India S-400 Acquisition - News Updates and Discussions

[Frontrunner]

IDK but we really only need the first system to get here before a conflict with Pak (maybe 2 at the most if we want one for the Chinese just in case). Once we have that, we can turn all of Pak into a no-fly zone from onset of hostilities. I expect the 2020's to be very eventful for India; especially given the global and regional context, and India's very able leadership.

3 systems of s400 is what we need to make our Western border completely impregnable.. also to remember Indian army will also start receiving MRSAM (barak 8) by 2020.. that means Pakistani fizaya will note even dare to send their taiayaare anywhere near loc.. sans for a kamikaze missions.. come 2020 we gonna revolutionaize entire air combat spectrum wis a wis hapless PAF.. with RAFALE, S400, MRSAM.. this gives an insurance to us to inflict balakot 2.0 without any side effects..

 

[WolfPack86]

#Russia will deliver S-400 air defence systems to India in strict accordance with the schedule, within 18-19 months, and the contract has been already prepaid, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov said.

"The advance payment has been received and everything will be delivered in strict accordance with the schedule, within about 18-19 months," Borisov said in the air of Rossiya 1 broadcaster.
.https://www.facebook.com/pg/TeamAMCA/photos/?ref=page_internal

 

[sorcerer]

Mystery S-400 Modification Spotted in Newspaper Photo


Eagle-eyed observers from bmpd, a military blog affiliated with the Center for Analysis of Strategies & Technologies (CAST), a Moscow-based defence-related think tank, were the first to spot the unique-looking S-400, and assumed that alongside the more standard-looking 48N6 missile (which has a range of up to 250 km), the cluster of missiles off to other side of the launcher’s bed were 9M96s – a shorter-range (12-120 km) guided missile also used in the system.

https://sputniknews.com/military/20...-400-modification-spotted-in-newspaper-photo/

 

[Jameson Emoni]

In case, you were wondering when we will get our first S-400.

---

Russia’s Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation confirmed on June 26 that delivery of five squadrons of Russian-made Almaz-Antei S-400 Triumf air defense systems (NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler) for service in the Indian Air Force (IAF) will begin in 2020.

“The deliveries of S-400 Triumf missile systems to India are planned to start after 2020, in accordance with the agreement with our partners. Issues with payment have been resolved,” the service was quoted as saying by TASS news agency.

India will likely pay for the Russian-made weapons systems in euros to a Russia-nominated bank to avoid the threat of U.S. sanctions for purchase under U.S. legislation known as the Countering America’s Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA), according to The Economic Times.

...

https://thediplomat.com/2019/07/rus...-defense-systems-to-india-will-begin-in-2020/

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Read this first: https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...ense-system-why-is-us-upset-turkey-bought-it/

This article should answer your question of F-35 and why it cannot be close to S-400. There’s more than you know about S-400 countermeasures which are already in place. If Houthis can penetrate Patriot system with basic Iranian drones, do you think US cannot penetrate a Russian system? I will stop there. Thanks. OSINT will be available shortly.

I'm waiting to see some s-400 vs F-35 action which can happen in turkey if edergon is starting a nuclear program .
India have different priorities we needed s-400 because it's the cheapest system if see how much area it covers. Chinese and Pakistan will have 75+ squadrons india cannot afford that much jets.
And our operations are mostly defensive. So from our point of view it's the best system and changes geographical balance. With MR-Sam and s-400 india will make PAF useless. S-400 single launching pad have enough ammunition to destroy a saturated attack. S-400 is truly a game changing system it can fire different types of missile from a single launcher.
Let's be real Americans always thought about air dominance and Russians always about air denial since they cannot match America in aircraft technology now.

India doesn't need F-35 because will not give crucial technology for maintenance and support which means for repairs we would have needed to go to south korea or Israel. And seeing our threat we cannot afford to keep a blind airforce.

India will get more than 1500-2000 engines from US for amca and tejas mk-2. And india also needs some kind of geographical influence with Russia. It's not in our interest to have anti india Russia Americans are also cooling down on them. Because they also don't want to see a Chinese owned Russia.


S-400 is a good system. It's the only weapon which brings them back into game of weapons besides that su-57 su-30 all are generation behind US.

India asked for thaad in 2010 US rejected it. We went on building our own anti nuclear defence system.
So buying thaad and patriot now is Idiotic

 

[WolfPack86]

#Moscow, #NewDelhi in talks over #S400 missiles production in India: Rostec CEO


.

Moscow is holding talks with New Delhi on starting the production of S-400 Air Defense Systems in India, said Sergey Chemezov, CEO of Russia`s Rostec state corporation on Sunday. “Yes, we are discussing the localization [of S-400 production] with India as well,” Chemezov told the RBK broadcaster, adding that India has already acquired the license for the production of a lot of technology, such as the Su-30 fighter jet and the T-90 tank, reported Sputnik.

“We have developed the BrahMos missiles together with them [India], on their territory, together with their scientists,” Chemezov pointed out.Last month, External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar was in Moscow to meet his Russian counterpart Sergey Lavrov to discuss ways to further advance bilateral cooperation.

New Delhi had signed a USD 5.43 billion deal with Russia for the purchase of five S-400s during the 19th India-Russia Annual Bilateral Summit in New Delhi on October 5, 2018, last year, which Washington had indicated may trigger Countering America`s Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA) sanctions.

Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov on last week had said S-400 air defence missile systems will be delivered to India in strict accordance with the schedule.”The advance payment has been received and everything will be delivered in strict accordance with the schedule, within about 18-19 months,” Borisov told state-owned broadcaster Rossiya-1.
https://www.facebook.com/pg/TeamAMCA/photos/?ref=page_internal

 

[WolfPack86]

S-400 vs Patriot Missiles : Russia Mocks 'Brilliant' US Systems that failed to protect Saudi Oil Refinery
The attack on Saudi Arabian oil facilities last weekend were a disaster for both Riyadh and Washington, with weapons allegedly made in Iran circumventing expensive U.S. missile defense systems.

But in Moscow, news of the attack was greeted as yet another chance to mock the United States and its allies - all while extolling the virtues of Russia's own missile defense technology.

"We still remember the fantastic U.S. missiles that failed to hit a target more than a year ago, while now the brilliant U.S. air defense systems could not repel an attack," Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova told a briefing on Friday. "These are all links in a chain."


Russian President Vladimir Putin, in Ankara for a meeting with Turkish and Iranian leaders on Monday, went further by suggesting that Saudi Arabia would have been saved from Saturday's attack if they had purchased a missile defense system made by Russia.

"The political leadership of Saudi Arabia just needs to make a wise state decision," Putin said on Monday, pointing to the purchase of the S-300 missile system by Iran and the S-400 missile system by Turkey.

The rivalry between the United States and Russia over arms sales has existed ever since the Cold War; between 2014 and 2018, they were the two largest exporters of arms in the world, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute.

But over the past few years, that rivalry has grown especially bitter as geopolitical conflict and new technology brought U.S. and Russian arms into close contact. In the Middle East, where tension and war have led to a surge in arms sales, Washington and Moscow often compete for the same clients.

Though the United States generally claims to offer superiority, some weapons systems produced by Russia are challenging that. Chief among them is the S-400 missile defense system, a widely-touted - though ultimately untested - rival to the U.S.-made Patriot missile system.

The attack on the oil facilities in the Saudi districts of Khurais and Abqaiq on Saturday morning appeared to involve cruise missiles and drones that were able to avoid detection by and activation of Saudi Arabia's missile defense system.

Notably, that system includes Patriot batteries and it is generally designed to combat ballistic missiles and airplanes that can be spotted from further away.

As cruise missiles and drones can fly closer to the ground, the curvature of the earth makes them harder for radar to spot unless the radar is elevated.

Russia's systems are capable of using mobile radar masts to combat this problem. The S-400 is also designed to operate in any direction, whereas Patriot systems are limited to whatever direction they are set up in: some analysts have suggested that many of the Patriot batteries deployed near the oil facilities targeted on Saturday may not have been looking in the right direction to deter the attack.

"This Saudi attack shows the absolute imperative of 360 degree capability," said Tom Karako, the director of the Missile Defense Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

While Russia's S-400 system may have impressive specifications on paper, many analysts are cautious in their assessment of it. It has not been fully tested in real life, whereas the Patriot system successfully intercepted missiles during both the Gulf War and the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq.

Some research has also pointed to potential weak spots in the S-400′s system. Russia's military industrial complex is known for its secrecy about potential military failures: in recent months, the country has seen a mysterious missile explosion and a deadly accident on a nuclear submarine, while last year a covert Russian mercenary group in Syria suffered a humiliating defeat by U.S. forces.

But Moscow disputes the efficacy of U.S. weapons as well. As Zakharova said Friday, Russia dismissed the impact of missile strikes by the United States, along with Britain and France, in April 2018 on targets in Syria after the use of chemical weapons by forces loyal to Syrian President Bashar al-Assad.

At the time, Russia claimed that Syrian air defenses had shot down 71 of 103 missiles fired; the Pentagon denied this figure and Moscow provided no evidence. Russia has supplied antimissile systems to Syria, but it said that S-400s deployed to protect a Russian base in Syria only monitored the attack.

For all the rivalry between American and Russian weapons systems, the battle has mostly played out on the political level so far. Moscow has courted a number of U.S. allies to purchase Russia's missile defense systems, which cost considerably less than their American counterparts. India and Qatar have publicly mulled buying the S-400.

NATO ally Turkey announced it intended to buy the system this summer, prompting the United States to suspend Turkish involvement with the American F-35 program. Kathryn Wheelbarger, U.S. acting assistant secretary of defense, had said in May that the "S-400 is a Russian system designed to shoot down an aircraft like the F-35," an advanced U.S. stealth fighter.

In theory, the range of a surface-to-air missiles carried by an F-35 should allow it to destroy an S-400 before it is detected by its radar, but that idea has not been tested in practice. Both Washington and Moscow likely hope that it will never will be: For both countries, a little ambiguity can be lucrative.
http://www.defencenews.in/article.aspx?id=667013

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Well Russia's Pantsir was caught pants down in Syria, when the Israelis attacked...

 

[asianobserve]

Well Russia's Pantsir was caught pants down in Syria, when the Israelis attacked...

And the Saudis are so inept at being a professional and effective military that it's very hard to explain. Surely, this is not so much a failure of the Patriot, it's more like a failure of organization. The Saudi royals are so paranoid of coups that their military is distributed across dofferent agencies and factions without much coordination between them.

According to a wistle blower, at one time the CIA provided real-time intelligence of 8 Houthis who have entered Saudi Arabian territory and the Saudi military wasn't able to send in forces to catch or neutralize the. The Americans cant believe it since they were looking at tge Houthis live resting and the after 8 hours the Houthis got back to Yemeni territory.

In any case, whatrver the Saudi or Patriot PAC-2 shortcomings, you cannot belittle the success of the Iranian drone attavks. It was superbly planned and executed. I would bet thst the intelligence about the loopholes of tge defenses of the Saudis both organizational and hsrdware was solid.

 

[Deathstar]

And the Saudis are so inept at being a professional and effective military that it's very hard to explain. Surely, this is not so much a failure of the Patriot, it's more like a failure of organization. The Saudi royals are so paranoid of coups that their military is distributed across dofferent agencies and factions without much coordination between them.

According to a wistle blower, at one time the CIA provided real-time intelligence of 8 Houthis who have entered Saudi Arabian territory and the Saudi military wasn't able to send in forces to catch or neutralize the. The Americans cant believe it since they were looking at tge Houthis live resting and the after 8 hours the Houthis got back to Yemeni territory.

In any case, whatrver the Saudi or Patriot PAC-2 shortcomings, you cannot belittle the success of the Iranian drone attavks. It was superbly planned and executed. I would bet thst the intelligence about the loopholes of tge defenses of the Saudis both organizational and hsrdware was solid.

True Saudi monarchy is so shit scared that they have made their military weak. Common Saudi has become shit lazy due to too much wealth. Their army mostly consists of mercernaries.
Iranians will run havoc on these arab donkeys.
Once oil finishes , America will simply pull out. Oil will finish gulfie extremists

 

[Aaj ka hero]

Once oil finishes , America will simply pull out. Oil will finish gulfie extremists

Hope that day come fast, we are paying asia premium( can't understand the reason for this) to these desert civilization.

 

[IndianHawk]

Well Russia's Pantsir was caught pants down in Syria, when the Israelis attacked...

Yet in Syria USA has lost the war!! Wonder how effective stealth fighter really are??

 

[asianobserve]

Yet in Syria USA has lost the war!! Wonder how effective stealth fighter really are??

US lost the war in Syria? Think again. Before the Syrian uprising Syria was a ME power to recon with its own oowerful proxy tge Hezbollah. Now Hizbolkaw is already more otganized than the Syrian giverment. Most of all Syria is now dismembered with Assad not controlling larfe swathsm and tge worst, American bases are now inside Syria.

So yes, Assad was not toppLed. But is that really the intention of the America or simoky to weaken Assad to orotect Israel. After all Assad is stilk so much better than ISIS.

In the meantimes, long tern US allies tge Kurds have now their ownbterritory in b9th Iraq and Syria.

I don't consider it a fsilure.

 

[IndianHawk]

US lost the war in Syria? Think again. Before the Syrian uprising Syria was a ME power to recon with its own oowerful proxy tge Hezbollah. Now Hizbolkaw is already more otganized than the Syrian giverment. Most of all Syria is now dismembered with Assad not controlling larfe swathsm and tge worst, American bases are now inside Syria.

So yes, Assad was not toppLed. But is that really the intention of the America or simoky to weaken Assad to orotect Israel. After all Assad is stilk so much better than ISIS.

In the meantimes, long tern US allies tge Kurds have now their ownbterritory in b9th Iraq and Syria.

I don't consider it a fsilure.

American goal was to remove Asad. Asad is still there and American troops out of Syria. America has once again stooped low and is supporting terrorism against Asad.

America lost in Syria. I

lost in Afghanistan as it's now being humiliated and forced to talk with Taliban .

It lost in Vietnam too. Why is it so difficult to accept failure when your own objectives of war has not been achieved.

 

[asianobserve]

American goal was to remove Asad. Asad is still there and American troops out of Syria. America has once again stooped low and is supporting terrorism against Asad.

America lost in Syria. I

lost in Afghanistan as it's now being humiliated and forced to talk with Taliban .

It lost in Vietnam too. Why is it so difficult to accept failure when your own objectives of war has not been achieved.

Look again. There are American basis now in Syria. Do you think Syria won?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ax...ast-5e96fdb2-c7ba-4f26-90b4-7bf452f83847.html

 

[bhramos]

US Reportedly Warns Allies of Sanctions as India Defends Its 'Sovereign Right' to Buy Russian S-400s

 

[Armand2REP]

My only problem buying S-400 is that China will have it and give all information and practice necessary to defeat it to Pakistan. It goes both ways with IAF knowing how to defeat it against China but the Chinese are only getting it to copy which will then not be the same.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

My only problem buying S-400 is that China will have it and give all information and practice necessary to defeat it to Pakistan. It goes both ways with IAF knowing how to defeat it against China but the Chinese are only getting it to copy which will then not be the same.

This what Russian military have to say.

"All the fears about the leak of technology are greatly exaggerated, especially so far as anti-aircraft missiles are concerned," Khodarenko said. "Even if they were to disassemble the system down to the last bolt to try to pull out some military secrets, they would still be left with nothing. Besides, this system will be delivered to China, and we can be sure that they will disassemble it."

Copying technology now days is extremely difficult. Chinese can copy hardware like jet engine and all but copying software without and avionics without software code is difficult. Non the less for Chinese everything is possible.

 

[Armand2REP]

This what Russian military have to say.

"All the fears about the leak of technology are greatly exaggerated, especially so far as anti-aircraft missiles are concerned," Khodarenko said. "Even if they were to disassemble the system down to the last bolt to try to pull out some military secrets, they would still be left with nothing. Besides, this system will be delivered to China, and we can be sure that they will disassemble it."

That doesn't stop Pakistan or China from training against it to learn how to defeat it. As far as Russian encryption it is rudimentary at best. Chinese hackers would have no problem getting to that source code.

 

[ezsasa]

My only problem buying S-400 is that China will have it and give all information and practice necessary to defeat it to Pakistan. It goes both ways with IAF knowing how to defeat it against China but the Chinese are only getting it to copy which will then not be the same.

Two things:
1) if we go by the hungama the pakis have created for downing their F-16, it’s clear they worry more about their image than loss of their assets(both man and equipment). since S-400 is a defensive systems, chances of Paki deploying anything against it remote.

2) it looks like S-400 is a stop gap arrangement until indigenous system is developed. Once ready over a period of time, S-400 will become a supplementary system rather than primary.