Indian Special Forces (archived)

[ALBY]

There are no good bull-pups Which chamber`s M43, besides many would argue why need another AK when one have VZ-58, Though PARA still have VZ-58 & AKM, In many occasion saw them with both, One is service other is captured, But TAR-21 is liked coz its accurate ( Less Shots & Very stable in suppressive fire )

US lobby at MOD..

VZ-58 was lighter than AKM and reliable as AKM compare to INSAS, And INSAS had many faults during that time..

Kunal what about the ammunition to be used in the M4s which is gonna to be inducted?are they compatible with Indian 5.56 ammo perfectly or the deal includes ammunition also as we did in case of galil snipers? What about the performance of M4s chambered for 6.8mm which is operational in some SWAT units?Although I watched its performance compared with G36 in the program world's deadliest warrior in which the later losed,am not completely buying it as it was a commercial program.

 

[Immanuel]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

The video shows just dip and take out. The oiling of the machine will prevent mudding and watering. The beauty lies when the rifle is underground or in the water for a month taken out and starts firing.

AK can do that... and only AK can do that. That is how terrorist dump their weapons when not needed for months, just take out when required and it still fires...

the video is a humbug advertisement...

I would like the AK to survive an explosive device and we'll see how it compares to this M-4, this one certainly beats many rifles out there in sheer ruggedness. Everything needs marketing to sell, not a bad Ad in 12 minutes. Whether you dip it in water for a moment or leave it there for a month has little added value. Practically in daily use our soldiers are certainly not going to leave it in water or mud for months. We fortunately don't operate using terrorist tactics. We still have the capability of fighting a respectable war.

Don't get me wrong the AK is great weapon, I have myself fired it many a time, it is one of my favorites but it isn't the only reliable rifle out there. Now whether our soldiers use the AK or any other rifle for that matter, daily quick cleaning is standard procedure, even with the AK.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Kunal what about the ammunition to be used in the M4s which is gonna to be inducted?are they compatible with Indian 5.56 ammo perfectly or the deal includes ammunition also as we did in case of galil snipers? What about the performance of M4s chambered for 6.8mm which is operational in some SWAT units?Although I watched its performance compared with G36 in the program world's deadliest warrior in which the later losed,am not completely buying it as it was a commercial program.

Same Ammo used in INSAS,TAR, OFB ammo is same as NATO ammo no change, AFAIK Galil use OFB 7.62nato same used in FN-MAG..

6.8mm is in RFI for FINSAS Rifle, And have potential..

TV commercials are good in TV..

 

[ALBY]

Same Ammo used in INSAS,TAR, OFB ammo is same as NATO ammo no change, AFAIK Galil use OFB 7.62nato same used in FN-MAG..

6.8mm is in RFI for FINSAS Rifle, And have potential..

TV commercials are good in TV..

I asked coz it was evident from some of your earlier posts the 5.56 ammunition used by NATO forces and that one manufactured by OFB is having changes in operational capabilities just like the 7.62 x39 ones produced in Russia and erstwhile Yugoslavia.
Btw as part of deal some 1.7 lack rounds of snipergrade ammunition for galatz was imported along rifle .the ofb made 7.62 will be compatible with galatz but Israeli ones are sniper grade.

 

[Bhadra]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Water resistance QR is must for bearing the monsoon season operations and jungle operations, operations in the NE where it rains practically all the months, for salty water amphibious operations, canal crossings etc

Good quality greasing and oiling will ensure the weapon will fire after being in water for more than ten minutes. The running parts must run smoothly and lesser these are the better. That is why direct gas action weapons are more rugged.M-4 are piston action.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

I asked coz it was evident from some of your earlier posts the 5.56 ammunition used by NATO forces and that one manufactured by OFB is having changes in operational capabilities just like the 7.62 x39 ones produced in Russia and erstwhile Yugoslavia.
Btw as part of deal some 1.7 lack rounds of snipergrade ammunition for galatz was imported along rifle .the ofb made 7.62 will be compatible with galatz but Israeli ones are sniper grade.

I dont think i mentioned something like that, Never seen Foreign rounds only OFB made ammo..

But yes Indian rounds are based on SS109 Nato 5.56mm and other used different..



Very possible, Sniper Grade ammo is expensive though..

 

[Bhadra]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Weight and quality of grains in ammunition varieties differe. Snipper garde rounds have better and more grains as also better exactitudes and weight of bullet.

 

[Shaitan]

 

[sayareakd]

one question can the extended P rail be added to 12 o clock and short rail at 6 O clock on TAR 21 with Indian forces ?

like this

 

[Shaitan]

0:34---

 

[Pablo Munoz]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

Are you using your translator or Its you mistaking that SF and MOD makes Mistakes ?

 

[Bhadra]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

So has the Indian SF made a mistake between the difference of the M4 and the HK416? Have they already gone out and bought the M4?

Kunal still would say they are buying HK416.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Kunal still would say they Should buy HK416.

Fixed for you..

 

[vishwaprasad]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

yeah now at least after getting humiliated by US for Jalashwa checking now its high time for us to say NO to this rifle which is not at all comparable with TAR-21.

 

[ALBY]

yeah now at least after getting humiliated by US for Jalashwa checking now its high time for us to say NO to this rifle which is not at all comparable with TAR-21.

So does the prices too..

 

[AshutoshNSingh]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Why don't our SFs use FN F2000s instead of or along with TAR 21? Already in use with SPG?The ultra-compact ARs are highly reliable. Their TR variants can also be fitted with miscellaneous accessories.

And buy M4s for PARAs is really stupid indeed. If they wanted conventional design carbines, amny better options were available.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

Why don't our SFs use FN F2000s instead of or along with TAR 21?

TAR-21 complete all necessary needs for PARAs, FN2000 wont make any difference..

 

[ALBY]

TAR-21 complete all necessary needs for PARAs, FN2000 wont make any difference..

Absolutely right kunal.as far as tavors are good there is no need to go for another bullpup as the difference made by most of the modern rifles are minimal let alone their prices.Plus FN2000 is more expensive than TAR which itself costs approx 2.5 lakhs.There is no need for a new one asfar as we are not going to use them in any shooting competitions or weapon expos rather than killing foes.

 

[Immanuel]

Re: M4 Rifles for Army SF Units

A proper M-4 made by Daniel Defence is still far more reliable than the TAR-21, they also seem cheaper, they also come with different barrel lengths and other options. There are as i said many variants of it, Ordering AR based rifles is not really a big issue.

https://danieldefense.com/rifles.html

Alexander arms Grendel and Beowulf are also beautiful rifles, ideal for a lot of SF roles.