Main Battle Tanks and Armour Technology

[Damian]

I would like to know how much successful the Polish military - industrial production is and it arms acceptability in open global market competition ... How much billion $ of arms export from Poland ?? There was much chest thumping going on for sometime of the brilliant polish minds and fantastic design concepts that will revolutionize the Tank and APC world wide...

Do you have any Idea how much billion $ of order placed for Indian companies ??

Well, guess who's ARV design Indian Army uses, yup, our WZT-3M based on PT-91 hull.

India purchased 556 WZT-3M.

India also purchased 196 older WZT-2.

We also offer even more modern WZT-4:

 

[Damian]

There was much chest thumping going on for sometime of the brilliant polish minds and fantastic design concepts that will revolutionize the Tank and APC world wide...

As for our new project, it is codenamed UMPG or Uniwersalna Modułowa Platforma Gąsienicowa/Universal Modular Tracked Platform. It is a medium weight vehicle designed to be abasis for light and medium tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, armored personell carriers, armored recovery vehicles, medical treatment vehicles, command and control vehicles, self propelled artillery and mortars, anti air vehicles, engineering vehicles etc.

First technology demonstrator of new platform was WPB (Wielozadaniowa Platforma Bojowa/Multirole Combat Platform) codenamed "Anders". This vehicle was builded as a single test example, and through it's tests was presented in 5 different configurations.

First variant presented was a light/medium tank with low profile turret armed with 120mm smoothbore low recoil gun loaded by autoloader mechanism in turret bustle.

Second variant also light/medium tank with Belgian CT-CV turret armed with low recoil rifled 105mm gun.

Third variant was infantry fighting vehicle with Hitfist-30P manned turret, this is the same turret used on our "Rosomak" APC.

Fourth variant is also infantry fighting vehicle, but this time it have unmanned Hitfist-OWS turret.

This is fifth variant, which is very interesting vehicle, it is completely unmanned and can move in autonomous mode. It is armed with "Amur" unmanned turret modules armed with 4x Spike ATGM's and 4x Grom AA missiles.

This is diagram showing the whole concept of the UMPG platform.

And this is PL-01 concept vehicle of the new medium tank "Gepard", this is based on the CV90 as the real prototype of the UMPGH platform is still in development, this vehicle only shows how more or less "Gepard" will look like in future.

This video present projected features of "Gepard", first prototype is scheduled to be builded in 2016.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

India is vast and diversed in terms of terrain diversity ..

For mountains you need light tanks specially when opposite doing the same ..

 

[Damian]

That is too little for so much Polish chest thumping and what not... The order for AKASH SAM is ~ 8 billion dollar, if I am not wrong... it may be more than that...

It is not how much you spend your money, but how. You can actually achieve more by spending less. The above examples show what we can do with limited budget.

Also I may remind you, that Poland is one of these states that heavy invest in such areas like hybrid engines for vehicles or nanotechnology.

For example WPB "Anders" in it's fifth variant presented above, is propelled by prototype hybrid diesel-electric engine.

 

[bose]

Actually I was talking about the calculations as abhi was asking if the figures were correct or not.

Also in wikpedia it is given Indian Army`s order for Akash Sam is 4.3 billion USD. As I have said earlier I have little knowledge on this things so I cannot comment further.

My figure for AKASH SAM seems to be correct if you include the orders from Army & Air Force combined... very close to it...

My point it Poland might have made some progress in Tank & APC or in small arms design by borrowing from Germany or else where... I find it amusing when the some forum members specially from Poland start falling on each others to argue that Poland is something that we in third world countries need to follow as an shinny example... Shit ... I want to know Poland's progress in shipbuilding, submarines, ballistic missiles, SAM's, fighter aircraft's, helicopters etc etc...

 

[bose]

It is not how much you spend your money, but how. You can actually achieve more by spending less. The above examples show what we can do with limited budget.

Also I may remind you, that Poland is one of these states that heavy invest in such areas like hybrid engines for vehicles or nanotechnology.

For example WPB "Anders" in it's fifth variant presented above, is propelled by prototype hybrid diesel-electric engine.

How many $ you have earned by selling those fancy looking toys ??? else it will end up in exhibitions and museums...

 

[bose]

Well, guess who's ARV design Indian Army uses, yup, our WZT-3M based on PT-91 hull.

India purchased 556 WZT-3M.

India also purchased 196 older WZT-2.

We also offer even more modern WZT-4:

Proud of these old junks ??? Holy Shit...

 

[Damian]

My point it Poland might have made some progress in Tank & APC or in small arms design by borrowing from Germany or else where... I find it amusing when the some forum members specially from Poland start falling on each others to argue that Poland is something that we in third world countries need to follow as an shinny example... Shit ... I want to know Poland's progress in shipbuilding, submarines, ballistic missiles, SAM's, fighter aircraft's, helicopters etc etc...

In shipbuilding we currently develop several vessels designed to operate mainly on the Baltic sea.

However as these are in development, not good images or graphic are avaiable yet, neither their final specs.

We do not build submarines, and we do not plan to have our own design.

Ballistic missiles are also not in our interest.

SAM's are a field of expertise we develop several new sollutions. Actually we have rather large expertise in VSHORAD, SHORAD and medium range AA systems.

This is PPZR Grom, that have very large success against Russian aircrafts in Georgia, currently we prepare it's improved variant Piorun.

This is our modernization of the ZSU-23-4, it's new designation is ZSU-23-4MP Biała. We replaced it's fire control system and radar, currently this vehicle use optoelectronic sights instead of radar, thus is much more difficult to be detected. Besides it's standard armament, it also have 4x Grom or in future Piorun missiles.

This is PZA Loara, there was also missiles variant PZR Loara. This project is currently stalled, as it is anticipated that it will be in it's final form most likely placed on UMPG chassis.

This is Poprad, it can use Grom or in future Piorun missiles.

And there is much more examples of new missiles systems, modernizations of older soviet systems, new radars etc. However this is still work in progress and it is anticipated that most of these systems will enter service after 2020.

Fighter aircrafts are beyond our capabilities at the moment.

Helicopters, we actually have several good designs of our own.

SW-4 light weight helicopter.

W-3 medium weight helicopter.

 

[Damian]

How many $ you have earned by selling those fancy looking toys ??? else it will end up in exhibitions and museums...

This is still work in progress project, as I said, final prototype is expected to be revealed in 2016.

Proud of these old junks ??? Holy Shit...

Old junk? WZT-3 is relatively new medium weight ARV, inducted in to service in 1990's, WZT-4 is even newer, developed in 2008-2010, Malaysia purchased 6 to accompany their PT-91M also manufactured in Poland.

 

[bose]

In shipbuilding we currently develop several vessels designed to operate mainly on the Baltic sea.

However as these are in development, not good images or graphic are avaiable yet, neither their final specs.

We do not build submarines, and we do not plan to have our own design.

Ballistic missiles are also not in our interest.

SAM's are a field of expertise we develop several new sollutions. Actually we have rather large expertise in VSHORAD, SHORAD and medium range AA systems.

This is PPZR Grom, that have very large success against Russian aircrafts in Georgia, currently we prepare it's improved variant Piorun.

This is our modernization of the ZSU-23-4, it's new designation is ZSU-23-4MP Biała. We replaced it's fire control system and radar, currently this vehicle use optoelectronic sights instead of radar, thus is much more difficult to be detected. Besides it's standard armament, it also have 4x Grom or in future Piorun missiles.

This is PZA Loara, there was also missiles variant PZR Loara. This project is currently stalled, as it is anticipated that it will be in it's final form most likely placed on UMPG chassis.

This is Poprad, it can use Grom or in future Piorun missiles.

And there is much more examples of new missiles systems, modernizations of older soviet systems, new radars etc. However this is still work in progress and it is anticipated that most of these systems will enter service after 2020.

Fighter aircrafts are beyond our capabilities at the moment.

Helicopters, we actually have several good designs of our own.

SW-4 light weight helicopter.

W-3 medium weight helicopter.

So it proves that Poland military - industrial complex is too small... narrowed down to only in the areas of Tanks, APC and small arms that only you can boast off... That what suits Poland.....

Where as India's has military - industrial complexes stretched from Submarines, Frigate, Destroyers, Aircraft Carriers, Fighter Jets, Helicopters, Ballistic Missiles, Tanks, APC, Artillery, medium and small arms and oh yes space based satellites for military use... Its own navigational systems very similar to GPS...

Come back when you have achieved half of those mentioned above...

 

[Damian]

So it proves that Poland military - industrial complex is too small... narrowed down to only in the areas of Tanks, APC and small arms that only you can boast off... That what suits Poland.....

You should know however that we are rebuilding our military industrial complex, in the past we manufactured much more, for example many types of navy vessels. There is a lot to do.

Where as India's has military - industrial complexes stretched from Submarines, Frigate, Destroyers, Aircraft Carriers, Fighter Jets, Helicopters, Ballistic Missiles, Tanks, APC, Artillery, medium and small arms and oh yes space based satellites for military use... Its own navigational systems very similar to GPS...

Come back when you have achieved half of those mentioned above...

Well, actually Poland is one of few countries on this planet that actually is a leader in artillery systems, India is not even close in what we developed and are developing.

AHS "Krab", currently in production, we plan to have 120 of these.

AHS "Kryl", currently in development.

SMA "Rak" automatic mortar, production will start soon.

WR-40 Langusta MLRS.

This is how WR-300 Homar will look like, it will be equivalent to US Army HIMARS and M270 MLRS.

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

those are polish who have greater hand in development of america
.
those are polish whom obama and billgates calls cleverest in the world
.
billgates said that if america stop migration of polish then I have to shift microsoft at poland
.
tanks will be miserable if there are no polish

 

[bose]

You should know however that we are rebuilding our military industrial complex, in the past we manufactured much more, for example many types of navy vessels. There is a lot to do.

Here you go... now come to the point that you are limited space to play with...

Well, actually Poland is one of few countries on this planet that actually is a leader in artillery systems, India is not even close in what we developed and are developing.

AHS "Krab", currently in production, we plan to have 120 of these.

AHS "Kryl", currently in development.

SMA "Rak" automatic mortar, production will start soon.

WR-40 Langusta MLRS.

This is how WR-300 Homar will look like, it will be equivalent to US Army HIMARS and M270 MLRS.

Do you have something to show to intercept a ballistic missile some 2000 KM away ?? India has

 

[Damian]

those are polish who have greater hand in development of america
.
those are polish whom obama and billgates calls cleverest in the world
.
billgates said that if america stop migration of polish then I have to shift microsoft at poland
.
tanks will be miserable if there are no polish

How a primitive way to mock people due to their nationality. But don't worry, I am rather imprevious to primitive mocking of savages.

 

[Damian]

Do you have something to show to intercept a ballistic missile some 2000 KM away ?? India has

Currently in development. Yes we will have our own ABM system and also we will host US ABM system, the land based version of their "Aegis" system with SM-3 missiles.

However I can't show you anything yet because as I said, it is work in progress. I can only show new short range missiles BÅ‚yskawica.

On static display...

...during test firing.

Błyskawica will be missiles used in the short range "Narew" system, and there will be medium range "Wisła" system, long range protection will be provided by US "Aegis" system land based version.

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

DRDO 155 mm artillery gun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.
Indigenous artillery gun 'Dhanush' to be ready this year - TOI Mobile | The Times of India Mobile Site
.
and there are many more Business Standard
.
new born baby ,poland is nowhere

 

[bose]

How a primitive way to mock people due to their nationality. But don't worry, I am rather imprevious to primitive mocking of savages.

Stop demeaning Indian efforts however small it maybe... else you will be paid back the same way...

 

[Damian]

Stop demeaning Indian efforts however small it maybe... else you will be paid back the same way...

If I criticize something, I use arguments, like design weaknesses, I don't give a damn about nationality, neither I mock someone due to nationality.

DRDO 155 mm artillery gun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.
Indigenous artillery gun 'Dhanush' to be ready this year - TOI Mobile | The Times of India Mobile Site
.
and there are many more Business Standard
.
new born baby ,poland is nowhere

Show me these things in service first, or at least during tests.

I can show you AHS Krab during tests or on proving grounds during first training of our artillerymen.

We are far ahead of India in artillery systems.

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

dhruv has been exported to
.
Two Sarang Dhruvs performing close
flight manoeuvres
India
Indian Air Force [111]
Indian Army Aviation Corps [112]
Border Security Force (8 on order)
[113]
Indian Navy [114]
Israel
Ministry of Defense[115]
Nepal
Nepalese Army Air Service[115]
Ecuador
Ecuadorian Air Force[116]
Suriname
Surinamese National Army[117]
Mauritius
Mauritius Police Force[118]
Maldives
.
and afghanistan

 

[bose]

Currently in development. Yes we will have our own ABM system and also we will host US ABM system, the land based version of their "Aegis" system with SM-3 missiles.

However I can't show you anything yet because as I said, it is work in progress. I can only show new short range missiles BÅ‚yskawica.

On static display...

...during test firing.

Błyskawica will be missiles used in the short range "Narew" system, and there will be medium range "Wisła" system, long range protection will be provided by US "Aegis" system land based version.

Indians are building the same with 1/5 of the development cost of USA...