India-China 2020 Border Dispute - Military and Strategic Discussion

[DownWithCCP]

Lmao literally the same statement from last WMCC meet lol ctrl C + ctrl V

 

[Sarjen]

Rafale was ordered through a G2G contract, any additional order for more Rafales would also be by that route. It would be what we would do if we went American, just like all the other contracts with the Americans have been.

Rafale was ordered because of the capability it gave to IAF, It was the IAF who pushed for minimum 36 to keep IAF's operational capability in delivering nukes in Eastern Seaboard. Had the Jet not trialed by IAF as a part of MMRCA there wouldn't be any G2G deal for Rafale.

and As per the rumors go IAF is now pushing for additional Rafales, given the history of how India places orders for Jets.. by the end of this year or after budget more Rafale orders would be there hopefully.

A couple of reasons. A 36 aircraft order was given to bypass the original order which GoI considered prohibitively expensive. To keep the French placated, this number was ordered with a supposed offer by the French government to help in a few areas and an offer of veto on demand in the UNSC. Dassault got 18 more aircraft than what they were supposed to get to manufacture in France and the Dassault boss made it clear that for him the 36 order was better than manufacturing 3 times more in India. That was supposed to be the end of that, a compromise of sorts. To give them an additional 36 would be an complete waste for us and an windfall for the French. We would have zero justification for the original deal if we go though and would be seen as a complete blunder with us getting no benefit out of such a large order. Ya, a loser’s contract it would be.

Again No.... It was the IAF who pushed for Rafale + Gov might have utilized it for Political purposes. and i don't buy that too... because we always have US and Russians for VETO.

I'm quoting additional 36 but we won't know... maybe 1 more sqd or 106 to be build in India under license.

The French don’t have the volumes like the Americans and that alone makes their products costly. Add to it, the French are notorious for squeezing us, anyone who saw the M2k upgrade and believed otherwise is seriously gullible. The French were given 36 as an compromise, as I have already said.

American have Volume because that's their Requirements and export orders... It doesn't make Sense for Dassault to construct more Manufacturing plants for no reason. Do you think American weapons are not costly ??? can you go and check the price tag of Apache for once. 6 Apache costs $950 Million ... check the tags of other planes too.

The Americans haven’t connected military purchases to trade surplus in so many words but it’s an underlying issue and will need resolving. I would rather it be military equipment than in the agricultural arena. One way or the other, it will have to be done.

The emergency purchases are a disaster and an outcome of gross stupidity. We are getting fleeced left and right and that is happening when the economy has been hit hard by covid. Emergency purchases are an example of our mistakes, holding that up to suggest we indulge in more foolishness is not wise.

The Americans are not stupid enough to give India missiles to put on French aircraft, it’s why the M2k has none. The French have even refused to give their missiles for the Tejas because it has an Israeli radar, they don’t give anything for our Russian platforms either.

The Pakistani F16 which are mostly older and without AESA used their missiles against the Sukhois at very long ranges. That’s not saying much about the performance of American missiles though they managed to keep a more powerful platform at bay with an older aircraft.

aren't we using Russian R-73 in Mirage inspite of concerns from french... and what makes you think once MRCA is gone US won't sell us missiles ?? they want to make money and they need to support india in whatever way they can against China, so ya US missile are coming.. didn't we get Amraam recently even after we signed up for S400 ??

Doesn't matter PAF f-16 had PESA or AESA. US missiles didn't work as everyone expected it to be. if its one missile you can say its ok.. but multiple missiles were out maneuvered

We don’t need to care what reasons the French have for slow delivery, it’s their problem. No need to make it ours.

I don't know how to comment on this

 

[Indrajit]

261 not 350...
272 were ordered, 11 have since crashed.
Upgrading 261 aircraft in massive task both in effort and money, almost as big as making 100 brand new airframes. It will take more than a decade to upgrade even majority of them( speaking from witnessing M2K and jaguar upgrades)

I stand corrected on the numbers and yes, an upgrade is a big deal but it’s essential if we are going to see them do frontline duty unless we decide to get a 100 nos of another type that will do the job and let the Sukhois play second fiddle. Any upgrade can and will happen in batches and we should atleast upgrade a decent number.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Mongol nationalists in Nepal have burned the flag of Nepal

 

[Indrajit]

Rafale was ordered because of the capability it gave to IAF, It was the IAF who pushed for minimum 36 to keep IAF's operational capability in delivering nukes in Eastern Seaboard. Had the Jet not trialed by IAF as a part of MMRCA there wouldn't be any G2G deal for Rafale.

and As per the rumors go IAF is now pushing for additional Rafales, given the history of how India places orders for Jets.. by the end of this year or after budget more Rafale orders would be there hopefully.



Again No.... It was the IAF who pushed for Rafale + Gov might have utilized it for Political purposes. and i don't buy that too... because we always have US and Russians for VETO.

I'm quoting additional 36 but we won't know... maybe 1 more sqd or 106 to be build in India under license.



American have Volume because that's their Requirements and export orders... It doesn't make Sense for Dassault to construct more Manufacturing plants for no reason. Do you think American weapons are not costly ??? can you go and check the price tag of Apache for once. 6 Apache costs $950 Million ... check the tags of other planes too.




aren't we using Russian R-73 in Mirage inspite of concerns from french... and what makes you think once MRCA is gone US won't sell us missiles ?? they want to make money and they need to support india in whatever way they can against China, so ya US missile are coming.. didn't we get Amraam recently even after we signed up for S400 ??

Doesn't matter PAF f-16 had PESA or AESA. US missiles didn't work as everyone expected it to be. if its one missile you can say its ok.. but multiple missiles were out maneuvered



I don't know how to comment on this

I think we have run the course on this. There doesn’t seem a middle ground here and i think it’s best we agree to disagree.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Mongolian nationalists in Nepal have burned Nepali flag India should come in open support of mongols they’re pro India people our gurkha regiment is also mongol

Video showing burning of Nepal flag uploaded on YouTube

KATHMANDU: A music video spreading anti-nationalistic sentiment and provoking violence and unrest in the society has gone viral in YouTube drawing the attention of the people and demanding the ban and action against the ‘artists’. The song entitled ‘Deshdrohi’ uploaded through ‘Mangol Hope...

english.khabarhub.com

 

[Bhurki]

I stand corrected on the numbers and yes, an upgrade is a big deal but it’s essential if we are going to see them do frontline duty unless we decide to get a 100 nos of another type that will do the job and let the Sukhois play second fiddle. Any upgrade can and will happen in batches and we should atleast upgrade a decent number.

The last time i had heard a number put on it was $40 million for upgrading a single aircraft.

India To Upgrade Sukhoi Fleet With Russia's Help

The Indian Air Force wants to upgrade the entire fleet of 272 Su-30MKI to the near fifth-generation level to increase its combat worthiness, an Air Force official said.

www.defensenews.com

This says $8B for 194 ( every aircraft excluding first 2 batches)

Considering you could buy a new Su-30 for $70m ( last batch price from HAL), i just don't see someone signing on this.

 

[Sarjen]

I think we have run the course on this. There doesn’t seem a middle ground here and i think it’s best we agree to disagree.

Thanks for your time.

Well let's wait till the pandamic is over or a year, we'll know.

 

[Bhurki]

An Indian facility that makes Su-30MKI jets may shut down, toppling 400 local suppliers

It's the classic domino effect: An Indian facility that manufactures Sukhoi Su-30MKI fighters may close in March 2020, leading to the closure of 400 local suppliers over a lack of component orders.

www.defensenews.com

HAL had proposed a plan for 72 Su-30Mki last year for $5B on a line that was already operational..
Doesn't seem such a bad idea now, does it..

 

[Blue Water Navy]

To our members of DFI living in US. I would like to ask a question.. Where to are the winds blowing now?? To Trump bhau or Biden the snake??

@utubekhiladi @LETHALFORCE

 

[LETHALFORCE]

To our members of DFI living in US. I would like to ask a question.. Where to are the winds blowing now?? To Trump bhau or Biden the snake??

@utubekhiladi @LETHALFORCE

Biden is leading in polls but Hillary also led and lost. Biden wants to raise taxes so
many who are working during these bad times may have to question if they want to
be punished for working ?? When many can stay home collect unemployment and make more.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

China news | India news: India-Japan-Australia supply chain in the works to counter China

The initiative, first proposed by Japan, is now taking shape, ET has learnt. Dates are being worked out to hold the first meeting of the commerce and trade ministers of the 3 countries by next week.

economictimes.indiatimes.com

India-Japan-Australia supply chain in the works to counter China

 

[utubekhiladi]

To our members of DFI living in US. I would like to ask a question.. Where to are the winds blowing now?? To Trump bhau or Biden the snake??

@utubekhiladi @LETHALFORCE

Biden is leading in polls but Hillary also led and lost. Biden wants to raise taxes so
many who are working during these bad times may have to question if they want to
be punished for working ?? When many can stay home collect unemployment and make more.

Trump shall win again. Whites and INDIANS will definitely vote for trump but blacks, Latins, Chinese, Muslims will vote for Biden.

whites consists of 73% of US LEGAL population. trump hasn't done a single thing that will harm the interest of whites.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Trump shall win again. Whites and INDIANS will definitely vote for trump but blacks, Latins, Chinese, Muslims will vote for Biden.

whites consists of 73% of US LEGAL population. trump hasn't done a single thing that will harm the interest of whites.

This is beyond racial lines that democrats have turned the election into. There is also
a security issue and big money in wall street and and the bible belt is backing trump.
Many Indians in USA have traditionally voted democrats; but many (like me) are republicans
and always have been.

 

[Blue Water Navy]

@LETHALFORCE @utubekhiladi Just saw the video in support of Biden.

Clinton endorsing Biden in a time like this.

Clinton was the guy who created the mess with China in the first place.

 

[utubekhiladi]

This is beyond racial lines that democrats have turned the election into. There is also
a security issue and big money in wall street and and the bible belt is backing trump.
Many Indians in USA have traditionally voted democrats but many (like me) are republicans
and always have been.

china has opened their treasury and gave free hand to its missions and embassy with its lobby group to do whatever is necessary to make sure trump losses election.

but from whites perspectives, trump is an angel sent from heaven..
because

- for the first time in 5 years, no new taxes or taxes were raised.
- stopped floods of migrants form latins and asian countries like india and china
- bring back job and industries back to USA
- stopped ILLEGAL floods of migration from mexico (its obvious if you are from tx)
- stopped benefits thats being paid to ILLEGAL migrants
- kick out foreign workers and create more job openings for US Citizens.
- stand up to Islamic terrorism
- show blacks their right place
- 2 trillion dollar stimulus has to be counted somewhere

 

[LETHALFORCE]

@LETHALFORCE @utubekhiladi Just saw the video in support of Biden.

Clinton endorsing Biden in a time like this.

Clinton was the guy who created the mess with China in the first place.

His foundation received so much money from China after he gave them MFN trading status.
He literally sold the country to China. Under Clinton one factory a day was closing in USA and
moving to China.

 

[utubekhiladi]

Seven active Chinese military air bases under close watch of Indian agencies

The Chinese PLAAF has upgraded a number of these bases in recent times including the construction of hardened shelters, the extension of runway lengths and deployment of additional manpower to carry out more operations, they said.

“We are keeping a close watch on the Hotan, Gar Gunsa, Kashghar, Hopping, Dkonka Dzong, Linzhi and Pangat airbases of the PLAAF in the Xinjiang and Tibet region and all of them have been highly active in the recent times,” government sources told ANI.

Seven active Chinese military air bases under close watch of Indian agencies

The Chinese PLAAF has upgraded a number of these bases in recent times including the construction of hardened shelters, the extension of runway lengths and deployment of additional manpower to carry out more operations, they said.

www.hindustantimes.com

 

[Indrajit]

Many Indians in USA have traditionally voted democrats; but many (like me) are republicans
and always have been.

Most Indians live in very blue states like California and Washington. Their votes are completely irrelevant in a Presidential election. Only those living in swing states matter and this is why there is so much effort being put in by the Biden campaign including an almost never happened before type of address on Indian Independence Day. If India is spared the extreme viciousness by any democratic dispensation, it is these people that we need to thank. The large majority of Indian Americans living in The democratic states are either indifferent or simply don’t care about Indian interests, exceptions excluded. It’s why we get the Pramila Jayapal and Ro Khanna types.

Trump has already started wooing the Indian American electorate in the swing states and we can expect more as the election draws close.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

Most Indians live in very blue states like California and Washington. Their votes are completely irrelevant in a Presidential election. Only those living in swing states matter and this is why there is so much effort being put in by the Biden campaign including an almost never happened before type of address on Indian Independence Day. If India is spared the extreme viciousness by any democratic dispensation, it is these people that we need to thank. The large majority of Indian Americans living in The democratic states are either indifferent or simply don’t care about Indian interests, exceptions excluded. It’s why we get the Pramila Jayapal and Ro Khanna types.

Trump has already started wooing the Indian American electorate in the swing states and we can expect more as the election draws close.

Biden has already commented on Kashmir and democrats have strong support of islamic and
radical groups . Indians need to be very careful not to fall for any Biden lies. I have never seen
strong support for India as I have seen with Trump and do not feel it would continue under
and democrats.