same event involving Gen V K Singh and this kalashnikov derivative rifle by SSS

3.jpg


As i said before in my previous post that the magwell on SSS' AK could be a separate piece from receiver,pic seems vindicating the claim.
Also as said by @Lonewarrior that the mag well is purely cosmetic to provide "modern look" to the firearm maybe,
notice the certain gap between that magazine and magwell here,
to me it seems that magazine still sits on the troo "internal magwell" (or locking recess inside the receiver to be more precise) than this additional thing as there is certain gap between the magazine and this mag well,that would made it even more wobbly than a standard AK's magazine would be on it without any such mag well,thwarting the whole purpose of fixing magazine on a magwell.
so i agree with Lonewarrior that said magwell very well could be installed on it to give some good look to the rifle.

Also some other example that such magwell on AK aren't that necessary,this time with Galil ACE which also happen to have polymer lower piece fastened on its receiver with a magwell and so on it.

Some user of Galil ACE 31 (a variant with small 8 inch barrel on it) did not like that pistol grip on it much and unfortunately for him the rifle was provided with this big polymer grip fixated on its receiver so to replace it he had to take out whole thing apart and eventually he just "downgraded" it to regular galil with custom working and things.

you can clearly see from the pics that after modification the same small rifle could very well sit magazines on it so the given mag well wasn't necessary for functioning of the rifle.

1597921612106.png

1597921945979.png

another example of same with full length rifle
1597921967919.png
 

Global Defence

Articles

Top