Indian Special Forces

FalconSlayers

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I will be damned but anyway..

Do we have a Tier 1 SF? NO

Are we doing Tier 1 SF ops?NO

What surgical strike was is a classic example of a simple raid.Ideally the Ghataks should have done this.

Para SF in Kashmir is present in large numbers.Large in the sense it doesnt need to put so many men there.

Para need to regroup,breathe,train and then only come back to action to plan,perfrom,analyse and correct.

But some units are permanently in action.Their growth is not going on.

All this is coz of easy medals now.

Why do Armoured, Artyetc guys want to work in RR is coz of better opportunities later and same goes for Para.

We needed Para in the late and early to mid 90s when the level of training of the infantry was not enough.

But now even Armoured officers are conducting good ops.Maybe we could handpick exceptional Infantry officers to train them in special ops and let them do the role of Para SF.

We need a Tier 1 unit to be active beyond our borders.Our equipment and training are not good.

Where we say we use Tier 1 SF are where we are using Tier 2 units because we have Tier 2 units only.

Siachen was won by Infantry and later by SFF and Para.

Blue star was again Tier 2.

Lanka was Tier 2.

Maldives was tier 2.

Kargil was tier 2.

Where we needed Tier 1 we were quiet example IC 814 hijacking,Dawood and Salahuddin roaming freely etc etc.

The situation now is if IC 814 happens again we will again be hopeless.

If mumbai happens again then Mumbai police will be sitting ducks, Force1 will get destroyed,NSG local team will hold or kill the terrorist which depends on their numbers.

Except the intelligence of this country which is thanks to IPS we are nowhere.

Army officers are too much into their British Army syllabus of 1937 hence whatever is happening now is out of syllabus.

Look at the state of Amphibious Assault Brigade.
Did the Para did the Strike? No
Dis the Ghataks did the strikes? Yes (under 4 Para leadership).
 

Marliii

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No point in restructuring SF units or raising new units when the existing units are not being properly armed and used in their actual mandate.

The plan of arming the Para SFs with SCAR/KH-416s have been lying in limbo with the MOD for many years. Even basic things like BPJ, Helmets, SDRs, take years to implement.
Even if scar h and l are procured some of them will go to para airborne.when para sf got tavors airborne also got them in that early period itself
 

Killbot

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Did the Para did the Strike? No
Dis the Ghataks did the strikes? Yes (under 4 Para leadership).
Ghataks were involved, but as support for Para, AFAIK. You can't just place an infantry unit under Para leadership and expect them to perform. It's just not feasible without months of training.

Why do you think probationers get in field training? Compatibility.
 

Maitreya Shyam

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No point in restructuring SF units or raising new units when the existing units are not being properly armed and used in their actual mandate.

The plan of arming the Para SFs with SCAR/KH-416s have been lying in limbo with the MOD for many years. Even basic things like BPJ, Helmets, SDRs, take years to implement.
I think special forces will go for iwi arad
 

Marliii

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I think special forces will go for iwi arad
They should select some good rifle they have been using old tavors of 2000era and som fab mod ak and some are equiped with basic ak.
 

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Even if scar h and l are procured some of them will go to para airborne.when para sf got tavors airborne also got them in that early period itself
In a way you can say army does not do partiality. Everyone gets the same equipment. But the training differs. Thus Indian SF personnel feels elite not because of their equipment (same as RR and CRPFs) or operations (mostly CIs), but because of their superior training which make them very hardy soldiers.

However, interesting thing to note is that what the Para SFs are doing now is best mandate they can get. They are ocassionally allowed cross border raids. In UPA times it was unthinkable that Government will allow them.

Thus no point in raising Tier-1 units or practising capabilities which pertains to Western definition of Tier-1 operations. Government would simply not allow. Any time such a situation arise, Government will develop cold feet.
 

Aditya Roy

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Even if scar h and l are procured some of them will go to para airborne.when para sf got tavors airborne also got them in that early period itself
We need a separate Special Forces Regiment and establish the Parachute Regiment as an elite Airborne Infantry reg. on lines of British Parachute Regiment or the 82nd Airborne. Every time this proposal was made the Army bureaucracy( yes, you read it right) cunningly sabotaged the effort.

Also, we need more equality in the army. As General Panag(2020) pointed out -
''Over the last 50 years, most modern armies have done away with officers’ messes and JCO/sergeant’ messes on financial grounds and to promote egalitarianism. Even the British Army, from which we inherited this culture, is in the process of introducing radical reforms such as doing away with the regimental system and the mess culture. To this extent, there is a case to shut down the officers’ messes/JCO clubs and have an optimum, common number of messes for all ranks in each unit.''

Link to the article -
 

Marliii

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In a way you can say army does not do partiality. Everyone gets the same equipment. But the training differs. Thus Indian SF personnel feels elite not because of their equipment (same as RR and CRPFs) or operations (mostly CIs), but because of their superior training which make them very hardy soldiers.

However, interesting thing to note is that what the Para SFs are doing now is best mandate they can get. They are ocassionally allowed cross border raids. In UPA times it was unthinkable that Government will allow them.

Thus no point in raising Tier-1 units or practising capabilities which pertains to Western definition of Tier-1 operations. Government would simply not allow. Any time such a situation arise, Government will develop cold feet.
This is not about partiality there were reports about army equiping para sf regiments with basic ak s as they didn't had tavors.this is happening when the para airborne has tavors.first meet the equipment need of SF guys then airborne.
 

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Sorry but SF has been doing cross border raids irrespective of the Govt in power for a very long time. The only difference is the scale and the fact that this govt used them for marketing purposes
In UPA times it was mainly initated by the local commander. There was no government sanction. Even for retaliting to ceasefire violation were not permitted at most times. Since 2014 things have changed. Government has the tactit support for fire assaults, artilery exchanges and cross-border raids. However big sized raids are only sanctions as a response to a big terrorist attack.
 

rkhanna

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In UPA times it was mainly initated by the local commander. There was no government sanction. Even for retaliting to ceasefire violation were not permitted at most times. Since 2014 things have changed. Government has the tactit support for fire assaults, artilery exchanges and cross-border raids. However big sized raids are only sanctions as a response to a big terrorist attack.
GOI sanction for the airstrikes strikes was a bigger deal. And please don't tell me local commanders don't get sign off from AHQ to do a cross borsee raid against a nuclear armed neighbour. Hell I know of across IB raids as well not just LOC

Also pakistan and india in the last 10 years is different from the previous 10 years. Economically militarily and in terms of geopolitics.

Reading any more into that is too much guesswork
 

Pig benis on sushy

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In UPA times it was mainly initated by the local commander. There was no government sanction. Even for retaliting to ceasefire violation were not permitted at most times. Since 2014 things have changed. Government has the tactit support for fire assaults, artilery exchanges and cross-border raids. However big sized raids are only sanctions as a response to a big terrorist attack.
I think there was a operation where heads of porkis soldiers or policeman were taken and then burned only the commander of the operation knew it didn't go up to the government as the commander himself said the sf guys and commander of op would go into serious trouble.
 

Hariharan_kalarikkal

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I think there was a operation where heads of porkis soldiers or policeman were taken and then burned only the commander of the operation knew it didn't go up to the government as the commander himself said the sf guys and commander of op would go into serious trouble.
Apache?
 

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