India-China 2020 Border conflict

[Cheran]

 

[tarunraju]

A country that threatens a nuclear first strike without demonstrating the appetite for serious bloodshed will not be taken seriously. We need a good death toll on the chinese side.. and some good pics and videos of enemy dead.. before we make a threat of a nuclear first strike, which will make our threat carry that much more weight..

We demonstrated our appetite for serious bloodshed in Galwan.

And it will be a formal nuclear threat, with a duly signed letter from the PM handed to Amb_PRC_DEL. I am not suggesting that we bluff. I'm suggesting that we make a threat and carry it out.

 

[Cactus09]

It does. Imagine Modi in his UNGA speech says "The PLA has 24 hours to withdraw from Ladakh, or India initiates a quantitative nuclear first strike against all PLA positions inside India's perceived terriotory."

You think they'll move their S-400 to F4? Are those S-400s enough for a volley of 50 Brahmos carrying a nuclear payload? Yes there will be uproar, yes Beijing will warn us of second strike. But guess what will happen. PLA will fuck off first.

Nuke sabre rattling won't be necessary. Giving them an ultimatum will be enough I suppose. Besides S-400 won't do shit in mountains with the several blindspots.

 

[garg_bharat]

It does. Imagine Modi in his UNGA speech says "The PLA has 24 hours to withdraw from Ladakh, or India initiates a quantitative nuclear first strike against all PLA positions inside India's perceived terriotory."

You think they'll move their S-400 to F4? Are those S-400s enough for a volley of 50 Brahmos carrying a nuclear payload? Yes there will be uproar, and yes Beijing will warn us of second strike. But guess what will happen. PLA will fuck off first.

Stay out of Dalal Street if you don't have the guts to go broke.

I doubt India will use nukes over Ladakh.
However China's behavior is hard to predict. China can take any irrational action.

 

[tarunraju]

I doubt India will use nukes over Ladakh.
However China's behavior is hard to predict. China can take any irrational action.

Let them, and we escalate accordingly. We're not hitting civilian targets. We're hitting PLA forward positions. If their second strike hits a civilian target, we escalate accordingly.

Allow shit to get real, because the defeat handed to us without nukes (or even without a fight), will be equally real.

 

[Shashank Nayak]

We demonstrated our appetite for serious bloodshed in Galwan.

And it will be a formal nuclear threat, with a duly signed letter from the PM handed to Amb_PRC_DEL. I am not suggesting that we bluff. I'm suggesting that we make a threat and carry it out.

Galwan deaths are small change... Wont make us look threatening..

 

[johnq]

The lady is correct. There is a very strong Russian lobby in India which is supplemented by the Chinese lobby and their objective is to prevent an Indian alliance with the West. But are there any grounds for justifying what this lobby is trying to do i.e. is it legitimate?

Has India been more consistent in it's friendship and loyalty to Russia or China? And has Russia reciprocated India's loyalty and friendship?. Nehru was besotted with Communism since his first visit in 1927 and even modeled India's economic policy on the Soviet model of 5 year plans. India started buying Soviet arms with the purchase and subsequently licence production of the Mig 21. Even the first deliveries of the Mig 21 in 1962 were delayed by the Soviet Union because of the just concluded India-China war i.e. the Soviet Union did not want to hurt it's relationship with China and hence delayed deliveries to India. Fast forward to 1969 and the Soviet-Chinese clashes at the Ussuri river and the subsequent China-US relationship which started in 1971. Soviet Chinese relations improved but their was really no arms relationship until the Soviet Union dissolved in 1991. During all of this time from 1971 through to 1991 India was a loyal arms buyer and aligned itself with the USSR on most political issues. Post 1991, Russia under Yeltsin turned it's back on India as it strove to be a European country and there was chaos within the country. China jumped back in as a customer and the Russians welcomed that. Since 1991, Russia has started providing China with the same quality of weapons that it supplies India in every respect, for the Air Force, Navy as well as all of the technology needed for the first Chinese human spaceflight. And with the recent flare up between India and China, the Russians have stated that they will not take sides. So what has India's consistently loyal friendship first with the Soviet Union and then with Russia dating all the way back to 1962 resulted in? It is Russian neutrality in the most serious military confrontation that India faces. But the Chinese who had a border clash in 1969 and then back stabbed the Russians in 1971 and were then estranged for 20 years are now treated by the Russians on the same footing as India. So if the Russians are not willing to take India's side in this most serious confrontation that India is facing, what good is that relationship and why does the Defense Minister and Foreign Minister keep on running to Russia.

China, Pakistan and US have been trying to create a rift between India and Russia for ages. But they don't realize how deep the relationship goes. It's why Russia has sold more high technology items to India. The stuff Russia sells to China is definitely more downgraded. Russia definitely trusts China a lot less than India. Especially after Covid-19 attack by China, I see India becoming friendlier with both US and Russia. I wouldn't be surprised if India started getting weapons from both US and Russia without any objections by either. And I also see US and Russia becoming friendlier, especially if Trump gets re-elected. I think both US and Russia realize that, despite their differences, neither is as crazy as China (attacking the world with a pandemic).

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Let them, and we escalate accordingly. We're not hitting civilian targets. We're hitting PLA forward positions. If their second strike hits a civilian target, we escalate accordingly.

Allow shit to get real, because the defeat handed to us without nukes (or even without a fight), will be equally real.

Still dreaming of winning without a fight
We are just playing into chinese hands with this.. We need to go full on Clauswitz ..

 

[tarunraju]

Still dreaming of winning without a fight
We are just playing into chinese hands with this.. We need to go full on Clauswitz ..

We are already handing them a victory without a fight for as long as we dip biscuits in tea, and as long as the PLA is at F4.

 

[geoatpenn]

lets take a break for a minute and remember the deadliest duo of our great nation. lets remember that this Jodi alone is solely responsible for all the problem that we are facing in INDIA today.



View attachment 60194

that duo was in part also responsible for you sitting here in a free country and blaming them.. sad that it has come to this.. the father of the nation being ridiculed.. we will never progress if we are going to forget our past

 

[etantra]

So an huge intel failure also.... .

intel failure? how?

 

[maximus777]

I doubt India will use nukes over Ladakh.
However China's behavior is hard to predict. China can take any irrational action.

Why do we have to be the tekhedaar of rationality? Let's be war mongering for a change. If PLA hadn't intruded in April 2020, everything would be hunky dory even with previous transgressions. What has being a pussy whipped "responsible" state got us so far? Incinerate their Depsang deployments and see how they run with their tails between the legs. Their rocket force and arty cant do jackshit in the mountains and our mountain corps will run circles around them.

 

[bajiraopeshwa]

We are already handing them a victory without a fight for as long as we dip biscuits in tea, and as long as the PLA is at F4.

I feel the escalation should be gradual. Start with sniping their positions at F4. After they have a few casualties, they might reassess their position.

If we have the advantage in heights, they cannot respond back easily. After that, they may escalate somewhere else. We escalate somewhere else etc. In other words, instead of boiling the ocean at the word go, boil some kettles of water here and there to begin with

 

[Roshan]

that duo was in part also responsible for you sitting here in a free country and blaming them.. sad that it has come to this.. the father of the nation being ridiculed.. we will never progress if we are going to forget our past

more like we are doomed to repeat the past if we do not recognise it and assess it dispassionately. it's a wonder gandhi is not declared as kalki avatar for all the undue veneration that has been heaped on him to head off any meaningful discussion on his or chachas actual role in our freedom struggle.

 

[Cactus09]

Guys I am having a tough time understanding the issue of the "bottleneck" and the Y junction in Depsang. Can anyone explain?

 

[Knowitall]

We demonstrated our appetite for serious bloodshed in Galwan.

And it will be a formal nuclear threat, with a duly signed letter from the PM handed to Amb_PRC_DEL. I am not suggesting that we bluff. I'm suggesting that we make a threat and carry it out.

Galwan?

What happened at galwan was not something we planned to do but rather forced into.

Our troops went to fight hand to hand combat with them when they should have all taken a rifle each and shot every chinese in the head.

Our troops went there to save col and his troops we didn't plan this neither did we prepare for it. We were thrown into a situation where we forced to react.

Galwan actually shows the opposite we have no appetite for bloodshed.

We shouldn't have given two fucks to the Chinese after galwan and should have blown every single post in our line of sight for good measure.

Rather we went in to de-escalate.

Where is our revenge for galwan?? Our troops were forced to fight with bare hands that is not revenge we were forced into it. Yes we killed more of their troops but this was a reaction anger of our troops.

This was not a well planned executed mission to avenge them.

Who sits for talks the next day when your troops have been killed by such treachery.

No nuke threat is coming the govt is not willing to fight.

 

[Bhadra]

Check out this jackass! Says Kashmiris prefer to be under Chinese rule than be part of India!! He seems to like what the commies are doing with the muslims in Xinjiang! Does he want to become a member of the CPC politburo or have the Chinese bought him over with $$$ to spew this anti India shite?

What do you guys suggest we should do with this Chinese bootlicker?

The Bastard thinks he is Raja of Kashmir which is in alliance with India, And now he is free to opt for the Chinese rule.
This in an open invitation in Jaychand styles. The snake in the Arm,,,,

tu hai harjai to apna bhi yahi taur sahi
tu nahi aur sahi, aur nahi aur sahi

The real Kashmiri prostitute ..

 

[etantra]

I am a proponent of a reasonable war with the PLA to shake us out of our slumber. There are a lot of issues within the indian strategic planning and military. The top ones are:
1. Corruption: SP Tyagi, IAF is a classic case. IAF has been a hotbed of corruption with very few Air Marshals not corrupt. This has to end. Loss of face like on Feb 27th and in an air war with PLA will do that.
2. Becoming more efficient like the ASEAN nations. For far too long, we have moved at the Indian or African pace - doing things chaotically, without strategy, taking things lightly on every front from health to population control to use of natural resources to education to family planning to economy. We need to have a disciplined democracy.
3. Mandatory military exposure in colleges for all young people, ala IDF style. Builds discipline, war fighting reserves, infuses patriotism.
4. Make the military modern and hi-tech. With Pakistan you can fight a low-tech war but with PLA, our forces will be forced to fight a hi-tech and network centric warfare, which will also force our industry to go hi-tech like the Japanese had to.
5. With much more disciplined people and a loss of face, civilians may finally wake up to how corruption poses severe national security issues.
6. Decriminalized politics - gets good people to get into politics and take democracy seriously to save the sovereignty of the nation.

I say we need to have a limited war with the PLA. Chances are we would lose face and lives due to the extreme inefficiencies we have in all spheres of life today. But that is a good thing for us - to finally stop doing stupid things and become a real power to reckon with. Trial by fire, so to speak.

I don't think there was any loss of face( except IAF/IA for some reason didn't release sat pics).

PAF response was expected and the aim was to absorb it and let the matter finish. If aim was to keep matter going, IAF would have responded differently.

India's key aim of demonstrating fredom/ability to bomb deep inside Pak was established. The greatly reduced supply of terrorists has also shown that many were eliminated at Balakot

 

[Shashank Nayak]

We are already handing them a victory without a fight for as long as we dip biscuits in tea, and as long as the PLA is at F4.

Thats why we need to fight and kill those PLA soldiers at F4. Launch an assault in Pangong and Depsang to clear out the PLA, if they dont agree to withdraw.. Impose a nasty death toll on the PLA like the vietnamese did, that shakes up their entire recruitment system of the PLA, makes them cast doubts on the structure and mechanisation of the PLA, and hits the morale of those chinks wanting to join the PLA.

 

[Knowitall]

You don't negotiate territory. Negotiating on such an important matter is a sign of weakness itself.

And this is what the Chinese have been exploiting for so many years.

We need to hit them hard and hit them fast.