India-China Border conflict

[Angel of War]

Take some time.
You need to see the ORBAT for both the PLA AF and the IAF, first, in terms of air-bases, second, in terms of resources that the PLA AF can place IF they wish.
The problem is that much more than the Pakistani and Indian armed forces, the PLA is heavily reliant on very good logistics. They have planned to be able to concentrate forces very rapidly on any given point of their border within certain time periods.

Can't we do the same and do a counter buildup especially since our infra is imroving rapidly . Like PLA wants to be able to concentrate multiple group armies from various theatre commands at the time and location of their choosing then we should also be able to rapidly deploy our assets from the western borders to the east . After all , we're not short on formations are we ? 40 divisions with many independent brigades is a very big number after all .

 

[Angel of War]

There is a very interesting paper on the current Chinese philosophy of warfare. When I have a little time, I will try to locate it and pass it over.

thanks

 

[Joe Shearer]

Can't we do the same and do a counter buildup especially since our infra is imroving rapidly . Like PLA wants to be able to concentrate multiple group armies from various theatre commands at the time and location of their choosing then we should also be able to rapidly deploy our assets from the western borders to the east . After all , we're not short on formations are we ? 40 divisions with many independent brigades is a very big number after all .

I would define the problem VERY differently.

 

[Angel of War]

I would define the problem VERY differently.

Can you explain ?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Can you explain ?

Just bullet points.

Drastically reduce head-count.
Smaller formations - the tetra-brigade, or even smaller.
Far better equipment, not our present nanga-bhukha soldiery.
Centralised logistics, communications and medical services.
Very high mobility in the plains.
Very fixed numbers in the high mountains.

Follow Mao - 'flout the enemy strategically, respect him tactically.'

 

[Joe Shearer]

Just bullet points.

Drastically reduce head-count.
Smaller formations - the tetra-brigade, or even smaller.
Far better equipment, not our present nanga-bhukha soldiery.
Centralised logistics, communications and medical services.
Very high mobility in the plains.
Very fixed numbers in the high mountains.

Follow Mao - 'flout the enemy strategically, respect him tactically.'

DON'T give me those like icons. What do you think?

 

[Love Charger]

Just bullet points.

Drastically reduce head-count.
Smaller formations - the tetra-brigade, or even smaller.
Far better equipment, not our present nanga-bhukha soldiery.
Centralised logistics, communications and medical services.
Very high mobility in the plains.
Very fixed numbers in the high mountains.

Follow Mao - 'flout the enemy strategically, respect him tactically.'

How will reducing head count will help .
If nothing else will work , then india will have to throw soldiers at them .
And i dont think men deployed at China are poor equipped , although glaring deficiencies remain.

 

[Love Charger]

Just bullet points.

Drastically reduce head-count.
Smaller formations - the tetra-brigade, or even smaller.
Far better equipment, not our present nanga-bhukha soldiery.
Centralised logistics, communications and medical services.
Very high mobility in the plains.
Very fixed numbers in the high mountains.

Follow Mao - 'flout the enemy strategically, respect him tactically.'

Basically Russia like Tactical battle groups

 

[Joe Shearer]

How will reducing head count will help .
If nothing else will work , then india will have to throw soldiers at them .
And i dont think men deployed at China are poor equipped , although glaring deficiencies remain.

The LAST thing we should do is throw soldiers at them.
The FIRST thing we should do is to kill as many of them as possible.

Soldiers don't kill soldiers.
Artillery kills soldiers.
Bombs kill soldiers.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Basically Russia like Tactical battle groups

W E L L, sort of.
Also Chinese and American.
They have all gone the same way.

 

[Love Charger]

The LAST thing we should do is throw soldiers at them.
The FIRST thing we should do is to kill as many of them as possible.

Soldiers don't kill soldiers.
Artillery kills soldiers.
Bombs kill soldiers.

We lack artillery sir , we lack it.
The massive babudom of india won't let it pass.and top brass of army is also complacent here .

 

[Love Charger]

W E L L, sort of.
Also Chinese and American.
They have all gone the same way.

Cds rawat death was a blow to integrated command , but sir if we do reorganize men like Russians, then they will be formidable .
We dont have conscription you see

 

[Angel of War]

We lack artillery sir , we lack it.
The massive babudom of india won't let it pass.and top brass of army is also complacent here .

We don't lack in artillery rather We lack in 155mm artillery

 

[Angel of War]

Cds rawat death was a blow to integrated command , but sir if we do reorganize men like Russians, then they will be formidable .
We dont have conscription you see

During war gaming we divide all the logistics , signals , engineer and medical assets of the division among it's infantry brigades thus forming a integrated combined arms brigade . This has been wargamed many times . Recently it was done in exercise dakshin shakti by xii corps

 

[Joe Shearer]

We lack artillery sir , we lack it.
The massive babudom of india won't let it pass.and top brass of army is also complacent here .

We can't fight the Chinese with the large masses and meagre equipment that we have at present. We can fight a defensive war, when we should be planning an offensive one.

 

[Angel of War]

We can't fight the Chinese with the large masses and meagre equipment that we have at present. We can fight a defensive war, when we should be planning an offensive one.

sir that's why we have kept 1 strike for ladakh and XVII strike for Arunachal isn't it ?

 

[fire starter]

 

[Joe Shearer]

sir that's why we have kept 1 strike for ladakh and XVII strike for Arunachal isn't it ?

Is that enough? And what is the general war objective?

 

[Angel of War]

Is that enough? And what is the general war objective?

A counter offensive into tibet in case of a chinese attack is the objective I guess . Two strike corps are not less tho. Western theatre command too has only two group armies the 76th and 77th for offense as well as defense

 

[Joe Shearer]

A counter offensive into tibet in case of a chinese attack is the objective I guess . Two strike corps are not less tho. Western theatre command too has only two group armies the 76th and 77th for offense as well as defense

They can bring in other troops at lightning speed. The figures I remember from more than a decade ago, after their logistics exercises, was a battalion in one day, a brigade in 3 days, two brigades in a week, and so on. This was practised at various points of their borders, for universality of application.
What we have, what they won't, is acclimatised troops.