Kaveri Engine

[Manish Khan]

Is this helpful to our Air Force?

 

[rudresh]

ye

yeah that's not gonna happen. i was damn sure.
some people were jumping like monkey here and claiming safran core will be integrated on out indigenous kaveri.
i m glad that didn't happen otherwise our greatest Indian fanboys are ready to discredit drdo in a minute...

I hope for the same. Kaveri can never be discredited any ways since it has already made lots of achievement some where else.

1. BHEL is producing bigger industrial engine based on kaveri engine.
2. Manik engine has achieved a lot is the fruit of hard work that has gone into kaveri.
3.Kaveri marine
4.kaveri for railways
5.kaveri for gathak

The core integration of m88 may be a possibility ..... as K10 improved engine or newer indian alloys may go into kabini core with some french inputs and improvement to the core which may go into Tejas MK1,A,2.

But kaveri with kabini core is the only possible engine which can give 120+kn with upgradation of core material which can be supplied by the snegma, what ever the stunts by snegma will not yield 120+ on M88 core. Hence upgraded kabini core will be the only possibility for AMCA and MKI.

If they have a political will they can retain kabini core and for both the engines and will definately good for the future generation engines.

1 billion input from the offset will go long way either french should provide the M88 engine core tech or the equipments and the tech for forming the high end components for it .....i think they may choose for the latter or both will help for kaveri.

Hence both are possible.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

So India makes RD-33 and AL-31 now? So why hasn't DRDO just done like the Chinese and design their fighters around Russian engines since India already makes them? That would be the logical step instead of relying on Americans who can sanction at any time. The US is even ready to sanction a NATO member for buying S-400s.

Making a plane to suite engine is a Third rate thing which only china can think and do. Plane is designed and accordingly the engines are either chosen or made. we have designed plane according to our requirement and engine shall either be chosen or made to meet the requirement.

 

[Steven Rogers]

Making a plane to suite engine is a Third rate thing which only china can think and do. Plane is designed and accordingly the engines are either chosen or made. we have designed plane according to our requirement and engine shall either be chosen or made to meet the requirement.

Wrong, planes are designed around engines, that's why "identical" proven engine is used for testing and new engines with identical figures like air mass flow are used to replace in the production variant.

 

[Kshithij]

Wrong, planes are designed around engines, that's why "identical" proven engine is used for testing and new engines with identical figures like air mass flow are used to replace in the production variant.

It is a bit of both. Engine and plane are both designed according to the size needs. India will not make F16 sized Tejas just to use Al31F engine.

 

[Steven Rogers]

It is a bit of both. Engine and plane are both designed according to the size needs. India will not make F16 sized Tejas just to use Al31F engine.

Tejas is made to run on kaveri, and absence of kaveri as already stained the performance which resulted into unaccomplishment of ASQR requirements of 1998 .

 

[Kshithij]

Tejas is made to run on kaveri, and absence of kaveri as already stained the performance which resulted into unaccomplishment of ASQR requirements of 1998 .

The ASQR has been updated several times. The 1998 ASQR has been met already.

 

[Steven Rogers]

The ASQR has been updated several times. The 1998 ASQR has been met already.

Not exactly, STR is still the sorrow of the project, also AoA has only been expanded to 23 degrees against 28 degrees.

 

[Kshithij]

Not exactly, STR is still the sorrow of the project, also AoA has only been expanded to 23 degrees against 28 degrees.

Giving excessive parameters is not something one should take seriously. AoA of Tejas is 24 degree and that of F16 is 21-22 degree. Mirage 2000 has similar AoA as Tejas. AoA of 28 degree is an excess.

To get such high AoA, thrust vectoring is important. Su30 has AoA of slightly over 30 degrees. Expecting Tejas to have angoe of attack near to Su30 is a bit excessive.

 

[Steven Rogers]

Giving excessive parameters is not something one should take seriously. AoA of Tejas is 24 degree and that of F16 is 21-22 degree. Mirage 2000 has similar AoA as Tejas. AoA of 28 degree is an excess.

To get such high AoA, thrust vectoring is important. Su30 has AoA of slightly over 30 degrees. Expecting Tejas to have angoe of attack near to Su30 is a bit excessive.

Not correct Su30 can achieve a greater AoA due to thrust vector than the mentioned only in certain flight regime, Rafale has 30 degree AoA, tejas trainer achieved 24 degree AoA not the single engine fighter aircraft. Higher AoA is required for higher ITR for tejas.

 

[darshan978]

NO RELATED TO KAVERI BUT RELATED TO TEJAS ENGINE GE-F404 (INDUSTRIAL VERSION) LM1600.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE TO PUT THIS POST, SO POSTING HERE.

 

[Kshithij]

Not correct Su30 can achieve a greater AoA due to thrust vector than the mentioned only in certain flight regime, Rafale has 30 degree AoA, tejas trainer achieved 24 degree AoA not the single engine fighter aircraft. Higher AoA is required for higher ITR for tejas.

Rafale has 28-29 degrees AoA. That is in easier condition and with canards. Tejas has no canards and the AoA of Tejas is measured in tropical wet climate of India at slightly above sea level. 28 degree AoA will make Tejas similar to Rafale even wothout canards. Canards add some more flight control and does help in increasing AoA. So, difference of 4 degree AoA between Rafale and Tejas on account of canards is reasonable.

PS- I said that Su30 has slightly more than 30 degree AoA. I am not sure of the exact number. I could be wrong and Su30 may have AoA significantly higher than 30 degree

 

[pruthvi24]

there was news report that kaveri engine was tested is this true????

 

[BON PLAN]

Rafale has 28-29 degrees AoA. That is in easier condition and with canards. Tejas has no canards and the AoA of Tejas is measured in tropical wet climate of India at slightly above sea level. 28 degree AoA will make Tejas similar to Rafale even wothout canards. Canards add some more flight control and does help in increasing AoA. So, difference of 4 degree AoA between Rafale and Tejas on account of canards is reasonable.

PS- I said that Su30 has slightly more than 30 degree AoA. I am not sure of the exact number. I could be wrong and Su30 may have AoA significantly higher than 30 degree

Rafale "normal" AoA is 30°. I think if you pull the stick more than the elastical stop, you can reach 34° (I've read that but don't forget to find a source).

The plane was tested up to 100° (yes, 100°) but it was just to open the most important domain possible to improve knowledge. Absolutely no operational use.

 

[Kshithij]

Rafale "normal" AoA is 30°. I think if you pull the stick more than the elastical stop, you can reach 34° (I've read that but don't forget to find a source).

The plane was tested up to 100° (yes, 100°) but it was just to open the most important domain possible to improve knowledge. Absolutely no operational use.

By AoA, one means sustained cruising, not momentary one. So, 100 degree is unlikely. Rafale as I have read is 29 degree AoA. It is EF Typhoon that claims AoA of 34 degree, not Rafale. You must have mistaken there. Regardless, I find it suspicious that EF Typhoon can have 34 degree AoA without TVC as in Su30. Su30 has AoA of over 30 degree with TVC can't be simply unlikely to be done by EF Typhoon without TVC.

 

[BON PLAN]

By AoA, one means sustained cruising, not momentary one. So, 100 degree is unlikely. Rafale as I have read is 29 degree AoA. It is EF Typhoon that claims AoA of 34 degree, not Rafale. You must have mistaken there. Regardless, I find it suspicious that EF Typhoon can have 34 degree AoA without TVC as in Su30. Su30 has AoA of over 30 degree with TVC can't be simply unlikely to be done by EF Typhoon without TVC.

100° and a negative speed were tested on a pre serial Rafale, with a dedicated FBW software (some protection partialy or totaly removed). It is like the "Pugatshev Cobra" totaly use less, except to improve your knowledge and simulation software (and to enjoy aero show).

Rafale was tested in a air to air operational config up to 34°.
29° is the angle of the pilot seat.

For the speed : 80Kt is used "everyday". A Rafale training against a Mirage 2000 even flown at 15Kt !

 

[Karthi]

im , my f , To achieve the maximum rate of turn, the greatest possible force toward the centre of the turn is required. This is achieved by inclining the lift vector as far as possible. Therefore, maximum CL, achieved at the maximum angle of attack, is combined with the maximum angle of bank.

 

[lcafanboy]

Cross posting from BRF kakarat

GTRE has issued a tender for 'Expression of Interest for Altitude Tests of Kaveri Engine and its Derivative', bid opening on 1st Aug 18

Dimensions & details of Engine as per EOI document
Inlet Dia : 749mm
Max Dia : 940mm
Length : 3900mm

LP Comp - Three stage
HP Comp - Six stage
HP Turbine - single stage & cooled
LP Turbine - single stage
Main Combustion Chamber - annular direct flow
Afterburner system with axi-symmetric exhaust nozzle
The engine has a Kaveri full Authority Digital Engine Control System (KADECS)

Kaveri is of following performance class at Indian Standard Atmosphere (ISA) Sea level Static (SLS)

Dry Thrust 52 kN
Dry SFC 0.78 kg/kgf/hr
Dry air flow 77.8 kg/sec
Reheat Thrust 81 kN
Reheat SFC 2.03 kg/kgf/hr
Reheat air flow 77.8 kg/sec

Tests to be conducted in two phases in next 3 years Phase 1 AT-1 75 hrs Phase 2 AT-2 100 hrs

 

[G10]

Will this need a Flying test Bed?

 

[darshan978]

Cross posting from BRF kakarat

GTRE has issued a tender for 'Expression of Interest for Altitude Tests of Kaveri Engine and its Derivative', bid opening on 1st Aug 18

Dimensions & details of Engine as per EOI document
Inlet Dia : 749mm
Max Dia : 940mm
Length : 3900mm

LP Comp - Three stage
HP Comp - Six stage
HP Turbine - single stage & cooled
LP Turbine - single stage
Main Combustion Chamber - annular direct flow
Afterburner system with axi-symmetric exhaust nozzle
The engine has a Kaveri full Authority Digital Engine Control System (KADECS)

Kaveri is of following performance class at Indian Standard Atmosphere (ISA) Sea level Static (SLS)

Dry Thrust 52 kN
Dry SFC 0.78 kg/kgf/hr
Dry air flow 77.8 kg/sec
Reheat Thrust 81 kN
Reheat SFC 2.03 kg/kgf/hr
Reheat air flow 77.8 kg/sec

Tests to be conducted in two phases in next 3 years Phase 1 AT-1 75 hrs Phase 2 AT-2 100 hrs

no russia this time guys? who will fill tender?