Civil war in Ukraine

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Akim

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Russia is not attacking NATO. NATO is attacking Russia.
And raise your ass hard and see how many for the last time Russia had violated the airspace of countries - members of NATO? Bulgaria, Romania, Lithuania, UK, Spain, Portugal. Not NATO members: Sweden, Ukraine, Japan. And it is only in the last month.
 
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Ray

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Hungry and Cash-Strapped Donetsk Residents Queue for Food Parcels

DONETSK: Outside the iconic football stadium in Donetsk in eastern Ukraine, Yulia holds her four-year-old son Maxim by the hand as they wait for the food parcels to arrive.

"I've never come to get humanitarian aid before. I was living off my stored supplies, but I don't have anything left," says Yulia, 30, who lost her job when her company closed down at the start of the conflict between pro-Russian rebels and Ukrainian troops.

In a sign of the acute desperation for food in this rebel-held region, people began queuing for the aid around 5 am -- even though the distribution was not due until four hours later.

Around 600 people are gathered outside the ticket booths of the Donbass Arena, home stadium of Shakhtar Donetsk, winner of numerous Ukrainian championships.

These days, the stadium is closed and has suffered some shelling damage. Instead of tickets, the booths now issue receipts that grant the holder a parcel of humanitarian aid.

The parcels are organised by local oligarch Rinat Akhmetov, who owns the stadium and the football team, and controlled much of the region's economy before the conflict began in April. He hesitated before ultimately deciding to back the Kiev government.

In the crowd, several women lament that they do not qualify for the food aid.

"We come from Makiivka (a town adjoining Donetsk). Our mayor refuses Akhmetov's aid because he says he is our enemy," says Tatyana, a 35-year-old mother of three, with tears in her eyes.

"He doesn't care that my children have nothing to eat. And when I got here, they told me the aid is only for families from Donetsk."

A young couple pushing a baby in a stroller open their package.

"Nappies for the baby, pots of pureed baby food, fruit juice, some porridge oats... This can last us a month!" says the baby's father Viktor, 28, joyfully, adding that the supplies they stocked up at the start of hostilities quickly ran out.

- 1,400 people per day -

"Our foundation is the only one working full-time in Donetsk and in other towns," says Mykola Ivashchenko, a 44-year-old coordinator of Akhmetov's foundation. He is glad the rebel authorities in the city agreed to work with them.

In another part of the city, outside the large building of the state circus, Akmetov's foundation is giving out aid to pensioners, the disabled, and those who have lost their homes in the shelling.

"We give out food aid to around 1,400 people per day. We started on August 29 and more than a thousand volunteers are taking part in this operation at the moment," says 28-year-old Maria, helping to give out the parcels.

No one seems to have heard of any humanitarian aid coming from Russia or elsewhere.

"As usual, with the corruption we have here, it all gets stolen," says an elderly woman in the queue.

That is despite claims from the rebel authorities in Donetsk that those who steal or resell humanitarian aid will be killed.

"We will shoot those monsters who are growing fat on the misfortune of others," the prime minister of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic, Alexander Zakharchenko, announced recently.

In the meantime, people like Svitlana, 50, depends on the food parcels from the rebels' enemies, given out twice a month. Hers contains tins of fish, a can of condensed milk, some vegetable oil, sugar, tea and cereals.

"It's lucky that we get this aid," she says. "Thanks to this, we haven't died of hunger, since we haven't been paid our salaries or pensions for four months."
Hungry and CashStrapped Donetsk Residents Queue for Food Parcels
This is an Agence France-Presse report.

It is all fine for Nations to fight and jockey for power, but it is the common people who are the ones who suffer.

It is time for warring factions to quit and allow people to move on and live their lives beyond the politics of the world.

And it takes one Akmetov to do what the authorities should ensure.

Sad.
 

Ray

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And raise your ass hard and see how many for the last time Russia had violated the airspace of countries - members of NATO? Bulgaria, Romania, Lithuania, UK, Spain, Portugal. Not NATO members: Sweden, Ukraine, Japan. And it is only in the last month.
Your contention is too generalised and not correct from the geostrategic standpoint.

And it would not be a fair statement that the US and NATO countries do not violate airspace of other countries.

All countries do snoop on the adversary through various means. That is a way to ensure that one continues to have situational awareness.

However, who attacked whom is a moot point.
 

Akim

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Your contention is too generalised and not correct from the geostrategic standpoint.

And it would not be a fair statement that the US and NATO countries do not violate airspace of other countries.

All countries do snoop on the adversary through various means. That is a way to ensure that one continues to have situational awareness.

However, who attacked whom is a moot point.
Example please?
 

Ray

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Example please?
You really want examples?

Fine.

U2, Hainan, over Cuba, over USSR, over China, over India, over Pakistan and the list is endless.

Just Google.

US spies over its own allies.

Never heard that, did you?

When you meet Angela Merkel, just ask Merkel, she will educate you.

It is all a part of the geostrategic game and safeguarding national interest.

Morally wrong, but geostrategically right.

I speak from a miltary standpoint, beyond what is happening in Ukraine.
 
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bhramos

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Ukrainian woman went to volunteer for her boyfriend in the regiment "Azov".

 

Akim

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You really want examples?

Fine.


U2, Hainan, over Cuba, over USSR, over China, over India, over Pakistan and the list is endless[/I].
Just Google.

US spies over its own allies.

Never heard that, did you?

When you meet Angela Merkel, just ask Merkel, she will educate you.

It is all a part of the geostrategic game and safeguarding national interest.

Morally wrong, but geostrategically right.

I speak from a miltary standpoint, beyond what is happening in Ukraine.

When was this? And don't compare cyber-espionage violation of the territories. You don't understand the difference?
 

sgarg

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When was this? And don't compare cyber-espionage violation of the territories. You don't understand the difference?
You are remarkably uninformed and dumb. I need to say that we want a better Ukrainian compared to you.

No point talking to a person who cannot add two and two.
 

Ray

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When was this? And don't compare cyber-espionage violation of the territories. You don't understand the difference?
This does show that you understand very little.

Cyber intelligence?

I am indicating airspace violation.

Check Google.

Don't expect me to do your homework.

I understand a whole lot that you all don't understand and I am tired of appending links to educate folks in a void of knowledge and awareness.
 

Akim

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You are remarkably uninformed and dumb. I need to say that we want a better Ukrainian compared to you.

No point talking to a person who cannot add two and two.
I have you asked? Stick your tongue in deep, dark place and do not bother when I with a smart man to communicate.

Banned air of "Echo of Moscow"
Запрещенный эфир «Эха Москвы» – Кашин Text
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQNiLaI3xYQ
Photo
https://www.facebook.com/sergei.loiko?fref=ts
 
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Ray

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@Akim,

For a starter let's give one example on airspace violation over a friendly country, let alone an enemy' adversary country.

US aircraft 'violates' Swedish airspace
Published: 31 Jul 2014 14:57 GMT+02:00
Updated: 31 Jul 2014 14:57 GMT+02:00

A mystery airplane that passed over Swedish airspace recently has been revealed as an American aircraft, sources revealed on Thursday.

The flight passed over Gotland, an island off the east coast of Sweden, on July 18th in the late afternoon.

A classified document from the Swedish Defence Force, which was leaked on Wednesday, revealed that the mystery flight passed over Swedish airspace from the east.

The plane, a Boeing RC-135, was denied permission to pass over Swedish airspace, but the pilots chose to disregard the refusal.
US aircraft 'violates' Swedish airspace - The Local
Now, this is from a Swedish newspaper.
 
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jouni

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The US is a Naval Power. Russia is a Land Power. Each has its own pros and cons. The article I mentioned (originally posted by @Cadian) gives a very good analysis, and how Russia played it much better despite being dealt a poor hand.

On a slightly different note, comment boards are replete with comments about how a US rocket blew up and immediately after that, Russia offered its services. Of course those are conspiracy theories, but no worse than what comes out of BBC, NYT, and their ilk. (I was expecting someone to blame the BUK-M1 missile on the failure of the US rocket.)
Yes, I have heard that "landpower" thinking before. Unfortunately that is 100 years too late in Strategic thinking. I can understand it though, when Truman congratulated Stalin of capturing Berlin, he replied: "yes, but Alexander the first got to Paris".

Maybe today's comparison would be Kim something of North Korea congratulating Putin for destroying East Ukraine and Putin answering "Yes, but Stalin and co Destroyed whole eastern Europe"
 
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jouni

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This does show that you understand very little.

Cyber intelligence?

I am indicating airspace violation.

Check Google.

Don't expect me to do your homework.

I understand a whole lot that you all don't understand and I am tired of appending links to educate folks in a void of knowledge and awareness.
Finnish defense minister travels to Moscow because of air space violations.

Spede show - Violation of Finland's airspace - YouTube
 
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