Indian Special Forces

[Recon 9]

1 - para sf
2 - airborne para sf

One positive thing about (some) airborne special forces units is that they are procuring new equipment ( Pc , helmat , battle belt ) where as old para sf units are not upgrading as much except some( 9,4,10&1) . It gives some good signs that some airborne units officers know about "right" equipment .
I know it's not up to the global standard . But it's step towards that side , maybe in future we will see some "right" equipment with airborne para sf .

 

[Mangal]

View attachment 215771

LOL who says our SF and Intel agencies were incompetent
Its these ass politicians, bureaucrat , high command that fuck up everything

Why is approval required for an operation for which go ahead was already given that too in indian territory. What kind of SOP is that?

 

[mcpo117]

1 - para sf
2 - airborne para sf

One positive thing about (some) airborne special forces units is that they are procuring new equipment ( Pc , helmat , battle belt ) where as old para sf units are not upgrading as much except some( 9,4,10&1) . It gives some good signs that some airborne units officers know about "right" equipment .
I know it's not up to the global standard . But it's step towards that side , maybe in future we will see some "right" equipment with airborne para sf .

But these are personal purchases right?

 

[Jedi Operator]

1 - para sf
2 - airborne para sf

One positive thing about (some) airborne special forces units is that they are procuring new equipment ( Pc , helmat , battle belt ) where as old para sf units are not upgrading as much except some( 9,4,10&1) . It gives some good signs that some airborne units officers know about "right" equipment .
I know it's not up to the global standard . But it's step towards that side , maybe in future we will see some "right" equipment with airborne para sf .

more like the newly converted airborne want to make them look more "special". They still act as military larpers

 

[Aspirant847]

View attachment 215593
Indias most elite unit being used as glorified security guards to do jobs that CAPF are trained for, lovely.

stfu already man

 

[Recon 9]

But these are personal purchases right?

Don't know about the personal purchase.
But the new airborne special forces unit looks better and uniformily equipped than some para sf units . Lately comtacs , battle belt , plate carrier (armesan tactical ) , highcut helmat are seen with them

 

[Kumaoni]

stfu already man

It’s annoying to see paras being used as security. They are far to trained for it

 

[abingdonboy]

Niggas tryna defend para light infantry using the fucking Pika MMG in 2023 on Reddit

2 man MG teams for GPMG like it’s a infantry unit from the 1980s

Most modern militaries have had mag boxes/pouches for a looong time

what’s more worrying than the equipment is what Paras are showcasing these days in terms of tactics/drills. It’s straight infantry tactics

 

[Kumaoni]

2 man MG teams for GPMG like it’s a infantry unit from the 1980s

Most modern militaries have had mag boxes/pouches for a looong time

what’s more worrying than the equipment is what Paras are showcasing these days in terms of tactics/drills. It’s straight infantry tactics

They are super infantry. They were raised to be as such. They were never really intended to be SOF. If you read about their operations you’ll know they basically did super infantry related things. They are very ruthless and lethal don’t get me wrong (esp with how they operate in 6 man teams), but they are only super infantry in terms of experience, drills. Equipment wise I don’t want to go there

 

[abingdonboy]

I wholeheartedly agree with this guy. His fam has a long history of service in the army as well

Easy cop out. Imagine thinking some neta has told IA to not order ACHs for each soldier or to convert the entire Para regiment into SF

politicians are the reason why IA is asking for jet pack trails when they can’t even issue RFPs for basic equipment?

CAPFs are likely to have far more political interference yet they have managed to modernise, standardise and professionalise dramatically in the last 15years

IA I used to think was a step above the rest of the desi colonial militaries but they are descending into the same fauj elite


At least India is lucky enough to have had civilians powerful enough to peg these guys back over the decades, Pakistan shows what would happen if you give them a free reign. Let the IA cry around losing their special status and colonial relics (cantonments) whilst they cling to their batmen

 

[Kumaoni]

Easy cop out. Imagine thinking some neta has told IA to not order ACHs for each soldier or to convert the entire Para regiment into SF

politicians are the reason why IA is asking for jet pack trails when they can’t even issue RFPs for basic equipment?

CAPFs are likely to have far more political interference yet they have managed to modernise, standardise and professionalise dramatically in the last 15years

IA I used to think was a step above the rest of the desi colonial militaries but they are descending into the same fauj elite


At least India is lucky enough to have had civilians powerful enough to peg these guys back over the decades, Pakistan shows what would happen if you give them a free reign. Let the IA cry around losing their special status and colonial relics (cantonments) whilst they cling to their batmen

The problem is both political interference (I only will blame supposed soft retaliation on this) and command level yes men. Basically, to rise above brigadier, it seems you have to be a legit yes men in the IA. It’s mind boggling the amount of Lt Gens (a minority) even raise the issue of piss poor equipment for the avg jawan. It seems like better procurements are being made for infantry but it’s going too slow and the paras are srilk

I agree with the leadership at mid and lower levels, and it’s why Indias relatively successful with such poor command.

The main issue is political interference (which can severely hinder the hand we are given to operate) and command (incompetence on unimaginable levels- id argue that the IA upper brass is the laziest in the world)

 

[abingdonboy]

Para “special forces” (more like Light infantry) in 2023

Indian Infantry in 1999

Complete and utter retardation by the Indian upper brass (GOC of commands and above). There is hardly any difference between regular infantry from 99 and “special forces” in 2023, besides the rifle. Same shit fiber glass helmet, same outdated PC (looks like a loading vest to me).

Military is run by jokers, zero achievements in last 20 years.

We were a pretty good super infantry force till 2003, someone tell me where we went wrong and why we look like jokers in 2023

Easy times create soft men

+ @COLDHEARTED AVIATOR has mentioned it a number of times over the years and I didn’t ponder too much about it but I do genuinely think it’s a issue with the quality of the candidates. Everyone knows the story, socialist raj era the best and brightest went abroad or aspired for govt jobs. The mammoth growth of the private sector is hoovering up the cream of the crop and the actual formal training is pretty garbage so they aren’t exactly translating mediocre into exceptional. Before they relied on the exceptional coming in the front door.

i think this is a uniquely IA issue, bright minds still go for the more technical services (IN and IAF) but what is the IA left with? Villagers who need a stable income led by nepo babies (army brats)

 

[Suryavanshi]

Jazba and gadar can only take you so far.

If you have jazba than you need the right equipment.
If you have the previous bases covered than you need the right training.

 

[abingdonboy]

The problem is both political interference (I only will blame supposed soft retaliation on this) and command level yes men. Basically, to rise above brigadier, it seems you have to be a legit yes men in the IA. It’s mind boggling the amount of Lt Gens (a minority) even raise the issue of piss poor equipment for the avg jawan. It seems like better procurements are being made for infantry but it’s going too slow and the paras are srilk

I agree with the leadership at mid and lower levels, and it’s why Indias relatively successful with such poor command.

The main issue is political interference (which can severely hinder the hand we are given to operate) and command (incompetence on unimaginable levels- id argue that the IA upper brass is the laziest in the world)

Political interference in operations I’m sure happens but only at a very high level—> PMO to army HQ, but that doesn’t account for the dismal quality of commanders and HQ performance on procurement matters.

career officers having to be yes men is a known phenomenon all over the democratic world, that doesn’t excuse abysmal administrative performance. Are we to believe there’s more political interference in MoD than the ministry of railways? The latter has been able to transform many of its legacy leadership strategies and expand mammoth CAPEX, IA is still operating today how they operated 50 years ago

 

[Kumaoni]

Easy times create soft men

+ @COLDHEARTED AVIATOR has mentioned it a number of times over the years and I didn’t ponder too much about it but I do genuinely think it’s a issue with the quality of the candidates. Everyone knows the story, socialist raj era the best and brightest went abroad or aspired for govt jobs. The mammoth growth of the private sector is hoovering up the cream of the crop and the actual formal training is pretty garbage so they aren’t exactly translating mediocre into exceptional. Before they relied on the exceptional coming in the front door.

i think this is a uniquely IA issue, bright minds still go for the more technical services (IN and IAF) but what is the IA left with? Villagers who need a stable income led by nepo babies (army brats)

Quality has gone down big time. I’m sure you have relatives who are retired in the IA, who used to be unconventional badasses. When our relatives joined they joined because they wanted to make the country proud.

The way officers used to think now as compared to them is also significantly different. Major Gurdeep Bains (later Co) of 2 para used to take active measures in order to reduce casualties of his own men while operating. Major SK Walia used to rush whenmilitants were confirmed sleeping and annihilate them. All to reduce casualties.

The time of man being the man factor behind the weapons are all gone. The army is still stuck in that 90s mentality, in which this was indeed true (that that man behind the weapon was strong), nowadays with the rise of new technology and equipments, training and equipment go hand in hand

 

[abingdonboy]

View attachment 215831


Jazba and gadar can only take you so far.

If you have jazba than you need the right equipment.
If you have the previous bases covered than you need the right training.

In this equation Russia is the China to Ukraine’s India. The West/Indian elites seem to think that a handful of super weapons (MQ9, P8, etc) and ISR inputs can counter a land superpower with industrial depth- sound familiar?

As always- reality always wins. Why does the GoI coverup ground realties than try to engage in kinetic ops?

 

[Kumaoni]

Political interference in operations I’m sure happens but only at a very high level—> PMO to army HQ, but that doesn’t account for the dismal quality of commanders and HQ performance on procurement matters.

career officers having to be yes men is a known phenomenon all over the democratic world, that doesn’t excuse abysmal administrative performance. Are we to believe there’s more political interference in MoD than the ministry of railways? The latter has been able to transform many of its legacy leadership strategies and expand mammoth CAPEX, IA is still operating today how they operated 50 years ago

They are operating worse, I would argue. Back then RR cdo units had such refined SOPs that they managed to capture key hostage takers in 95 by scaling dense jungles. Battalions had massive network sources which would help them take down key militanrs and deliver lethal hits to the militants. Sometimes army patrols of reg infantry units would cross the LoC and lure large ambuush parties and ambush them.

Nowadays what do they do, just walk up and down jungles and forests like headless chickens and take pics of women commandos-jai ho

 

[Kumaoni]

View attachment 215831


Jazba and gadar can only take you so far.

If you have jazba than you need the right equipment.
If you have the previous bases covered than you need the right training.

We have too much guts, we need equipments now. I long for the day we hunt Pakistani and Chinese in modern equipments and ruthlessly slaughter them

 

[abingdonboy]

Quality has gone down big time. I’m sure you have relatives who are retired in the IA, who used to be unconventional badasses. When our relatives joined they joined because they wanted to make the country proud.

The way officers used to think now as compared to them is also significantly different. Major Gurdeep Bains (later Co) of 2 para used to take active measures in order to reduce casualties of his own men while operating. Major SK Walia used to rush whenmilitants were confirmed sleeping and annihilate them. All to reduce casualties.

The time of man being the man factor behind the weapons are all gone. The army is still stuck in that 90s mentality, in which this was indeed true (that that man behind the weapon was strong), nowadays with the rise of new technology and equipments, training and equipment go hand in hand

As someone pointed out here recently- the last generation of badasses all got their early experience in war time, right up to the mid-00s battalion level leadership would’ve served during that time.

the last 15 years has seen senior leadership come through the ranks who have never fired a bullet in anger outside of a COIN op, the most action a lot of them would’ve been as blue helmets in Congo

coupled with the quality issue mentioned above it’s a terrible mix.

 

[Kumaoni]

As someone pointed out here recently- the last generation of badasses all got their early experience in war time, right up to the mid-00s battalion level leadership would’ve served during that time.

the last 15 years has seen senior leadership come through the ranks who have never fired a bullet in anger outside of a COIN op, the most action a lot of them would’ve been as blue helmets in Congo

coupled with the quality issue mentioned above it’s a terrible mix.

I pointed that out lol, most of the senior leadership (note Lt general and Up) were seasoned 71 and siachen veterans.

. Even the current crop should have lots of experience against well trained militants back in the early 2000s. The issue, in my opinion, doesn’t lie with junior or mid level leadership, as they only follow orders of high command. It’s the army command which needs to be blamed and held accountable, Galwan and the recent ambushes have seem to done a good job waking them out of their delusions of thinking that they can take on China with 1990s tier equipment. I am seeing better pics of paras wirh COMTACS, better BPJs and PCs.