Know Your 'Rafale'

[halloweene]

As there is no hmds on french rafale, no clue if it will be on indian rafales. But it is fused into tactical situation.

 

[Twinblade]

We will stick to the LITENING. PDL won't have any effect on our Rafale program.

You can never trust the red tape at MoD. Last year they were running a tender between Litening and Damocles. Thales, close to moving on the PDL NG was offloading Damocles pod with 'ToT' to BEL, which BEL was displaying at Aero India, while Rafael was offering Litening GR4 and upgrade for existing Litening II pods to GR4 standard. Litening GR4, which entered service in 2008, offered more resolution than PDL NG which will enter in 2018 !! I don't know what happened to that tender but 'next generation Litening pod' was displayed on the poster for Tejas Mk2, usually referred to Litening GR4 standard which probably means that more Litening would have been ordered. It could also refer to the fifth generation of Litening pod, but that seems unlikely.

 

[halloweene]

Nope, they have similar resolution (one being 1024, the other 628+ dble scan, or so). There's much more in a designation pod than resolution. For ex. present DAmo laser has a far longer range than litening, but no visible channel and poor resolution...
Everything is in details.

 

[SajeevJino]

France approves latest Rafale upgrade plan​

France has given the go-ahead to Dassault Aviation for a further iterative development of the Rafale combat aircraft, which will enable the integration of a number of new weapons and equipment.

Presented to the company by French defence minister Jean-Yves Le Drian on a 10 January visit to the manufacturer's Mérignac plant, the contract will allow Dassault to upgrade the fourth-generation type to a new F3R standard.

Enhancements include the integration of MBDA's Meteor beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile and the latest version of the Sagem AASM Hammer air-to-surface guided munition. Earlier versions were used by the French air force during operations in Libya during 2011, and in Mali during 2013.

The newest iteration of Thales's PDL-NG laser designation pod will also be added, says Dassault. This is the subject of a separate development contract awarded by France's DGA defence procurement agency.

Risk-reduction activities on the pod were conducted throughout 2013, and Thales says it aims to begin series production in 2018. The PDL-NG is designed to be integrated with both the Rafale and Dassault's legacy Mirage 2000D.

The enhancements to the Rafale are comparable to the additions to be made to the capabilities of the rival Eurofighter Typhoon and Saab Gripen fighters in Europe.

Despite losing out on several recent export deals, notably in Brazil where the Gripen NG was preferred for the nation's 36-aircraft F-X2 requirement, Dassault believes the latest enhancement package will boost the Rafale's overseas sales potential.

Validation of the F3R standard is anticipated for 2018

France approves latest Rafale upgrade plan - 1/10/2014 - Flight Global

 

[Twinblade]

Nope, they have similar resolution (one being 1024, the other 628+ dble scan, or so). There's much more in a designation pod than resolution. For ex. present DAmo laser has a far longer range than litening, but no visible channel and poor resolution...
Everything is in details.

Of course, Thales has to use double scan to compensate for the small IR array and that is pretty much how they plan to reach that resolution on PDL NG, while the Array itself remains no better than Litening III. Works against large targets at ranges, usless at ranges against smaller human sized targets, especially in contested areas where it will be crucial to ID friends and foes, unless flying near overhead. Smart image processing will only take you that far. Damocles has a longer lasing range due to a more powerful onboard laser because the french made up their minds long time back about engaging their ground targets from a distance. With the advent of EO+GPS/INS munitions like Hammer, the french partially auto-obsoleted their philosophy of long range lasing. Long range lasing is still useful, but not entirely critical, while the Israelis with similar weapon system in SPICE decided to go for man in loop system only and breaking off the requirement of long range lasing giving their pod SWaP advantage. PDL NG will correct the case of missing TV mode as on current Damocles and still have lower resolution in 2018 than Litening GR4 which entered service 10 years prior. French may make some good stuff, LDP aren't one of them.

 

[p2prada]

You can never trust the red tape at MoD. Last year they were running a tender between Litening and Damocles. Thales, close to moving on the PDL NG was offloading Damocles pod with 'ToT' to BEL, which BEL was displaying at Aero India, while Rafael was offering Litening GR4 and upgrade for existing Litening II pods to GR4 standard. Litening GR4, which entered service in 2008, offered more resolution than PDL NG which will enter in 2018 !! I don't know what happened to that tender but 'next generation Litening pod' was displayed on the poster for Tejas Mk2, usually referred to Litening GR4 standard which probably means that more Litening would have been ordered. It could also refer to the fifth generation of Litening pod, but that seems unlikely.

They will run tenders and still favor Litening in those tenders. Moving to something else will bring operational retraining baggage which IAF will believe is unnecessary.

A tender like this only serves to bring down costs and avoids a one vendor situation that MoD has always liked to avoid.

Next time they will just put up specs slightly better than PDL and reject it for Litening.

 

[Drsomnath999]

France begins development of New Generation Laser Designation Pod

Thales' optronics business has been contracted by France's defence procurement agency (Direction Générale de l'Armement - DGA) to develop the New Generation Laser Designation Pod (Pod de Désignation Laser de Nouvelle Génération - PDL NG) for the French Air Force and naval air arm, it was announced on 10 January 2014.

The PDL NG programme was initiated in September 2009, when the DGA placed a EUR31 million (USD42 million) order with Thales for the production of a prototype PDL NG, under a programme known as Multicontext Airborne System for Targeting, Recognition, and Identification (MASTRID). This latest contract follows the risk-reduction phase conducted throughout 2013; series production is expected to begin in 2018.

According to Thales, "the risk-reduction phase confirmed the PDL NG architecture, its high level of functional integration, reliability, and the development schedule."

The PDL NG, which is required to provide "new day/night imaging and engagement capabilities in complex theatres of operations", will be used by Rafale and Mirage 2000D combat aircraft, initially complementing and eventually replacing the upgraded Damocles pod.

What neither the DGA nor Thales are revealing at this time is the PDL NG sensor configuration. Four months before the PDL NG prototype was ordered, during the Paris Air Show in June 2009, Thales announced an enhanced version of the Damocles pod, designated XF (for eXtended Features) which was, essentially, an urgent operational requirement, arising from French experience during operations over Afghanistan. The upgrade added an extra sensor, enhanced optics, and datalink communications to the existing pod. Since then further operational experience has been gained during Operation 'Harmattan' over Libya in 2011.


*Damocles XF comprises a mid-wave infrared (MWIR - 3-5 microns) thermal imager (described as high-resolution but no array format has been specified) and a colour CCD day camera (previously only an option) with continuous zoom, with integral image-processing software, including improved symbology.

*The laser suite comprises a dual-band rangefinder, marker, and spot tracker (another adopted option).

*This is claimed by Thales to be sufficiently powerful for use at a slant range of 45 km from an altitude of 45,000 ft. The XF configuration also added an unspecified datalink to enable imagery to be down-linked to ground forces and could also receive video and data, up-linked back.

Assuming that the current mantra of reducing size, weight, power, and cost, while increasing reliability and maintainability is a given,
a possible PDL NG configuration might include:

* higher-resolution MWIR thermal imager, given the fixed aperture size of the pod;

*higher-definition colour TV for daylight operations;

* a short-wave infrared (1.4-3 microns) camera to enhance twilight performance;

*a more reliable, instant-on, solid-state (or fibre) lasers with diode pumping,

*improved video datalinks offering air-air and air-ground communications;

* enhanced INS-GPS integration to improve target geo-location;

*and improved line-of-sight stabilisation to match the higher resolution sensors.


France begins development of New Generation Laser Designation Pod - IHS Jane's 360

 

[Drsomnath999]

France begins development of New Generation Laser Designation Pod

Thales' optronics business has been contracted by France's defence procurement agency (Direction Générale de l'Armement - DGA) to develop the New Generation Laser Designation Pod (Pod de Désignation Laser de Nouvelle Génération - PDL NG) for the French Air Force and naval air arm, it was announced on 10 January 2014.

The PDL NG programme was initiated in September 2009, when the DGA placed a EUR31 million (USD42 million) order with Thales for the production of a prototype PDL NG, under a programme known as Multicontext Airborne System for Targeting, Recognition, and Identification (MASTRID). This latest contract follows the risk-reduction phase conducted throughout 2013; series production is expected to begin in 2018.

According to Thales, "the risk-reduction phase confirmed the PDL NG architecture, its high level of functional integration, reliability, and the development schedule."

The PDL NG, which is required to provide "new day/night imaging and engagement capabilities in complex theatres of operations", will be used by Rafale and Mirage 2000D combat aircraft, initially complementing and eventually replacing the upgraded Damocles pod.

What neither the DGA nor Thales are revealing at this time is the PDL NG sensor configuration. Four months before the PDL NG prototype was ordered, during the Paris Air Show in June 2009, Thales announced an enhanced version of the Damocles pod, designated XF (for eXtended Features) which was, essentially, an urgent operational requirement, arising from French experience during operations over Afghanistan. The upgrade added an extra sensor, enhanced optics, and datalink communications to the existing pod. Since then further operational experience has been gained during Operation 'Harmattan' over Libya in 2011.


*Damocles XF comprises a mid-wave infrared (MWIR - 3-5 microns) thermal imager (described as high-resolution but no array format has been specified) and a colour CCD day camera (previously only an option) with continuous zoom, with integral image-processing software, including improved symbology.

*The laser suite comprises a dual-band rangefinder, marker, and spot tracker (another adopted option).

*This is claimed by Thales to be sufficiently powerful for use at a slant range of 45 km from an altitude of 45,000 ft. The XF configuration also added an unspecified datalink to enable imagery to be down-linked to ground forces and could also receive video and data, up-linked back.

Assuming that the current mantra of reducing size, weight, power, and cost, while increasing reliability and maintainability is a given,
a possible PDL NG configuration might include:

* higher-resolution MWIR thermal imager, given the fixed aperture size of the pod;

*higher-definition colour TV for daylight operations;

* a short-wave infrared (1.4-3 microns) camera to enhance twilight performance;

*a more reliable, instant-on, solid-state (or fibre) lasers with diode pumping,

*improved video datalinks offering air-air and air-ground communications;

* enhanced INS-GPS integration to improve target geo-location;

*and improved line-of-sight stabilisation to match the higher resolution sensors.


France begins development of New Generation Laser Designation Pod - IHS Jane's 360

 

[halloweene]

Apparently, Rafale team leaders in India came very well (private source)

 

[halloweene]

 

[Neil]

One of the 1st shots of a Rafale with a Mica on 3rd wing station. Nice loadout ! [2 Mica IR, 2 Mica EM, 6 AASM, 2 Meteor and 3 external fuel tanks]

 

[halloweene]

Plz give source

The Flying Men - Blog géré par un lycéen en terminale économique et sociale, passionné par les questions de Défense et l'aéronautique militaire.

 

[Neil]

Plz give source

The Flying Men - Blog géré par un lycéen en terminale économique et sociale, passionné par les questions de Défense et l'aéronautique militaire.

well i got it form another site... and there was no source. anyways thanks for helping out.

 

[halloweene]

No problem mate,i'm trying to help because this blog is held by Loïc Lauze, a young student doinf his very best . So the more visits on his site the better

 

[cobra commando]

AA Me, IN: Brush Up Your Rafale Knowledge - Soon To Be India's Latest Aircraft Purchase

 

[cobra commando]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cP42vtC7Z6U
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UN_d0St2EHQ

check out more vids @->
CHASSE EMBARQUEE - YouTube

 

[gadeshi]

Rafale cockpit videos with GoPro:

 

[Meriv90]

I just hope that something like what happened to Argentina's Mirages during the fakland wars won't happen to you.

Resuming it in one sentence what happened then: the French govermerment( Mitterand) under the treath from Tatcher of using atomics in the war against the argentinian was "morally forced" to give away to the british the codes of their excocet missiles equipped on their Mirages (that were dangerous treaths to british fleet) and if i remember correctly electronic countermeasures.

 

[ladder]

I just hope that something like what happened to Argentina's Mirages during the fakland wars won't happen to you.

Resuming it in one sentence what happened then: the French govermerment( Mitterand) under the treath from Tatcher of using atomics in the war against the argentinian was "morally forced" to give away to the british the codes of their excocet missiles equipped on their Mirages (that were dangerous treaths to british fleet) and if i remember correctly electronic countermeasures.

And that is why we have multiple sources of procurement of weapon system.
And MRCA tender and selection of Rafale was due to one the objectives of diversification.

Also, we have both money and friends.
Read what we did with Mirages when French refused help during 1999 Kargil war. We brought in Israelis to help.

 

[Drsomnath999]

Dassault Gains New Rafale Upgrade Contract

Dassault Aviation received a development contract from the French Ministry of Defense for a further upgrade of the Rafale combat aircraft. Designated "F3 R," the upgrade consists mainly of integration of the MBDA Meteor BVRAAM; the laser-homing version of the Sagem AASM air-ground weapon; and the new Thales PDL-NG laser designator pod. There will also be some improvements to the Rafale's avionics and defensive systems.

The contract is reported to be worth about €1 billion ($1.35 billion), including $68 million to MBDA for the Meteor integration and $160 million to Thales for the PDL-NG development. A prototype of this new all-weather, day/night pod is scheduled to fly in 2016. The F3 R development work will be completed in 2018.

Dassault said that the launch of the F 3R standard "guarantees that French forces will continue to have a high-performance aircraft adapted to their requirements, and reinforces the strong points of the Rafale in export competitions." The latest French defense procurement plan reduces the number of Rafales to be bought annually from 2016, as a cost-saving measure, in the hope that exports will restore the total to the minimum economic number—which appears to be 11 per year. Dassault chairman and ceo Eric Trappier told Les Echos newspaper that this plan would be revisited in 2015, if no exports were forthcoming by then. A hundred Rafales were yet to be delivered to the French air force and navy, he noted.

Sales campaigns for the Rafale continue in Malaysia and the Gulf, but Brazil recently rejected the aircraft in favor of the lower-cost Saab Gripen. That leaves India, where negotiations to conclude the MMRCA deal have dragged on for two years. Trappier told French financial newspaper Les Echos that they were complex, especially concerning "the licensed production of virtually all components of the aircraft." If the outgoing Indian government does not sign the contract soon, the deal would likely not be concluded until late this year, Trappier added. The Eurofighter consortium has suggested in briefings that India might reopen the contest, but Trappier downplayed that possibility, noting how much effort the Indians had already expended on the procurement.
Dassault Gains New Rafale Upgrade Contract | Aviation International News