Astra BVRAAM

[IndianHawk]

Bdw western bvrs and wvr s are morr killing
Than ..... Russian fighter s

Older Russian plane that too in mostly poor countries with obsolete missile.

Su30 has not engaged . Our incident is only actual engagement where it jammed multiple aim120.

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[patriots]

Older Russian plane that too in mostly poor countries with obsolete missile.

Su30 has not engaged . Our incident is only actual engagement where it jammed multiple aim120.

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Ya su30 not engaged....but mig29 was downed by amraam....
Hope astra will give iaf upper hand

 

[porky_kicker]

Ya.......then..why only 100 ordered by iaf

Again why it is said it .will be in prototype Stage.....
What will be different in production variant
@porky_kicker
@NeXoft007
@IndianHawk

Developing a missile is half the hurdle
Productionising the same is the other half.

One can develop a system in lab and the same in a dedicated production facility , but one cannot expect the same level of performance or quality always unless the production facilities are certified and vetted for in terms of QC etc.

Therefore test / initial batch / LSP samples are ordered to qualify the operational potency of the mass produced systems interms of the cleared lab prototypes. And to identify QC issues and rectify the same in the production facilities so that the expected standards are maintained.

Why do you think OFB products are crap ?

But BEL etc products are relatively better, why ?

because QC in industrial processes associated with production facilities are ensured / have been ensured.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

If

Then sfdr based astra will have 150 km range...........

Is not it........

SFDR will have 340 km range.......

 

[Chinmoy]

My question is....whts the difference between the prototype variant and series production variant

Again my next question.....how the missile get mature.

Although @IndianHawk and @porky_kicker already explained it in technical term, there is one more aspect of prototype order and production version. ECONOMICS.
By ordering 100 prototypes, IAF is now funding the program instead of DRDO.

 

[Longewala]

Thanks..a matured reply..............
Bdw the r77 we use does not a have a single kill till now

Yes, a mature reply but more than what you deserve with the juvenile tone of your questions and your comment on the r77

How many kills do F-22, Mig-31 or Eurofighter have, and how many f-16s were shot down by mig-21s until this year?

 

[AmoghaVarsha]

All reports indicate it's better than aim 120c5.
Which means paki are outranged by Astra mk1 itself.

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Astra isnt better than 120C5.

Else after Feb19, IAF would not be trialling the R77-1

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[IndianHawk]

Astra isnt better than 120C5.

Else after Feb19, IAF would not be trialling the R77-1

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Read the report again. Astra needs more time. And for operational use missile is not enough a doctrine has to evolve. It takes time.

Also r77-1 is simple improvement over r77 so probably a direct fit to su30 with minimum change to tactics and doctrine.

These are very complicated matters. Aim120 c5 is a decade old .r77 is even older. R77-1 is bit recent and Astra is latest among all of them .


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[BON PLAN]

Yes, a mature reply but more than what you deserve with the juvenile tone of your questions and your comment on the r77

How many kills do F-22, Mig-31 or Eurofighter have, and how many f-16s were shot down by mig-21s until this year?

One Turkish F16 was killed in air combat by a Greek Mirage 2000.
It's the sole F16 beaten in air to air engagement before that time.

 

[Anathema]

Astra isnt better than 120C5.

Huh ? You will be advised to go through harsh vardhan thakurs tweets and replies. An ex jaguar pilot, he is now working for HAL and testing all ac/s and munitions. With regards to why its not deployed ? IAF wants to ensure production standards are met, so the 50 missiles are to test the same

 

[scatterStorm]

For any effective use of Missile, air-forces around the world have to rely on converged values of data presented by the OEMs in there simulated test with the actual operational param's recorded by the weapons computer. Than a POK is calculated around it. Of course it's made better if an aircraft is engaged with another aircraft or in war game where dummy targets are used. Dummy targets can be a bit of pickle, as they don't move faster or pull negative G's however an area of kill envelope is charted out.

One theory is that IAF is doing is, it's going to weaponize our top of the line aircraft with both missiles, testing it in a hot zone like near Leh and regions of J&K. They may want to get as much of data as they can. A few R77-1 orders is to test additional params until Astra is made potent and later inducted.

Another theory is, R77-1 is just a recent diplomatic maneuver as well, with the PAF going active near Skardu, Ladakh this would mean there attack formations have to face a newer missile system much better than what its legacy took down there top of the line jet. This could make them keep there distance while engaging our jets.

 

[Tridev123]

I feel Drdo needs to have in its inventory supersonic target drones in order to more accurately simulate actual air combat for flight testing Astra Bvr and also Sam missiles. There is Astramk2, Sfdr, Xrsam, Akash mk2 etc coming up which will need to be extensively tested. The task of developing a supersonic target drone is not easy as only 2 countries USA and China have it. Anybody have info on other countries developing supersonic target drones?. For India developing such capability will also help in our Aura unmanned aerial vehicle(UCAV).Question mark is can India do it in finite time period. Most hi-tech programmes suffer from cost and time overruns. Import is ruled out as both USA and China will not sell it.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

I feel Drdo needs to have in its inventory supersonic target drones in order to more accurately simulate actual air combat for flight testing Astra Bvr and also Sam missiles. There is Astramk2, Sfdr, Xrsam, Akash mk2 etc coming up which will need to be extensively tested. The task of developing a supersonic target drone is not easy as only 2 countries USA and China have it. Anybody have info on other countries developing supersonic target drones?. For India developing such capability will also help in our Aura unmanned aerial vehicle(UCAV).Question mark is can India do it in finite time period. Most hi-tech programmes suffer from cost and time overruns. Import is ruled out as both USA and China will not sell it.

We already have two subsonic target drones (Lakshya & Abhyas) that won't be bad testbeds. Nor making them supersonic will be so challenging.

 

[Tridev123]

We already have two subsonic target drones (Lakshya & Abhyas) that won't be bad testbeds. Nor making them supersonic will be so challenging.

I would like to differ. If it was so easy why only 2 countries have them. Scaling up a subsonic drone aircraft to a supersonic one requires a lot of work on control laws, software etc. We need a maneuverable supersonic drone. The technology is tightly controlled by the west. Even the Predator and Sea Guardian armed drones took billions of dollars to develop.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

If it was so easy why only 2 countries have them.

Because it depends upon requirement of those nations too.

Even India is getting 3rd & 4th positions in world of achieving new strategic strides mostly these days.

Scaling up a subsonic drone aircraft to a supersonic one requires a lot of work on control laws, software etc. We need a maneuverable supersonic drone. The technology is tightly controlled by the west. Even the Predator and Sea Guardian armed drones took billions of dollars to develop.

Both geometric & software modifications will be needed. But don't make haua of it without any logic but a rhetoric "why only two have".
Got it?

 

[Tridev123]

Because it depends upon requirement of those nations too.

Even India is getting 3rd & 4th positions in world of achieving new strategic strides mostly these days.

Both geometric & software modifications will be needed. But don't make haua of it without any logic but a rhetoric "why only two have".
Got it?

OK, if you are so confident that it is easily achievable then can you quote any responsible authority from institutions like ADA, HAL, NAL those who will actually carry out the work saying India has developed or can easily develop a supersonic drone. Let me give you an example - EMALS for aircraft carrier launch. Only the US has a working system though the Chinese are also trying to develop the technology. State of the art and complex technologies are developed only by a few countries initially. Even if others wish to develop it, one cannot succeed immediately. You will admit India lags behind the west in technolog. Even China is ahead of us in certain areas. It was not rhetoric but to underline how few countries were able to develop the technology.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

OK, if you are so confident that it is easily achievable then can you quote any responsible authority from institutions like ADA, HAL, NAL those who will actually carry out the work saying India has developed or can easily develop a supersonic drone.

I didn't say it's very easy. But too easy to be called difficult. If India chooses develop one, it will get one in a span of less than 5-6 years.
Rest of your post entirely is irrelevant. So stop spinning it around & give any real reason to support your statement instead of "only two countries". If you have it.

India is experienced with subsonic target drones, subsonic & supersonic cruise missiles & hypersonic glide vehicle. The design will be modified to maintain maneuvers while ramjets & scramjets for high velocities.

The thing "West is ahead" or "China is ahead" has nothing to do here, not in this certain field.

 

[Tridev123]

I would like to add that supersonic target drones would be bought by many nations if easily available and exported by the US or China. They help to improve the performance of air to air and surface to air missiles. Most if not all modern fighter aircraft are capable of supersonic flight. The missiles have to bring down such aircraft.

 

[Tridev123]

If you don't want to listen to logic, what can I do. India sent an spacecraft to Mars planet. National headlines said India is among only 3 countries to succeed. WAS IT ALSO RHETORIC?.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

If you don't want to listen to logic, what can I do.

Which logic you have given? Only rhetorics and irrelevant diversions:

Let me give you an example - EMALS for aircraft carrier launch. Only the US has a working system though the Chinese are also trying to develop the technology. State of the art and complex technologies are developed only by a few countries initially. Even if others wish to develop it, one cannot succeed immediately. You will admit India lags behind the west in technolog. Even China is ahead of us in certain areas. It was not rhetoric but to underline how few countries were able to develop the technology.

I would like to add that supersonic target drones would be bought by many nations if easily available and exported by the US or China. They help to improve the performance of air to air and surface to air missiles. Most if not all modern fighter aircraft are capable of supersonic flight. The missiles have to bring down such aircraft.

India sent an spacecraft to Mars planet. National headlines said India is among only 3 countries to succeed. WAS IT ALSO RHETORIC?.

And now, quote all of your posts where you have given any single "technical explanation" to support what you said. Don't run away divulging the topic.