India-China 2020 Border conflict

[Dessert Storm]

most probably the biggest benefit of whole India China Conflict till now

Somebody..... Modi..... Yogi..... Fab pls.

 

[garg_bharat]

Primary objective of QUAD is to provide free and open navigation in Indo Pacific region. Untill now QUAD is not for involvement of everyone in war, but for mutual cooperation through other means, which can be understood through separate logistics sharing pacts.

In future QUAD will incorporate various other countries but for that QUAD needs to show it's importance.

IAF chief states we are self sufficient in protecting ourself which gives us a leverage in negotiating our terms in QUAD. By satellite nation, I meant that despite having big defence budget in NATO and casualties in Afghanistan many NATO countries does not have any say in peace process.

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

 

[Dessert Storm]

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

Ok. So what do u suggest. Shall we ask them to send an authenticated copy of the Minutes of the Meeting to the Chinese.
Comprehension is a precondition to confusion. Otherwise it just called inability to comprehend. If somebody is confused, his agreement/disagreement dosen't really hold water.
If US, Japan, Australia are self-sufficient, why don't they just go with the tri-lateral. India ain't self-sufficient so's the case with others. Just a matter of degree.

 

[Dessert Storm]

Quad Cake @ Japanese FM's B'Day

 

[BlackViking]

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

Well these comments can be deception for either the global liberal community or the 0.5 front at home or both, as the QUAD is bound to draw criticism from them.

 

[garg_bharat]

Ok. So what do u suggest. Shall we ask them to send an authenticated copy of the Minutes of the Meeting to the Chinese.
Comprehension is a precondition to confusion. Otherwise it just called inability to comprehend. If somebody is confused, his agreement/disagreement dosen't really hold water.
If US, Japan, Australia are self-sufficient, why don't they just go with the tri-lateral. India ain't self-sufficient so's the case with others. Just a matter of degree.

Boss our highest officers are showing confusion which is not good.

Better is to keep quiet. Sometimes you need help from parties/people you least expect and one should keep doors open.

Fighting two-front war is not romantic; it will take every ounce of strength this country has.

And I bet it will need a LOT of external help.

Keep doors open. That is a better strategy.

 

[Rudy123]

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

We are not confused but frustrated people. We understand everything in plain and simple. How can USA providing sensitive information linked to QUAD? Was Israel a member of any pact or group when they provided satellite imagery during kargil.

QUAD was an old concept, but does other members take it seriously. Australia refused to provide us Uranium untill 2014. These pacts serves mutual desires more, rather than making adversary in form of China. Yes QUAD is in early stage and more clarity will come in future. In wartime no help comes free even if they are bound by pacts.

Without QUAD we had turned tables in Maldives Myanmar and Sri Lanka. These pacts should include our concerns and interests.

 

[12arya]

My opinion is it is wrong for IAF chief to discount an alliance with USA. Better option is to keep quiet.

The Chinese are ganging up with India's neighbours and we are pretending as we need nobody.

I think India should contract next 36 Rafale immediately and accelerate all local fighter programs.

i feel the chief is being realistic; he didn't said anything abt not needing allies or weapons either.
what he said was that we will have to do all the physical fighting. besides, we r not canada; we r a nuclear power! we r much ahead of many of our allies in military strength and actual combat experience.

wat we need is guts from politicians and timely delivery of weapons to forces. our civil admins need to clean up their acts and drdo is doing very well as of now.

till date no body fought for us; we r not britain or europe to have americans fight for us.
its foolish to blindly trust westerners, they r opportunists of the highest order. we need to develop ourselves. buy gud weapons; and possibly produce some too. most of our "allies" will deliver weapons and will probably sanction china and its "allies" diplomatically, or to an extent economically! if we aim to become a supr power then we need to act like one!

at the end of the day, we have to bleed and fight out there. we have always done that. so chief is correct in saying so. besides, do we need foreign troops in india? i don't think our troops will take that very kindly either wen time & again they have shown their mettle!

And i see this as a test by fire to emerge out of this anew and no im not war mongering but we have to fight for what is right.

for us its a matter of our existence; for west they if we r finished they can always choose china.

 

[garg_bharat]

We are not confused but frustrated people. We understand everything in plain and simple. How can USA providing sensitive information linked to QUAD? Was Israel a member of any pact or group when they provided satellite imagery during kargil.

QUAD was an old concept, but does other members take it seriously. Australia refused to provide us Uranium untill 2014. These pacts serves mutual desires more, rather than making adversary in form of China. Yes QUAD is in early stage and more clarity will come in future. In wartime no help comes free even if they are bound by pacts.

Without QUAD we had turned tables in Maldives Myanmar and Sri Lanka. These pacts should include our concerns and interests.

International diplomacy is give and take. If you think you will get help for nothing, then you daydream.

However one has to work for a bigger objective. What is in the interest of the country? Do you want another slavery?

You have to choose your friends and enemies carefully.

I think India should consider QUAD as a God-gift at this point in time and NOT a liability.

 

[Dessert Storm]

Boss our highest officers are showing confusion which is not good.

Better is to keep quiet. Sometimes you need help from parties/people you least expect and one should keep doors open.

Fighting two-front war is not romantic; it will take every ounce of strength this country has.

And I bet it will need a LOT of external help.

Keep doors open. That is a better strategy.

That confusion is your assessment.
Modi's quiet. Even that seems to be a problem for some.
The door is open, that's why we are talking about the quad. But when we talk quad, then you try to pull down the country by saying 'country not self-sufficient'.
War is never romantic buy it is necessary.
Nobody is fully sufficient and the best way out of a tight one is to help each other. Everybody has to keep the door open. Everybody's interest is at stake not just India. So just talk holistically.

 

[nick_indian]

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

Quite clearly, our government, senior officers and all are afraid of China at some level. Sounds unpleasant but seems true.

There is no need to enter into an open alliance against China but no need to explicitly discount it either. Keep them Chinks guessing.

 

[Rudy123]

International diplomacy is give and take. If you think you will get help for nothing, then you daydream.

However one has to work for a bigger objective. What is in the interest of the country? Do you want another slavery?

You have to choose your friends and enemies carefully.

I think India should consider QUAD as a God-gift at this point in time and NOT a liability.

Last comment shows even after 73 years of independence, our slavery mindset still exist. We still need some rouhani taqat to liberate us from misery.

How can we stand in group of superpowers if we still look at someone else to solve our problems. Some may not agree and will say we are still not self sufficient, I think at least IAF and IA chiefs does not agree with you. If we follow geopolitical issues closely then we can observe that we had done wonders too.

 

[garg_bharat]

Last comment shows even after 73 years of independence, our slavery mindset still exist. We still need some rouhani taqat to liberate us from misery.

How can we stand in group of superpowers if we still look at someone else to solve our problems. Some may not agree and will say we are still not self sufficient, I think at least IAF and IA chiefs does not agree with you. If we follow geopolitical issues closely then we can observe that we had done wonders too.

You need to read up on second world war and how USSR fought. You need to learn about how USA helped USSR though lend and lease.

When faced with a much bigger enemy, external help is necessary.

Shri Ram took help of Kishkindha (Vanar army) to fight Lanka; he did not go alone.

With all due respect, both MEA and IAF Chief are wrong.

Better to keep quiet rather than damage the country by your talk.

 

[Shashank Nayak]

I disagree. First MEA and then IAF chief is making statements that degrade QUAD even before it comes into effect.

Saying QUAD is limited to the sea is illogical. There are reports that the USA is providing intelligence on Chinese movements in Tibet as well as the capabilities of Chinese equipment being deployed. If true, then QUAD is already more than cooperation at sea.

Our problem is that we are confused people. Our highest officers are as confused as the public. Since India is not a race; there is nobody thinking in terms of protecting people. Protecting the border is a fudgy idea. Borders have always been variable throughout history.

Everybody knows India is NOT self-sufficient. If it is, then stop all imports.

IAF chief was right.. He was setting the right expectations in a public that faces a possible war against China, in the near future, and was responding to a question whether the US B-2s in Diego Garcia are to deter China in Ladakh. It is better to squash unrealistic expectations before they take hold.
The fact remains that in a India China border war, given that we are not an alliance partner of the US, there is no way that those B-2s will do anything more than decorate the tarmac in Deigo Garcia.

 

[tarunraju]

IAF chief was right.. He was setting the right expectations in a public that faces a possible war against China, in the near future, and was responding to a question whether the US B-2s in Diego Garcia are to deter China in Ladakh. It is better to squash unrealistic expectations before they take hold.
The fact remains that in a India China border war, given that we are not an alliance partner of the US, there is no way that those B-2s will do anything more than decorate the tarmac in Deigo Garcia.

The US Navy P8 landing in Port Blair was a signal to chicoms. The American strategic message to China was "see, we casually landed a warplane in India without any bilateral exercise being in progress, and there's no domestic political shitstorm in Delhi over it. Next we'll land a B-2 in Leh."

I predict a B-2 landing in Hindon, Ambala, or Leh in the next 6 months.

 

[Shashank Nayak]

The US Navy P8 landing in Port Blair was a signal to chicoms. Basically the American strategic message to China was "see, we landed a plane in India, and there's no political shit-storm in Delhi over it. Next we'll land a B-2 in Leh."

I predict a B-2 landing in Hindon, Ambala, or Leh in the next 6 months.

Landing a plane in peacetime is not the same as those planes participating in a hot war, and shedding blood on India's behalf.
Nonetheless the port blair landing is a good signal to the chinese on the direction of the Indo-US military relationship..

 

[tarunraju]

Landing a plane in peacetime is not the same as those planes participating in a hot war, and shedding blood on India's behalf.
Nonetheless the port blair landing is a good signal to the chinese on the direction of the Indo-US military relationship..

No, landing a warplane without there being any occasion (eg: a formal bilateral military exercise), is unusual. The P8 landing was possibly the first "casual" landing of a US military asset on Indian soil since 1947. It was the first major use of LEMOA for an air asset.

So far the chicom/paki calculation has been "LEMOA is a bluff, India will never allow US warplanes on its soil, the Indian political opposition would burn the ruling party at the stake for it."

That calculation has been busted.

 

[HawkisRight]

The US Navy P8 landing in Port Blair was a signal to chicoms. The American strategic message to China was "see, we casually landed a warplane in India without any bilateral exercise in progress, and there's no domestic political shitstorm in Delhi over it. Next we'll land a B-2 in Leh."

I predict a B-2 landing in Hindon, Ambala, or Leh in the next 6 months.

But why? What's wid b2 fapping? Americans landed p8a under logistics pact..IAF chief made it very clear nobody will fight our war..

 

[HawkisRight]

You need to read up on second world war and how USSR fought. You need to learn about how USA helped USSR though lend and lease.

When faced with a much bigger enemy, external help is necessary.

Shri Ram took help of Kishkindha (Vanar army) to fight Lanka; he did not go alone.

With all due respect, both MEA and IAF Chief are wrong.

Better to keep quiet rather than damage the country by your talk.

Are bhai Jaishankar ATTENDED quad meet..what else should leadership do to make quad official

 

[tarunraju]

But why? What's wid b2 fapping? Americans landed p8a under logistics pact..IAF chief made it very clear nobody will fight our war..

B-2 won't be fighting our war, either. But if we spot an H-6K on Skardu as a chicom scare-tactic, you can bet that B-2 will land in Leh, even if just for a drink.

The Ladakh drama so far has been a collection of skirmishes, but maneuvers and posturing make up 99% of it.