Know Your 'Rafale'

[Armand2REP]

At LOW ALTITUDE, armand.

Nope, that's hi-hi-hi...

 

[Yatharth Singh]

Then what is the LCA? I thought the LCA is the Mig-21 replacement and the Rafael is for the Mig-23 and Mig-27.

Kidding GK. I meant that using them for next 40 years will make them as venerable and risky as Mig-21`s are today.

 

[Armand2REP]

It has been suggested to me that Saudi Arabia may cancel or reduce their Typhoon buy. They have only committed to the 24 with another 48 still in negotiations. It did not go well.

 

[Rohan Sharma]

There was nothing BAE could do, Eurofighter has lost out to Rafale in every head-head match up. South Korea and Brazil shortlists didn't even contain EF, India obviously winner. Soon we will see the results in Switzerland of an L1 bid.

Thats a fallacy.

Eurofighter is a better jet............But the price they have quoted is seriously stupid to pay.(considering propak Italy spain in the consortium and saudi arabia deal for typhoon)
In case Saudi arabia had gone for rafale Chances would had been stronger for typhoon to get selected but since it never happened result was expected.
Another fact French systems are familiar to IAF and since Mirage is getting the upgradation to rafale level its fine to have almost 10 rafale level jets.

Also the French participation is quite big in indian defense products.I think its now time that they start delivering the Technology Transfer they promised way back. We have spent billions on Dhruv Kaveri and many things.

I hope they understand we are desperate to get technology transfer a finished product s not what we want..............we wish to do that ourselves.Thats the sole purpose of this deal
in order to have our own AMCA Another Thing we Don't have money to pay again and again for upgrades as we did for mirage.

Most important thing that is essential to understand is mutual benefit if france provide defense tech assistance to India USA will be ruled out giving way for France to achieve its desire to get out from the shadow of USA and lead European Union also fetchinf them moneyhoney.

 

[Rohan Sharma]

There was nothing BAE could do, Eurofighter has lost out to Rafale in every head-head match up. South Korea and Brazil shortlists didn't even contain EF, India obviously winner. Soon we will see the results in Switzerland of an L1 bid.

Thats a fallacy.

Eurofighter is a better jet............But the price they have quoted is seriously stupid to pay.(considering propak Italy spain in the consortium and saudi arabia deal for typhoon)
In case Saudi arabia had gone for rafale Chances would had been stronger for typhoon to get selected but since it never happened result was expected.
Another fact French systems are familiar to IAF and since Mirage is getting the upgradation to rafale level its fine to have almost 10 rafale level jets.

Also the French participation is quite big in indian defense products.I think its now time that they start delivering the Technology Transfer they promised way back. We have spent billions on Dhruv Kaveri and many things.

I hope they understand we are desperate to get technology transfer a finished product s not what we want..............we wish to do that ourselves.Thats the sole purpose of this deal
in order to have our own AMCA Another Thing we Don't have money to pay again and again for upgrades as we did for mirage.

Most important thing that is essential to understand is mutual benefit if france provide defense tech assistance to India USA will be ruled out giving way for France to achieve its desire to get out from the shadow of USA and lead European Union also fetching them moneyhoney.

 

[Armand2REP]

That's a fallacy,

Rafale is the better plane... obviously. Eurofighter is an over-hyped, overpriced piece of scrap. EF partners have to cannabalise their planes to keep them running. The A2G development is so stunted, RAF didn't have more than 2 planes that could drop a simple LGB over Libya. All it did during the war was fly interdiction while Rafale was pounding the crap out of Gaddafi. EF is supposed to be so great at dogfighting yet Rafale kicked RAF's behind racking up a 7:1 kill ratio. He11, even PAF F-16s were kicking its arse. The EF partner nations are dumping it like a disease. India don't want it and the Saudis are stalling further buys. They just spent $30 billion on F-15s so uh oh!. It is such a headache, Austria and Germany have entire squadrons grounded due to lack of spares. Some supply chain huh!

 

[Yusuf]

Well, I will have to fall in love with rafale now that it will be in INDIA colors. Arranged marriage

 

[Vyom]

Although both planes are closely matched, I've often explained on this blog that whereas the Typhoon offers superior air-to-air capabilities, the Rafale is truly multi-role and better in the air-to-surface role.

The "omnirole" Rafale can claim to have been the first aircraft to enter to Libyan airspace on Mar. 19 (even though I've already explained this happened in the Benghazi area where the risk of SAM and AAA fire was low) thanks to the Spectra integrated defensive aids suite developed by Thales. For sure although it can't be considered as multirole as to be capable to perform a typical SEAD strike as an F-16CJ or a Tornado ECR, the French plane has the possibility to combine its sensors (such as the Spectra) and the AASM (Armement Air-Sol Modulaire – Air-to-Ground Modular Weapon) PGM to identify, designate and hit ground targets. Furthermore, during Unified Protector, the AASM demonstrated to be effective against a tank at a range of 57 km.

The Rafale will also be the first European combat plane to use an electronic scanning radar; with "Tranche 4", expected to be handed over from 2013, the 60 French upgraded Rafales will carry an AESA (Active Electronically Scanned Array) RBE2 radar (compatible with long range METEOR air-to-air missiles) whose beam can be pointed from one area to another one quickly, in all weather and in a jammed environment, and that can be used in air-to-air and air-to-ground modes at the same time, with an enhanced detection capability.

So, who's gonna win in India? Difficult to say. Surely, Rafale is a more mature plane, capable of performing a wide variety of missions, from SEAD(-lite) to reconnaissance, and it is already available in navalised version for aircraft carrier ops. However, Eurofighter already has export customers that Rafale lacks [UAE sale should be closer now NdA], and it has an attractive user community that could give stronger strategic ties with 4 European nations.

Furthermore, the Typhoon has a more powerful engine, a better BVR capability and is able to pull max G-load while launcing its weapons and carrying three external fuel tanks. It has also an extensive air-to-air missile load and can perform supersonic launching while supercruising with a large missile load. The Typhoon has a very lightweight operational bifocal Helmet Mounted Display, which in combination with the IRIS-T or ASRAAM High Off Boresight Missiles provides the F-2000 with superior dogfight capabilities. So, it's a lethal weapon in the air-to-air scenario, and it has a potential still to be developed to become a real multirole. Finally, Eurofighter is working on a navalised Typhoon too"¦.

How the Rafale may look in Indian colors:

The Aviationist

 

[nitesh]

seems like French public is not happy with the deal:

French public sentiments negative on Dassault win in India - Frontier India World Affairs - International News and Current Affairs

 

[methos]

According to other news Rafale has two weeks time to make the final contract with India... (they are negotiating exclussively, but the contract is not signed yet).
The exact prize is alledgely not determined at the moment, the Rafale is often claimed to be "repair intensive", which may lead to a higher prize than the submitted per unit prize from Rafale (at least if the Indians are catious). Eurofighter and the other contenders (e.g. US) are hoping that Rafale and the Indian government can't find a final agreement and the MRCA will be reevaluating all other contenders. Nevertheless an not further named Indian official has said that it is in his opinion likely that Rafale and India will find an agreement.

Rafale is the better plane... obviously. Eurofighter is an over-hyped, overpriced piece of scrap. EF partners have to cannabalise their planes to keep them running. The A2G development is so stunted, RAF didn't have more than 2 planes that could drop a simple LGB over Libya. All it did during the war was fly interdiction while Rafale was pounding the crap out of Gaddafi. EF is supposed to be so great at dogfighting yet Rafale kicked RAF's behind racking up a 7:1 kill ratio. He11, even PAF F-16s were kicking its arse. The EF partner nations are dumping it like a disease. India don't want it and the Saudis are stalling further buys. They just spent $30 billion on F-15s so uh oh!. It is such a headache, Austria and Germany have entire squadrons grounded due to lack of spares. Some supply chain huh!

You seem to be missinformed. Neither Austria nor Germany have grounded whole squadrons. Only the RAF had some real supply problems because of their deployment in Lybia.
Btw, the RAF had more than "2 planes that could drop a simple LGB" in Lybia. Their EFs where equipped with Paveways as did their Tornados, which also used Brimstone exessively.

 

[nrj]

Why we should worry about Germany et al. The customer owes no explanation to the shopkeeper.

Given the current Geo-political scenarios and Indian growth if India will be in a position to sanction others then why we should stuck ourself with the word ''leverage'' and be self blackmailed.

There is a saying '' One in the hand is worth two in the bush''. At least we have two nations on our side forever or at least for far future for Geo-Political (vice versa) symbiosis.

The Germans were not committed for Indian UNSC bid till the last moment anyways. Plus next trance of EFT demands massive investments. With Brits, Spaniards & Italians on street, we had no significant reason to fund 'EURO' fighter. And at least Thales AESA is in testing phase, Euroradar is yet to catch up.

 

[arundo]

This great news will re-shuffle the cards in the European military aircraft industry. This will probably generate further orders for Rafale in the UAE, Katar and Kuwait and increase its chances in Brazil.

However, some people in Germany feel betrayed. According to an article in the news magazine "Der Spiegel", the Rafale should even not have been downselected last March. It was already eliminated from the tender procedure after a sloppy bid. Only major intervention by Nicolas Sarkozy giranting political concessions (e.g. permanent seat on the UN Security Council) could bring Rafale back. The author insinuates irregularities or at least that not everything has been transparent in the tender procedures.
Can someone tell me what exactly had happened in 2010?

 

[sayareakd]

seems like French public is not happy with the deal:

French public sentiments negative on Dassault win in India - Frontier India World Affairs - International News and Current Affairs

Jubilation in France as Dassault wins deal

The Hindu : Business News : Jubilation in France as Dassault wins deal

 

[nrj]

Rafale is the better plane... obviously. Eurofighter is an over-hyped, overpriced piece of scrap.

No shyt! Our airforce shortlisted this piece of crap!

 

[nitesh]

Jubilation in France as Dassault wins deal

The Hindu : Business News : Jubilation in France as Dassault wins deal

Sir, public seems to be un happy, as the major work will be done in India, loss of manufacturing jobs for them

 

[SpArK]

No shyt! Our airforce shortlisted this piece of crap!

To make it easier... The higher the price of EFT the better the chances of Rafale.

EFT was a scapegoat... bakkra... mehhhhh mehhhhhh... bakra..

 

[nrj]

Calling EFT piece of crap is too much. If it was so bad, IAF would've never shortlisted it. Lets not put our tongue whichever way it desires. Both of the fighter were good but France was able to sweeten the deal with political leverages.

 

[Vyom]

I expect to see increase in tax slabs to pay off these bills.

 

[SpArK]

Its time to move on debating on EFT... EFT should be a banned word from now on...

Mods please make it whenever someone writes EFT it comes as ***

Thanks in advance.:thumb:



@nrj.. its a joke .. dont take it seriously... yes there is joke section.

 

[amitkriit]

seems like French public is not happy with the deal:

French public sentiments negative on Dassault win in India - Frontier India World Affairs - International News and Current Affairs

Thats the job of the opposition.