Know Your 'Rafale'

[TPFscopes]

He gave only obvious details which came true. Most of his words which sound like insider secrets are just hoax.

I am not newbie. You do not know my past:biggrin2:. I have even got banned from IDF after I destroyed one of the moderator and ripped off his nonsensical charades. Many of my posts were deleted too, those bloody bastards.

So, trust me, PARIKRAMA only does gimmicks and some people who have grown up in straightforward environment or who are dumb will believe him. I have grown up in a treacherous environment and have grown sharp senses as adaptation to it. It is difficult to fool me that easily

Vijyes, I don't know why are you always on fire.. but many times I cross checked that data (especially about LCA) mostly were found to be true. Rest of the projects are not in my concern. So that is why can't say anything about other projects and plans..

Dude, your kalkí theme is a pure waste of time and now you should discuss on the relevant matter with appropriate data and topics.

Anyways, it is also a rigid truth that IN is moving ahead towards Rafale-M ,even with a good pace. Discussions on table are in spontaneous mode and you can expect decisions in coming few months/weeks.

Good Day..

 

[Kshithij]

Vijyes, I don't know why are you always on fire.. but many times I cross checked that data (especially about LCA) mostly were found to be true. Rest of the projects are not in my concern. So that is why can't say anything about other projects and plans..

Dude, your kalkí theme is a pure waste of time and now you should discuss on the relevant matter with appropriate data and topics.

Anyways, it is also a rigid truth that IN is moving ahead towards Rafale-M ,even with a good pace. Discussions on table are in spontaneous mode and you can expect decisions in coming few months/weeks.

Good Day..

See, there are certain things which are obvious and he uses that in addition to his crap to make his posts appear. No one will believe in his theory if everything is fiction. There is a saying - best lies have 80% truth. But he unnecessarily adds 'doval' to make things spicy. It is almost impossible for anyone yo have such kind of special knowledge. It is easily catchable

Indigenous production is the only way to go. War is not about child play with throwing stones. Just like you don't import soldiers, you don't import equipment.


It is true that Rafale M is going to be bought. I had told this several times. India has to buy more Rafale in return for fine tuning Kaveri. Naturally, no one will agree for this many offset as Rafale did for 36 planes. A minimum of 100+ is the criteria for offset. Since Naval Rafale is important, it will be bought to replace MiG29. I am sure more normal rafales will also be bought.

I am stating things with data here. It is just that Kalki itself is the data which you won't believe in because you don't like it.

The whole point of industry is to better prepare for war. Everything today - computers, radio, satellite, is a war effort. US is world power because of petrodollars. Russia is powerful because of natural resources and its usage for war preparations. Japan is not considered stronger than France or Uk because it has lower military might. After food, the next thing that you must think of is war. There is a reason why Mahabharatha and Ramayana is popular

PS- good guess about my ID.

 

[TPFscopes]

Sirji MII Rafale is already down the drain. Where is the Guarantee or the Certification from the Dassault for MII Rafale. And what will be the TOT, Know How, Know Why, trf to India????

(Are you saying that they going to take the Guarantee of Chhota Bhai's MII who never manufactured even a SCREW???)

As per the DRAL plan, they will not going to just assemble the knocked down kits. They will manufacture the most of the parts here at DRAL facility which require ToT for obvious. And as Dassault is the partner of 49% in DRAL, DRAL will guarantee and certify the jets within India as they will also have their own runways at facility.

There is a lot of difference in JV and licence production. Here at DRAL Dassault will lead the production.

P.S.: How you arrived at the figures of $91M ~ $94M, kindly inform about the same in detail.

=>

Of the total reported amount, €3.42 billion is for the cost of the platform; another €1.8 billion is for support and infrastructure supplies; €1.7 billion will be spent to meet India-specific changes on the aircraft; €710 million is the additional weapons package; and €353 million is the cost of performance-based logistics support, the MoD official said.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...-deal-with-france-for-36-rafale-fighter-jets/

Just for information, DRAL may assemble 1 or 2 Rafales here at Indian facility to showoff its skills by using knocked down kits (from already placed orders)

 

[Bhoot Pishach]

As per the DRAL plan, they will not going to just assemble the knocked down kits. They will manufacture the most of the parts here at DRAL facility which require ToT for obvious.

What Vendors are going to supply DRAL???? Do these Vendors exists in India and what are their experience and competency in manufacturing Aviation Components???

And the Components starts right from Rivets, bolts, washers, seals upto critical parts of Fuselage, Electronic control components and the list goes on and on.

It is foolish to say all the components will be manufactured by DRAL what is the capacity and competency of DRAL.

And as Dassault is the partner of 49% in DRAL, DRAL will guarantee and certify the jets within India as they will also have their own runways at facility.

Who the fcuk is DRAL to take the guarantee and in what authority???? So Dassault France will wash off it's hands from any responsibility, very good.

There is a lot of difference in JV and licence production. Here at DRAL Dassault will lead the production.
https://www.defensenews.com/global/asia-pacific/2016/09/23/india-inks-deal-with-france-for-36-rafale-fighter-jets/ Just for information, DRAL may assemble 1 or 2 Rafales here at Indian facility to showoff its skills by using knocked down kits (from already placed orders)

Boss nobody is paying attention towards this drama. Dassault France has already washed its hands off for Guarantee and Certification of any Rafale made in India.

No TOT will be transferred.

DRAL, if this drama is performed will be assembling complete CKD's, imported from France, that is too without any guarantee of Dassualt France.

 

[Tactical Frog]

Vishnu Som has posted some cool videos on his Instagram

https://t.co/1kc2PMpkx4

 

[Kshithij]

What Vendors are going to supply DRAL???? Do these Vendors exists in India and what are their experience and competency in manufacturing Aviation Components???

And the Components starts right from Rivets, bolts, washers, seals upto critical parts of Fuselage, Electronic control components and the list goes on and on.

It is foolish to say all the components will be manufactured by DRAL what is the capacity and competency of DRAL.



Who the fcuk is DRAL to take the guarantee and in what authority???? So Dassault France will wash off it's hands from any responsibility, very good.



Boss nobody is paying attention towards this drama. Dassault France has already washed its hands off for Guarantee and Certification of any Rafale made in India.

No TOT will be transferred.

DRAL, if this drama is performed will be assembling complete CKD's, imported from France, that is too without any guarantee of Dassualt France.

The manufacture of rivets bolts etc are already in India - for Tejas manufacturing. The main problem is in specific rafale parts like avionics, fly-by-wire, EW suite, radar, source code etc.

DRAL can manufacture the airframe but not these electronic items. Even turkey manufactures F35 fuselage and some things like display HUD etc.

I don't think too much ToT is involved. The part if airframe and assembly may be done here, including engine assembly. But the rest will be imported with adjustments for appropriate weapons systems as India desires - like Israeli helmet mounts etc.

DRAL will have less ToT than Su30. At least in Su30, we have engine FADEC written by us, avionics designed by us and even some fly-by-wire codes by us. Rafale will be far less powerful than Su30, have too low indigenous content comparatively and will be more expensive. The only reason I see for going with Rafale is Kaveri engine's fine tuning.

 

[Bhoot Pishach]

The manufacture of rivets bolts etc are already in India - for Tejas manufacturing. The main problem is in specific rafale parts like avionics, fly-by-wire, EW suite, radar, source code etc.

DRAL can manufacture the airframe but not these electronic items. Even turkey manufactures F35 fuselage and some things like display HUD etc.

I don't think too much ToT is involved. The part if airframe and assembly may be done here, including engine assembly. But the rest will be imported with adjustments for appropriate weapons systems as India desires - like Israeli helmet mounts etc.

DRAL will have less ToT than Su30. At least in Su30, we have engine FADEC written by us, avionics designed by us and even some fly-by-wire codes by us. Rafale will be far less powerful than Su30, have too low indigenous content comparatively and will be more expensive. The only reason I see for going with Rafale is Kaveri engine's fine tuning.

Thank DRDO and HAL for the Vendor base existing in India.

Rafale will bring glitch.

Keep yourself happy with Screw Driver.

 

[Screambowl]

I dont want to know rafale any more.
Neither i am getting one nor i am flying
The day it gets to indian skies wake me up

 

[Kshithij]

Thank DRDO and HAL for the Vendor base existing in India.

Rafale will bring glitch.

Keep yourself happy with Screw Driver.

As I said, I believe that Rafale was chosen solely for some ToT and fine tuning Kaveri engine. Otherwise, by all means, Su30 was cheaper and better than Rafale.

 

[Tactical Frog]

I dont want to know rafale any more.
Neither i am getting one nor i am flying
The day it gets to indian skies wake me up

Rafale should have come faster (sob). I am sorry about this . When Modi said the magical words (36 Rafale in fly away condition) nobody could possibly imagine it would take almost one year and a half to get the deal done.

Less than two years till we will see these birds flying above majestic Rajasthan ...

 

[sorcerer]

First Rafale will land in India by 2019: Trappier

Facility to support 200 SMEs, says Dassault Aviation chief
Eric Trappier, chairman of the €3.6 billion Dassault Aviation, was recently in India to lay the foundation stone of Dassault Reliance Aerospace Limited (DRAL’s) manufacturing facility at Mihan in Nagpur. With production from DRAL expected to start as early as 2018 and the first Rafale expected to land in India in 2019, Mr. Trappier talks about Dassault’s future plans and getting repeat orders for Rafale combat jets from the Indian government. Edited excerpts:

When can we expect the first Rafale to land in India?

As we have planned, the first Rafale should land in India in 2019. It’s on track.

How many Rafale jets would be made in India as part of the offset clause?

It’s not a question of how many Rafale [jets] will be made in India for the first 36 order that we have got. Certain parts of Rafale and Falcon are going to be manufactured in India to start with. We will take a step-by-step approach and we will start manufacturing parts of Rafale in this facility. If there are new orders, we will look at manufacturing here. We are sure that it’s win-win situation. Manufacturing in India is going to be the next step and it depends upon the new orders. For the new orders for Rafale, the jet would be made totally in India.

How do you intend to fulfil the offset commitment of ₹30,000 crore of the ₹60,000 crore order?

This is something very important because our company has a very old history with India. We have been continuously supplying to India for the past 65 years. This was possible because of our aircraft and we have a very strategic relationship between France and India. Our government has signed an agreement to supply 36 Rafale jets to India with 50% offset obligation. We will fulfil all our contractual obligations.

What gives you the confidence that you will get repeat orders for Rafale?

As of now, we are proposing it to the government but it’s up to the government to go ahead. We have capability to prove that our fighter [jet] is good. It has been bought already. We will deliver the support. We now have the capability to manufacture the aircraft in India. We think we have the right tools to convince the government for repeat orders.

Is the scope of this partnership with Reliance restricted to Rafale?

This is a unique opportunity to start manufacturing in India. With our partner Reliance, we also intend to manufacture our business jet Falcon. The first Falcon will soon take off from Indian soil.

There are concerns in certain quarters that India is overpaying for the current Rafale deal. Your comments?

You have to ask them [the government] this question.

Why have you chosen Reliance Group, which with no prior experience in defence, as your JV Partner?

We are starting with a private company [that wants] to become a global player. I am a private company. It’s an equal partnership. We are investing €100 million for our 49% stake.

What employment opportunities will this JV create?

As chairman of French Aerospace Industries Association, I will lead a big delegation of French SMEs here in the coming months. Our facility here will support over 200 SMEs to secure the component and avionics manufacturing needs of Rafale and Falcon jets. It’s not only about Rafale and Dassault. Our French partners and partners of the Reliance Group will set up their facilities here.



http://www.thehindu.com/business/fi...in-india-by-2019-trappier/article20353791.ece

 

[BON PLAN]

Rafale will be far less powerful than Su30,

??? so why India not just orders more of these famous, reliable, affordable SU30 ?

 

[BON PLAN]

As I said, I believe that Rafale was chosen solely for some ToT and fine tuning Kaveri engine. Otherwise, by all means, Su30 was cheaper and better than Rafale.

 

[Kshithij]

You have found the answer to this question already, I guess as seen in your successive comment

??? so why India not just orders more of these famous, reliable, affordable SU30 ?

 

[BON PLAN]

Rafale should have come faster (sob). I am sorry about this . When Modi said the magical words (36 Rafale in fly away condition) nobody could possibly imagine it would take almost one year and a half to get the deal done.

Less than two years till we will see these birds flying above majestic Rajasthan ...

Indeed.
Just see how many times it takes to Egypt to clinch a deal.....

 

[BON PLAN]

You have found the answer to this question already, I guess as seen in your successive comment

Kaveri fine tuning was a result of the Rafale deal. India didn't purchase Rafale in order to have this engineering assistance. If you think that, you have understand quite nothing to the saga.

 

[Immanuel]

Technically India's order book of the Su-30 is standing at 314, so while Rafale was being ordered, more MKI will come. Upgrade the MKI to Super status with AESA, new uprated engines and other avionics, technically it will be a more useful aircraft than the Rafale while having the ability to deploy a wider set of weapons inlcuding Brahmos, Astra BVR, SAAW, 1000kg Glide Bombs, eventually Nirbhay etc.

Rafale comes but it will take another 7 years before it has a nearly just as capable weapon profile, offcourse excluding Meteor from this case.

 

[Tactical Frog]

Technically India's order book of the Su-30 is standing at 314, so while Rafale was being ordered, more MKI will come. Upgrade the MKI to Super status with AESA, new uprated engines and other avionics, technically it will be a more useful aircraft than the Rafale while having the ability to deploy a wider set of weapons inlcuding Brahmos, Astra BVR, SAAW, 1000kg Glide Bombs, eventually Nirbhay etc.

Rafale comes but it will take another 7 years before it has a nearly just as capable weapon profile, offcourse excluding Meteor from this case.

Do you have source for the 314 figure ?

 

[Kshithij]

Kaveri fine tuning was a result of the Rafale deal. India didn't purchase Rafale in order to have this engineering assistance. If you think that, you have understand quite nothing to the saga.

The way I see it, without Kaveri fine tuning deal, Parrikar would not have signed Rafale deal. So, I consider it the other way around. Of course, India was on its way to make its own engine and it was not wise to waste over 5 billion dollars to just get Kaveri, but Kaveri engine did play a major role. India had better options in Su30 for the time being with a ready infrastructure for indian production. 75% of Su30 parts are indian and it is 55% by value.

Technically India's order book of the Su-30 is standing at 314, so while Rafale was being ordered, more MKI will come. Upgrade the MKI to Super status with AESA, new uprated engines and other avionics, technically it will be a more useful aircraft than the Rafale while having the ability to deploy a wider set of weapons inlcuding Brahmos, Astra BVR, SAAW, 1000kg Glide Bombs, eventually Nirbhay etc.

Rafale comes but it will take another 7 years before it has a nearly just as capable weapon profile, offcourse excluding Meteor from this case.

314? Can you tell me how you came to this number?

 

[sthf]

??? so why India not just orders more of these famous, reliable, affordable SU30 ?

Even in the best case scenario MKI will outnumber Rafale 2:1. IAF needed Mirages and then Rafales to fulfill a specific task which is low level penetration, something which MKI can't do.

Apart from that MKI kicks ass in pretty much every other department, especially in air-dominance and air-interdiction.