Indian Special Forces

DIE UwU

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More like few hundred but rest of the post is accurate. It was indeed a botched operation.
Pasting this comment from reddit ,few details are left out but overall what happened is still in this



The original plan for Red Wings, created by the USMC infantry battalion that was in charge of that sector, was to start out with sending a reinforced scout sniper team of eight Marines, led by a very highly experienced team leader, to infiltrate that area by foot, try to get eyes on the various Named Areas of Interest (different parts of the village) to report on possible activity and location of the target, Ahmed Shah. They'd be reporting back, at which point a company sized raid force would air assault into the area with Chinooks, to both establish blocking positions preventing anyone from leaving/entering the area, and an assault force to clear the buildings. The problem was that Marine battalion was not operating as part of a Marine Air Ground Task Force and didn't have organic lift capacity, and it would take months going through the channels to the divisional HQ in charge of Regional Command East to get them. However, the regional Combined Joint Special Operations Task Force – Afghanistan (CJSOTF-A) did have their own organic air lift capacity, and were always looking for work. It was much easier and faster to go through them to try to get help, which is what the Marines did.


It was a SEAL team commander who ran that CJSOTF-A, and after some bargaining, it was agreed that in order to give helo support from the 160th SOAR, both the assault element and the recon would be done by the SEALs, while the Marines would set up blocking positions and take over the SSE and detainee ops, so the SEALs could be airlifted out as soon as Shah or other targets were killed/captured. The Marines agreed, they just wanted Shah and didn't really care who got them.


The SEAL assault force was very experienced, but they had been ordered to make use of the SEAL SVD teams attached to them, so it was decided to use them ground recon despite none of them being trained on that stuff. Of that four man team, only one had ever done a combat deployment before (Luttrell), doing nothing at all remotely like what they were being tasked with doing for Red Wings. The Marines gave them the OPORDER and helped them plan, gave pointers because they knew the terrain and had a lot of experience doing that stuff. For instance, their scout snipers flat out told Murphy's team that the MBITR they planned to rely on for comms wouldn't work, it didn't have enough power. But they disregarded the advice.


To avoid a long walk, both stressful and dangerous, increasing the chance of being compromised, the SEALs decided to be airlifted within ~500 meters of the designated observation posts. That is a MAJOR no-no within the recon community, but again, they weren't trained. To try to mitigate the threat, the 160th spent the week beforehand flying all over the area doing false insertions, to try to trick the enemy into not knowing when/where the real one would be. And while that technique does work in some scenarios (namely when the enemy is already alert), in this case it only solidly tipped off Shah and his bunch. There is a video of them in the hills the day before Red Wings actually kicked off, patrolling around looking for infiltrators.


Then during the mission, when they fast roped onto the LZ, the rope was detached but Murphy's team didn't hide the rope. Then when they got soft compromised by the goat herders they didn't end mission and start their E&E plan (which they didn't appear to even have). They lost comms, which wasn't a surprise. They let the goat herders go instead of gagging them and flex cuffing them to some trees. After letting them go they only moved a few hundred meters away and sat there for a while. When they got ambushed on their walk back up the high ground, they didn't execute any sort of proper counter ambush battle drill. Murphy exposed himself by trying to establish comms in the middle of a firefight instead of taking charge and trying to break contact and escape. By transmitting a garbled plea for help, the QRF got sucked into a skirmish they had no intel on other than Murphy's team were in trouble. By the time the QRF arrived, Murphy's team were all dead, minus Luttrell who ran/fell down the mountain (which is what all of them should have done). And then the QRF bird, instead of waiting for their slower Apache escort to first scan and scope out an LZ, landed within a few hundred meters of Murphy's original LZ, which had an RPG team camped on it, just in case.


OP Red Wings was basically a "what not to do" compiling of lessons learned for a recon mission
 

Kumaoni

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Most of the people comparing indian units directly to foreign units especially american sof and uksf actually need to do this a bit.
American soldiers do numerous successful military operations that I cannot even name but my Insticts confirm to me that Indian sf is jealous of them
 

DIE UwU

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Pasting this comment from reddit ,few details are left out but overall what happened is still in this



The original plan for Red Wings, created by the USMC infantry battalion that was in charge of that sector, was to start out with sending a reinforced scout sniper team of eight Marines, led by a very highly experienced team leader, to infiltrate that area by foot, try to get eyes on the various Named Areas of Interest (different parts of the village) to report on possible activity and location of the target, Ahmed Shah. They'd be reporting back, at which point a company sized raid force would air assault into the area with Chinooks, to both establish blocking positions preventing anyone from leaving/entering the area, and an assault force to clear the buildings. The problem was that Marine battalion was not operating as part of a Marine Air Ground Task Force and didn't have organic lift capacity, and it would take months going through the channels to the divisional HQ in charge of Regional Command East to get them. However, the regional Combined Joint Special Operations Task Force – Afghanistan (CJSOTF-A) did have their own organic air lift capacity, and were always looking for work. It was much easier and faster to go through them to try to get help, which is what the Marines did.


It was a SEAL team commander who ran that CJSOTF-A, and after some bargaining, it was agreed that in order to give helo support from the 160th SOAR, both the assault element and the recon would be done by the SEALs, while the Marines would set up blocking positions and take over the SSE and detainee ops, so the SEALs could be airlifted out as soon as Shah or other targets were killed/captured. The Marines agreed, they just wanted Shah and didn't really care who got them.


The SEAL assault force was very experienced, but they had been ordered to make use of the SEAL SVD teams attached to them, so it was decided to use them ground recon despite none of them being trained on that stuff. Of that four man team, only one had ever done a combat deployment before (Luttrell), doing nothing at all remotely like what they were being tasked with doing for Red Wings. The Marines gave them the OPORDER and helped them plan, gave pointers because they knew the terrain and had a lot of experience doing that stuff. For instance, their scout snipers flat out told Murphy's team that the MBITR they planned to rely on for comms wouldn't work, it didn't have enough power. But they disregarded the advice.


To avoid a long walk, both stressful and dangerous, increasing the chance of being compromised, the SEALs decided to be airlifted within ~500 meters of the designated observation posts. That is a MAJOR no-no within the recon community, but again, they weren't trained. To try to mitigate the threat, the 160th spent the week beforehand flying all over the area doing false insertions, to try to trick the enemy into not knowing when/where the real one would be. And while that technique does work in some scenarios (namely when the enemy is already alert), in this case it only solidly tipped off Shah and his bunch. There is a video of them in the hills the day before Red Wings actually kicked off, patrolling around looking for infiltrators.


Then during the mission, when they fast roped onto the LZ, the rope was detached but Murphy's team didn't hide the rope. Then when they got soft compromised by the goat herders they didn't end mission and start their E&E plan (which they didn't appear to even have). They lost comms, which wasn't a surprise. They let the goat herders go instead of gagging them and flex cuffing them to some trees. After letting them go they only moved a few hundred meters away and sat there for a while. When they got ambushed on their walk back up the high ground, they didn't execute any sort of proper counter ambush battle drill. Murphy exposed himself by trying to establish comms in the middle of a firefight instead of taking charge and trying to break contact and escape. By transmitting a garbled plea for help, the QRF got sucked into a skirmish they had no intel on other than Murphy's team were in trouble. By the time the QRF arrived, Murphy's team were all dead, minus Luttrell who ran/fell down the mountain (which is what all of them should have done). And then the QRF bird, instead of waiting for their slower Apache escort to first scan and scope out an LZ, landed within a few hundred meters of Murphy's original LZ, which had an RPG team camped on it, just in case.


OP Red Wings was basically a "what not to do" compiling of lessons learned for a recon mission
Few more details,I would like to add from old research I did.

Investigating part of USMC found that the strenght of shah local militia was around a dozen men and on that specific day it was even less.

The Seal QRF team leader told the chicnook pilots to have them land after attack helicopters were held back which lead to other seals being killed with chinnok.

Luttrell was a coward ,Movies shows that murphy died after making radio call but in reality he was alive and screaming for luttrell to help but he ran away, their is video where his screams can be heard

Lutrell lied that he was out of ammo, he was found with all his mags intact ,he just ran away without fighting,

He also put out false claims of their being hundreds of fighter while there were less than dozen of them,

The reason they didnt hide the ropes was because all aviation units retract the ropes but the 160th dropes them ,they were clueless about what to do with the ropes lol
The ropes was the reason the militia closed in on them and after releasing the goat hearders they signed their death certificate.
 

jai jaganath

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If they could standardize it then it's a very good development wrt them and their mentality
Ofcourse the camo is shit but don't worry this will go soon as new camps start arriving in mass
Anyway if they could standardize square cut pc, radio/sdr, ptt, highcut helmets then its a nice move
Yeah but highcuts without comtacs are not good but u can't expect it from para, u can't even expect shooter cut pc or proper mordern shoes or integrated elbow pads or sdr or proper pc setup or IR strobes or nvg or most important battle belt
 

Kumaoni

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If they could standardize it then it's a very good development wrt them and their mentality
Ofcourse the camo is shit but don't worry this will go soon as new camps start arriving in mass
Anyway if they could standardize square cut pc, radio/sdr, ptt, highcut helmets then its a nice move
Yeah but highcuts without comtacs are not good but u can't expect it from para or even shooter cut or proper mordern shoes or integrated elbow pads or sdr or proper pc setup or IR strobes or nvg or most important battle belt
Para retards don’t even wear helmets in combat. This is far beyond their low iq of understanding.
 

Corvus Splendens

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need quarter zip, some tactical trousers with integrated elbow and knee protection, good boots, better rifle setup, and he may pass off as decent
Utility belt with pouches, fire and cut resistant kevler gloves, comtacs, helmet mounted nods, thermal sight on rifle, kydex style hard sidearm holster, fire resistant face mask, suppressors, ballistic shooter's glasses, low visibility patches and insignia, flame retardant kevler-aramid weave combat shirts, wrist mounted combat computers with satellite uplink for topographical and tactical information.
 

Blood+

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IMO the Indian skinny physique also kinda plays a role in making them look like larpers.
Absolutely. I think there's something wrong with our genetics. I mean I'm a pahari yet I have got spindly and long-ish legs and no matter how many squats I perform, my thighs just wouldn't grow. :facepalm:
 
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Blood+

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Utility belt with pouches, fire and cut resistant kevler gloves, comtacs, helmet mounted nods, thermal sight on rifle, kydex style hard sidearm holster, fire resistant face mask, suppressors, ballistic shooter's glasses, low visibility patches and insignia, flame retardant kevler-aramid weave combat shirts, wrist mounted combat computers with satellite uplink for topographical and tactical information.
I wonder if the Generals in charge of logistics department are aware of even half of the items you just mentioned. By the way, you should have included infrared strobe lights in your list.
 

Tactical Doge

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Utility belt with pouches, fire and cut resistant kevler gloves, comtacs, helmet mounted nods, thermal sight on rifle, kydex style hard sidearm holster, fire resistant face mask, suppressors, ballistic shooter's glasses, low visibility patches and insignia, flame retardant kevler-aramid weave combat shirts, wrist mounted combat computers with satellite uplink for topographical and tactical information.
I'm talking about being decent, you went pro
 

Kumaoni

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Absolutely. I think there's something wrong with our genetics. I mean I'm a pahari yet I have got spindly and long-ish legs and no matter how many squats I perform, my thighs just wouldn't grow. :facepalm:
Which pahadi are you sir?

nothing wrong withgenetics it’s something wrong with our diets. When I stop eating all that Indian carb shit my face and body both become far leaner and less bloated
 

Kumaoni

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Utility belt with pouches, fire and cut resistant kevler gloves, comtacs, helmet mounted nods, thermal sight on rifle, kydex style hard sidearm holster, fire resistant face mask, suppressors, ballistic shooter's glasses, low visibility patches and insignia, flame retardant kevler-aramid weave combat shirts, wrist mounted combat computers with satellite uplink for topographical and tactical information.
It’s no wonder the Indians have never won a single war post independence. Their generals can’t even procure proper equipment
 

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