India-China 2020 Border conflict

[MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00]

What do you guys think about this article? Do you guys think our military and civilian satellite network is already compromised or it’s safe like the Government says?

China attacked Indian satellite communications: US Report - Times of India

"Computer network attack against Indian satellite communications in 2017” is one among a slew of counter-space activities carried out by China since 2007, listed in a new report by US-based China Aerospace Studies Institute (CASI). Isro, while conceding that cyber-attacks are a constant threat...

m.timesofindia.com

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

I am a proponent of a reasonable war with the PLA to shake us out of our slumber. There are a lot of issues within the indian strategic planning and military. The top ones are:
1. Corruption: SP Tyagi, IAF is a classic case. IAF has been a hotbed of corruption with very few Air Marshals not corrupt. This has to end. Loss of face like on Feb 27th and in an air war with PLA will do that.
2. Becoming more efficient like the ASEAN nations. For far too long, we have moved at the Indian or African pace - doing things chaotically, without strategy, taking things lightly on every front from health to population control to use of natural resources to education to family planning to economy. We need to have a disciplined democracy.
3. Mandatory military exposure in colleges for all young people, ala IDF style. Builds discipline, war fighting reserves, infuses patriotism.
4. Make the military modern and hi-tech. With Pakistan you can fight a low-tech war but with PLA, our forces will be forced to fight a hi-tech and network centric warfare, which will also force our industry to go hi-tech like the Japanese had to.
5. With much more disciplined people and a loss of face, civilians may finally wake up to how corruption poses severe national security issues.
6. Decriminalized politics - gets good people to get into politics and take democracy seriously to save the sovereignty of the nation.

I say we need to have a limited war with the PLA. Chances are we would lose face and lives due to the extreme inefficiencies we have in all spheres of life today. But that is a good thing for us - to finally stop doing stupid things and become a real power to reckon with. Trial by fire, so to speak.

 

[vampyrbladez]

What do you guys think about this article? Do you guys think our military and civilian satellite network is already compromised or it’s safe like the Government says?

China attacked Indian satellite communications: US Report - Times of India

"Computer network attack against Indian satellite communications in 2017” is one among a slew of counter-space activities carried out by China since 2007, listed in a new report by US-based China Aerospace Studies Institute (CASI). Isro, while conceding that cyber-attacks are a constant threat...

m.timesofindia.com

Unlikely although it explains the 2019 ASAT test by India.

 

[vampyrbladez]

I am a proponent of a reasonable war with the PLA to shake us out of our slumber. There are a lot of issues within the indian strategic planning and military. The top ones are:
1. Corruption: SP Tyagi, IAF is a classic case. IAF has been a hotbed of corruption with very few Air Marshals not corrupt. This has to end. Loss of face like on Feb 27th and in an air war with PLA will do that.
2. Becoming more efficient like the ASEAN nations. For far too long, we have moved at the Indian or African pace - doing things chaotically, without strategy, taking things lightly on every front from health to population control to use of natural resources to education to family planning to economy. We need to have a disciplined democracy.
3. Mandatory military exposure in colleges for all young people, ala IDF style. Builds discipline, war fighting reserves, infuses patriotism.
4. Make the military modern and hi-tech. With Pakistan you can fight a low-tech war but with PLA, our forces will be forced to fight a hi-tech and network centric warfare, which will also force our industry to go hi-tech like the Japanese had to.
5. With much more disciplined people and a loss of face, civilians may finally wake up to how corruption poses severe national security issues.
6. Decriminalized politics - gets good people to get into politics and take democracy seriously to save the sovereignty of the nation.

I say we need to have a limited war with the PLA. Chances are we would lose face and lives due to the extreme inefficiencies we have in all spheres of life today. But that is a good thing for us - to finally stop doing stupid things and become a real power to reckon with. Trial by fire, so to speak.

You exposed yourself by pushing Paki talking points here. What loss of face on 27 February, 2019?

We downed an F 16 and lost a Mig 21 BiS.

https://theprint.in/defence/8-piece...nandan-shot-down-a-pakistani-f-16/278752/?amp

 

[Flying Dagger]

I saw an interview few months back in news when this crisis began, where person who appeared to be mid-level army officer was saying "We didn't expect that China will do something like this in middle of pandemic...". Man we seriously produce some naive gullible people... 1000 years of brutal occupation and our psyche has suffered generational Stockholm syndrome which refuses to go away...army officer was saying it, what did we even learn from kargil, doklam etc...? Nada.... Zilch...

So it'snot just intelligence failure.. its our civilisational failure.... more to come for many generations..... ghumao charkhaa...

Those are generic statement made to realise people how demonic Chinks are...

First they unleashed Biological warfare by using Chinese Virus throughout the world and later using it to target already weakened countries. Rest I think we knew they'll do it.

The current Indian civilization have lots of weaklings else the Bharatiya Hindu civilization teaches to prepare for war and build up while Shri Krishna and Yudhishthir does their diplomatic maneuvering.

 

[Flying Dagger]

You exposed yourself by pushing Paki talking points here. What loss of face on 27 February, 2019?

We downed an F 16 and lost a Mig 21 BiS.

https://theprint.in/defence/8-piece...nandan-shot-down-a-pakistani-f-16/278752/?amp

Bison lost due to turbulence after missile was fired by Abhi and he had to eject. While F-16 was shot down in a 2 F-16 vs one Mig 21 wvr battle. We indeed made a mark.

But that aside we had several system failure whether spyder taking mi 17 down or disruption of our communication with Abhi .

Also flying Mig 21 in 2020s isn't a feat modern airforce would have been proud of.

We should have replaced Mig 21 from srinagar base long back and atleast put Mig 29 there.

 

[Mikesingh]

Check out this jackass! Says Kashmiris prefer to be under Chinese rule than be part of India!! He seems to like what the commies are doing with the muslims in Xinjiang! Does he want to become a member of the CPC politburo or have the Chinese bought him over with $$$ to spew this anti India shite?

What do you guys suggest we should do with this Chinese bootlicker?

 

[LDev]

@36.50 holy grail of the great Russian-Chinese alliance conspiracy theory. This women is smart. Delight to here her.

What if Russia and China have partnered up to block tech alliance of US-India, and that we are caught up in the rabbit hole of keeping both nations happy, while covertly China is getting benefited. Russia could sell China gas at subsidized rate as per agreement, granted if they throw India into a cold war state, and as usual we go begging for arms from Russia.

In layman, while China virus H-bomb has impacted nations economically so that China can use this opportunity to increase more trade surplus, it's not about money here but it's about speed of gaining stability, this is a calculated move, which allows China to surpass US economy by 2035, this completing the vision 2035.

Like many folks pointed out, especially @Bhadra there's a far sinister role being played out here.

The lady is correct. There is a very strong Russian lobby in India which is supplemented by the Chinese lobby and their objective is to prevent an Indian alliance with the West. But are there any grounds for justifying what this lobby is trying to do i.e. is it legitimate?

Has India been more consistent in it's friendship and loyalty to Russia or China? And has Russia reciprocated India's loyalty and friendship?. Nehru was besotted with Communism since his first visit in 1927 and even modeled India's economic policy on the Soviet model of 5 year plans. India started buying Soviet arms with the purchase and subsequently licence production of the Mig 21. Even the first deliveries of the Mig 21 in 1962 were delayed by the Soviet Union because of the just concluded India-China war i.e. the Soviet Union did not want to hurt it's relationship with China and hence delayed deliveries to India. Fast forward to 1969 and the Soviet-Chinese clashes at the Ussuri river and the subsequent China-US relationship which started in 1971. Soviet Chinese relations improved but their was really no arms relationship until the Soviet Union dissolved in 1991. During all of this time from 1971 through to 1991 India was a loyal arms buyer and aligned itself with the USSR on most political issues. Post 1991, Russia under Yeltsin turned it's back on India as it strove to be a European country and there was chaos within the country. China jumped back in as a customer and the Russians welcomed that. Since 1991, Russia has started providing China with the same quality of weapons that it supplies India in every respect, for the Air Force, Navy as well as all of the technology needed for the first Chinese human spaceflight. And with the recent flare up between India and China, the Russians have stated that they will not take sides. So what has India's consistently loyal friendship first with the Soviet Union and then with Russia dating all the way back to 1962 resulted in? It is Russian neutrality in the most serious military confrontation that India faces. But the Chinese who had a border clash in 1969 and then back stabbed the Russians in 1971 and were then estranged for 20 years are now treated by the Russians on the same footing as India. So if the Russians are not willing to take India's side in this most serious confrontation that India is facing, what good is that relationship and why does the Defense Minister and Foreign Minister keep on running to Russia.

 

[Tuco]

Check out this jackass! Says Kashmiris prefer to be under Chinese rule than be part of India!! He seems to like what the commies are doing with the muslims in Xinjiang! Does he want to become a member of the CPC politburo or have the Chinese bought him over with $$$ to spew this anti India shite?

What do you guys suggest we should do with this Chinese bootlicker?

We could give them the "Chinese experience" if that's what they really want. We have Uyighur template.

 

[fire starter]

Check out this jackass! Says Kashmiris prefer to be under Chinese rule than be part of India!! He seems to like what the commies are doing with the muslims in Xinjiang! Does he want to become a member of the CPC politburo or have the Chinese bought him over with $$$ to spew this anti India shite?

What do you guys suggest we should do with this Chinese bootlicker?

we are willing to donate all kashmiris to China.

 

[Cheran]

lets take a break for a minute and remember the deadliest duo of our great nation. lets remember that this Jodi alone is solely responsible for all the problem that we are facing in INDIA today.



View attachment 60194

Chucha, Panikkar & Menon - China will always thank them.

 

[fire starter]

meanwhile in Nepal.

 

[Cheran]

Massive fir at ongc surat after 3 blasts. hmmm

 

[tarunraju]

I am a proponent of a reasonable war with the PLA to shake us out of our slumber. There are a lot of issues within the indian strategic planning and military. The top ones are:
1. Corruption: SP Tyagi, IAF is a classic case. IAF has been a hotbed of corruption with very few Air Marshals not corrupt. This has to end. Loss of face like on Feb 27th and in an air war with PLA will do that.
2. Becoming more efficient like the ASEAN nations. For far too long, we have moved at the Indian or African pace - doing things chaotically, without strategy, taking things lightly on every front from health to population control to use of natural resources to education to family planning to economy. We need to have a disciplined democracy.
3. Mandatory military exposure in colleges for all young people, ala IDF style. Builds discipline, war fighting reserves, infuses patriotism.
4. Make the military modern and hi-tech. With Pakistan you can fight a low-tech war but with PLA, our forces will be forced to fight a hi-tech and network centric warfare, which will also force our industry to go hi-tech like the Japanese had to.
5. With much more disciplined people and a loss of face, civilians may finally wake up to how corruption poses severe national security issues.
6. Decriminalized politics - gets good people to get into politics and take democracy seriously to save the sovereignty of the nation.

I say we need to have a limited war with the PLA. Chances are we would lose face and lives due to the extreme inefficiencies we have in all spheres of life today. But that is a good thing for us - to finally stop doing stupid things and become a real power to reckon with. Trial by fire, so to speak.

Nah, a defeat didn't shake things up after 1962, and it won't shake things up now. We will be too scared to face the Chinese for the next 50 years, and China will dictate our strategy (or lack thereof). The Indian mentality for the past 1000 years has been to become subservient to the conqueror/vanquisher, not to fight back or avenge. We are more likely to become China's bitch following a defeat, than to take the defeat to our stride and improve ourselves. We'll become more corrupt, not less.

It's important that we ward off the current Chinese threat, even if at great cost. A costly victory/stalemate over China is what will motivate/embolden us to improve ourselves, not a cheap defeat.

In other words, it's worth nuking Beijing for F5 Pangong Tso.

 

[garg_bharat]

Nah, a defeat didn't shake things up after 1962, and it won't shake things up now. We will be too scared to face the Chinese for the next 50 years, and China will dictate our strategy (or lack thereof). The Indian mentality for the past 1000 years has been to become subservient to the conqueror/vanquisher, not to fight back or avenge. We are more likely to become China's bitch following a defeat, than to take the defeat to our stride and improve ourselves. We'll become more corrupt, not less.

It's important that we ward off the current Chinese threat, even if at great cost. A costly victory over China is what will motivate/embolden us to improve ourselves, not a cheap defeat.

In other words, it's worth nuking Beijing for F5 Pangong Tso.

This time India will fight.

 

[Sanglamorre]

Massive fir at ongc surat after 3 blasts. hmmm

View attachment 60205

Now this smells like war is imminent. Attacking oil production systems hmm.

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Looks like there is zero appetite in either New Delhi or Beijing for war with a proper death toll on either side. And please, lets use nukes only after we do some blood shedding and killing.. Both India and China are doing neither now.. except Chai biscoot yaarana once a week.. This Paki attitude of "Mere paas atom bum hain.. Mere se zabardasti kiya toh phod doonga" doesn't do us any favours.. What we need is some spine to engage in serious slaughter..

 

[Bhadra]

I saw an interview few months back in news when this crisis began, where person who appeared to be mid-level army officer was saying "We didn't expect that China will do something like this in middle of pandemic...". Man we seriously produce some naive gullible people... 1000 years of brutal occupation and our psyche has suffered generational Stockholm syndrome which refuses to go away...army officer was saying it, what did we even learn from kargil, doklam etc...? Nada.... Zilch...

So it'snot just intelligence failure.. its our civilisational failure.... more to come for many generations..... ghumao charkhaa...

This is the kind of effect the fourth and fifth-generation Warfare aims to create - Demolish the nations will to fight
* Under Second and third generation warfare this act of demolion was carried out by destruction of enemy forces, cities, resources, industry and by capturing territories,

* Now it is demolition of the faith of people in their Country, their civilization, their government, their leadership and their armed Forces.

* By projecting the enemy capabilities and convince the other side of the unwinability. Example of that has been the way Chinese Mechanised strength, Light tanks, heelicopters, rocket artillery , Chinese humveees, J-20 have been projected time and again including in this four. See the numerous GT videos fake or real.

* Create internal opposition, Confusion, and turmoil amongst target country ranks, Make Pappu ask one question a day. Ask Wire and Print to publish articles of Panag, Shukla, Kulakarni and sundries and convey all misinformation through Hindu, HT, Caravan, and all media platforms.
* Demoralise the target population , make them act irrationally, confuse divide and finally diminish their will to fight .... make them surrender..

 

[tarunraju]

Looks like there is zero appetite in either New Delhi or Beijing for war with a proper death toll on either side. And please, lets use nukes only after we do some blood shedding and killing.. Both India and China are doing neither now.. except Chai biscoot yaarana once a week.. This Paki attitude of "Mere paas atom bum hain.. Mere se zabardasti kiya toh phod doonga" doesn't do us any favours.. What we need is some spine to engage in serious slaughter..

It does. Imagine Modi in his UNGA speech says "The PLA has 24 hours to withdraw from Ladakh, or India initiates a quantitative nuclear first strike against all PLA positions inside India's perceived LAC."

You think they'll move their S-400 to F4? Are those S-400s enough for a volley of 50 Brahmos carrying a nuclear payload? Yes there will be uproar, and yes Beijing will warn us of second strike. But guess what will happen. PLA will fuck off first.

Stay out of Dalal Street if you don't have the guts to go broke.

 

[Shashank Nayak]

It does. Imagine Modi in his UNGA speech says "The PLA has 24 hours to withdraw from Ladakh, or India initiates a quantitative nuclear first strike against all PLA positions inside India's perceived terriotory."

You think they'll move their S-400 to F4? Are those S-400s enough for a volley of 50 Brahmos carrying a nuclear payload? Yes there will be uproar, yes Beijing will warn us of second strike. But guess what will happen. PLA will fuck off first.

A country that threatens a nuclear first strike without demonstrating the appetite for serious bloodshed will not be taken seriously. We need a good death toll on the chinese side.. and some good pics and videos of enemy dead made public.. before we make a threat of a nuclear first strike, which will make our threat carry that much more weight..