AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (HAL)

[neo29]

In August 2008, right about the time the Indian Air Force had decided to officially kickstart procedures to get the Medium Combat Aircraft (MCA) off the realm of theory, then Chief of Air Staff Fali Major happened to bump into DRDO chief M Natarajan and then HAL chairman Ashok Baweja at an industry suppliers function in Bangalore. The Chief was mildly irritated that both Baweja and Natarajan had provided media sound-bytes and interviews suggesting that the MCA would have "fifth generation technologies". He impressed upon both gentlemen, over tea, that if the MCA went the LCA way, it would be not just unacceptable to the air force, but an act of criminal disregard for the country's security. "Give the air force a bloody first-rate fourth generation aeroplane. That is the job before you," he said.

Two months later, in October 2008, the name of the MCA programme was changed (on recommendation to the Secretary, Defence Production) to "Next Generation Fighter Aircraft", though MCA continues to be used alternatively without any particular distinction.

As per official documentation by the IAF, it wants the MCA to be a twin-pilot configured multirole stealth aircraft capable of "close air support, all weather interception, air defence suppression, long-range strike, electronic attack, limited command & control and reconnaisance" -- that's the profile from an official IAF wishlist to the ADA last year. That might roll right off the air force's tongue, like off a brochure, but they're deadly serious. Putting all speculation to rest when it officially began dialogue about the MCA in 2008, the IAF said it was not willing to look at a strike aircraft with other capabilities. It wants a fully multirole (preferably, swingrole) aircraft for the job.

As we speak, a joint committee of several bodies involved with the NGFA is finetuning the configuration of the final jet, before work begins on building a tech demonstrator, three prototype vehicles and two production series trial jets -- the wind tunnel model unveiled at Yelahanka in February 2009 is largely what the aircraft will look like, though there are three other variants that have not been displayed yet. A twin-engine delta planfrom version, which was a direct derivative from the LCA, has since been shelved -- low observable requirements demanded a fully new airframe approach, which finally ended in the design that people got to see at Aero India 2009. While the wind-tunnel model, fabricated by a Bangalore-based engineering firm, is the product of an ADA/HAL study, there will be dramatic changes yet to the aircraft's intakes (utterly radar friendly, according to the IAF), vertical stabilisers and dorsal section, say sources.

Air Chief Marshal PV Naik, in his first interaction with the ADA last year, seemed to nitpick on indigenous radar capability, more than anything else when it came to the topic of the MCA. Sources say he was deeply incensed when given a brief on the Multi-mode Radar (MMR), pioneered by the Electronics Research & Development Establishment (LRDE) for the LCA Tejas programme. In a chat with the director of the ADA, he said the next aircraft that the agency designed and built, needed to be centred around an Indian active array combat radar. In fact, the LRDE has already proposed a second radar (deriving from the MMR) for the MCA, with technological spin-offs currently being gleaned from its partnership with Israel's Elta. But Naik didn't buy that. He said it didn't matter what the DRDO was learning from who at this stage. When it came down to putting the nails in, he said he wanted a fully Indian radar on the MCA.

While configuration fructifies, the following work has begun on the MCA in full earnest: DARE, Bangalore has appointed a special team to begin identifying avionics and cockpit packages for the first prototype vehicle, and will supply this in published form to the ADA by July 2010. This will include cockpit electronics, cockpit configuration, man-machine interface, mission console systems and computers/software with a focus on data fusion and modular architecture. The LRDE will, in about the same time frame, provide a separate project proposal for an all new radar, to be re-designated for the MCA, as a derivative of the MMR currently being completed with technology from Israel's ELTA. LRDE will independently look in the market for a partner for active array technology, though it communicated to ADA in June 2009 that it had sufficient R&D available to build a reliable AESA prototype with assistance from Bharat Electronics Ltd and two private firms based in Hyderabad.

There is a collossal amount of work going on as far as materials is concerned for the MCA/NGFA. With the IAF unmoving in its demand for an aircraft that has stealth characteristics built into it from the drawing board forward, the DRDO has powered teams within its materials laboratories in Pune and Hyderabad to come up with new composities, low observable materials fabrication techniques, and of course, radar-absorbent control surface aggregates, airframe materials and paints. This is, of course, completely separate from design characteristics, including internal weapons, fresh leading edge innovations and a sustainable stealth maintenance footprint.

The most crucial part of the programme is of course the engine. The Kaveri-Snecma turbofan is being counted upon vigorously to be ready to power prototypes of the MCA by the middle of this decade. There is no Plan-B just yet as far as engines go. However, technologies such as single crystal and nickel-based superalloys in turbofans are still some way off as far as Indian development is concerned -- the IAF wants the use of both to be a given in the engines that power the MCA.

According to the ADA, the government will look to purchase upto 250 MCAs when its done and ready -- not just as a replacement to the MiG-27s and Jaguars, but to complement the MMRCA fleet that will hopefully be half-inducted by then.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: India's Medium Combat Aircraft

India has made it clear that they will be inducting 250 FGFA . Is this the same 250 ?? or 250 MCA apart from the 250 FGFA ????
thats like 500 5th gen fighters by 2020. if its true you just made my day .

 

[Agantrope]

India has made it clear that they will be inducting 250 FGFA . Is this the same 250 ?? or 250 MCA apart from the 250 FGFA ????
thats like 500 5th gen fighters by 2020. if its true you just made my day .

By 2020 we wont even make 100+ Tejas :Laie_46:. Thinking of 500 FGFA in 2020 is similpy absurd numbers. If that is true then USA sucks :dfi-1:

Number of orders is 250 will be as of 2020. Number might get increased if the performance is good, this is stated by IAF personnel. (searching the source )

By 2020 we will be having 25-30 PAK-FA, 15-20 FGFA, 50-60 MMRCA.

I have a strong faith in HAL that they will not roll out this bird by 2025 >

If the MCA is a derivative of LCA then we can expect the EF2000/Rafael in the airforce as the MMRCA

 

[neo29]

By 2020 we wont even make 100+ Tejas :Laie_46:. Thinking of 500 FGFA in 2020 is similpy absurd numbers. If that is true then USA sucks :dfi-1:

Number of orders is 250 will be as of 2020. Number might get increased if the performance is good, this is stated by IAF personnel. (searching the source )

By 2020 we will be having 25-30 PAK-FA, 15-20 FGFA, 50-60 MMRCA.

I have a strong faith in HAL that they will not roll out this bird by 2025 >

If the MCA is a derivative of LCA then we can expect the EF2000/Rafael in the airforce as the MMRCA

probably the date of 2020 is wrong. but it is achievable if HAL boosts its production capability. they already invested money for it. so we can say something like 2022. but is it wise to buy PAK FA when we will surely buy the FGFA. probably FGFA will more suit our needs since its tailored for it

its likely that we will be using kaveri engine for MCA with schema helping us. actually that seems to be a good idea since the schema which powers the rafale which has a almost stealth like feature.

but for sure something is cooking in the MCA. like IAC and ATV the project has been officially started but nothing in news about its development. seems this project is again a secret just like the above two.

 

[Agantrope]

probably the date of 2020 is wrong. but it is achievable if HAL boosts its production capability. they already invested money for it. so we can say something like 2022. but is it wise to buy PAK FA when we will surely buy the FGFA. probably FGFA will more suit our needs since its tailored for it

its likely that we will be using kaveri engine for MCA with schema helping us. actually that seems to be a good idea since the schema which powers the rafale which has a almost stealth like feature.

but for sure something is cooking in the MCA. like IAC and ATV the project has been officially started but nothing in news about its development. seems this project is again a secret just like the above two.

I appreciate ur confidence in the GoI in maintaining the secrecy like soviet:icon_salut:. But the fact is that ATV starts way long back in middle of 80's. i am not convening that the Indian is in-capable, but it is inexpereinced with abundance red-taping.

Even if the production lines are increased we cant expect 20/year different types of aircraft for sure. As i said earlier even im too enthusiastic about the numbers, say 50+ PAK-FA, 200+ FGFA, 200+ MCA, 100+ MMRCA, then we can also become peace keeper of world:dfi-1:

But reality is different, btw the wind tunnel model is tested in India and in Russia mean 40% of the work is completed, 30% rely back on DRDO and Snecma for delivering a efficient and powerful Kaveri GTX

 

[notinlove]

what are you guys talking about ????

there is no 2020 date mentioned in the article.

 

[plugwater]

Developing Countries Next Generation Fighter Aircraft

Recently when Requirements of MCA now re-named to NGFA (Next Generation Fighter Aircraft) by Indian Air force was made public in section of media , IAF clear dedicates what it wants for NGFA and seems to leave very little room for developers ADE and other DRDO labs . IAF seems will not compromise on the aircrafts capabilities from the start.

For years NGFA was rumored to be a strike aircraft with secondary role of Air defence capabilities. Now IAF wants a fully multirole Aircraft with almost all the technology which only a 5TH Generation Aircraft like Pak-Fa which India is partnered with Russia for its development will have ,India’s contribution to Pak-Fa is limited to sub-system of it avionics and its core software very similar work which was done with Sukhoi-Su30 MKI. Other then Avionics which can be further developed from Tejas MK-II platform they are tones of other things which NGFA will need to make it truly a 5TH Generation Aircraft .

IAF seems to be clear that it wants most of the Avionics and Engine for NGFA to be indigenous, Specially the AESA Radar; it seems IAF will not settle for AESA which has been developed by LRDE for Tejas Mk-II, it want to be more sophisticated then the Current AESA technology what LDRE is working on and better Avionics and Self-defence systems for the aircraft which will take lot of time unless similar Pak-Fa Avionics package is chosen.

The Kaveri-Snecma Engine based on core of M-88 has been seen has the possible engine which will power NGFA, Details of this engine is still not clear and what level of Technology French will bring is also crucial, GTRE failed to develop current Kaveri engine in time to power Tejas Combat aircraft .The new engine should be based on consultation with IAF to avoid future disappointments and should be ready in time to power NGFA which will have a tech demonstrator, three prototype vehicles and two production jets . No intermediate Engine has been sought, Kaveri-II have to be ready in time for NGFA to make its first flight.

Stealthy Airframe Requirements seems to have thrown out any DRDO’s plans of having Aircraft with low Stealth characters, it wants Stealthy Airframe from the start and Current level of technology in India does not have such high end materials, composites and radar observing airframe materials and paints. Wind-tunnel model which was displayed at Aero India 2009 of MCA will need designs changes to meet IAF’s demand of full Stealthy Airframe, while wind tunnel model seemed like Aircraft with Stealth features but not fully stealth aircraft.

Time frame set by ADA is again over ambitious. ADA plans to have the first test flight of the NGFA by 7-8 years, once go head is given which may come by end of 2010, this is simply not possible since most of the technology required for it is still not in pipeline, since various Labs will be working on it any delays by any Lab will effect the schedule flight plan and again it will look similar way which LCA was made to go.

Consultancy and joint development of various systems should be considered to meet the deadline for NGFA’s first flight; Aircraft should be developed with possible export market in mind. To give air forces around the world a cheap and high technology 5TH Generation fighter which can compete with American and Chinese aircrafts in future.

 

[nrj]

By 2020 we wont even make 100+ Tejas :Laie_46:. Thinking of 500 FGFA in 2020 is similpy absurd numbers.

Exactly! 500 heavy 5th gen birds in 10 yrs?? Are we opening war?
Can our government justify budget for that to aam aadmi? This is fantasy!
This will trigger global tensions like we had in '85-'90 between US & Soviets..

By 2020 we will be having 25-30 PAK-FA, 15-20 FGFA, 50-60 MMRCA.

1 Question: Are we going to have separate trainer versions for FGFA or will be using PAK-FA as training platform till our customized bird rolls out?

probably the date of 2020 is wrong. but it is achievable if HAL boosts its production capability. they already invested money for it. so we can say something like 2022. but is it wise to buy PAK FA when we will surely buy the FGFA. probably FGFA will more suit our needs since its tailored for it

I think the date 2020 & number of planes totally depends on IAF's confidence in HAL.
We have skilled engineers & even money so speed of production line is subordinate issue. It can be increased at will when work on our bird is over.
And yes we'll have to go beyond 18 units a year :connie_searchingsky
HAL should better start looking for production facility sites because in coming days it will own hottest & costliest production line rolling out finest aircrafts in the world :twizt:

Ordering PAK-FA is justified because we will need time to fully tailor FGFA from PAK-FA & PAK-FA will surely roll out much before FGFA. That too till the Gods in IAF are pleased by HAL's work & place orders in squadrans not in mere numbers.

To give air forces around the world a cheap and high technology 5TH Generation fighter which can compete with American and Chinese aircrafts in future.

Uncle Sam is already aware of it, i'm sure they'll be creating troubles even if we try to export LCA-Mk 2. But they cant beat us in unit cost & the technology provided. All hopes resting on HAL & GTRE

 

[Agantrope]

Exactly! 500 heavy 5th gen birds in 10 yrs?? Are we opening war?
Can our government justify budget for that to aam aadmi? This is fantasy!
This will trigger global tensions like we had in '85-'90 between US & Soviets..

Exactly.

1 Question: Are we going to have separate trainer versions for FGFA or will be using PAK-FA as training platform till our customized bird rolls out?

I think the pak-fa and fgfa trainer will be same i hope as they are single and 2 seater wont make much difference (my perception)

Ordering PAK-FA is justified because we will need time to fully tailor FGFA from PAK-FA & PAK-FA will surely roll out much before FGFA. That too till the Gods in IAF are pleased by HAL's work & place orders in squadrans not in mere numbers.

Infected bureacrats should need to be removed so that the program can go well

Uncle Sam is already aware of it, i'm sure they'll be creating troubles even if we try to export LCA-Mk 2. But they cant beat us in unit cost & the technology provided. All hopes resting on HAL & GTRE

IF it escape red tape, , we need first for our self-sufficiency, then we can think of export :goodstuff:

 

[lodaxstax]

Hii

No news on NGFA. In Indian context generally no news means good neews. something is cooking. now with rumours of Russkie LMF??? whatever also flying think, would really like to know where we are headed on our desi bird.

Any info?

 

[gogbot]

The project is officially still ongoing,
No doubt still in the preliminary stages of design and studies.

the technology needed to make the plane does not exist in India as of yet, If not for our cooperation in the PAK-FA project the time line for a prototype in 10 years would have been overly ambitious.

Bottom line, the project is somewhere between them choosing the final design to the IAF finalizing their requirements.

 

[enlightened1]

India Develops Requirements For AMCA​

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?topicName=india&id=news/awx/2010/04/21/awx_04_21_2010_p0-221350.xml&headline=India%20Develops%20Requirements%20For%20AMCA​

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?topicName=india&id=news/awx/2010/04/21/awx_04_21_2010_p0-221350.xml&headline=India%20Develops%20Requirements%20For%20AMCAhttp://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?topicName=india&id=news/awx/2010/04/21/awx_04_21_2010_p0-221350.xml&headline=India%20Develops%20Requirements%20For%20AMCA

India's Aeronautical Development Agency is evaluating Indian air force requirements for the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).

The weight of the AMCA will not exceed 25 tons. The twin-engine configured aircraft will have a higher thrust being in the bigger weight category than the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), with an active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar.

The Defense Research & Development Organization (DRDO) had announced earlier this year that the AMCA program would be launched in 2010. While unofficially work has started on the design, according to an official, the AMCA will be officially announced in 6-8 months. "There is nothing official about it"¦ It is currently not a sanctioned project from the government. We are looking at the technical requirements submitted by the Indian air force," the official told Aerospace DAILY.

The AMCA was earlier called the Medium Combat Aircraft. This [AMCA] is very different from the design of the MCA," an official says.

The Medium Multi Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) that India is currently evaluating bids for is a 4.5-generation aircraft, an official says. "None of the contenders fall in the stealth configuration, which is the most important consideration for the AMCA."

India hopes to develop stealth technologies indigenously. "We are looking at stealth features even for the LCA," the official says. "We believe it can be developed here."

Not having chosen an engine as yet, it is likely that the Kaveri Mk-2 engine presently being developed by Snecma and Gas Turbine Research Establishment will be used for the AMCA.

Kaveri was first conceived as an engine for the LCA developed by ADA. The LCA is currently powered by General Electric-404 engines with technical evaluations ongoing for a bid for 99 engines. The contenders are the F-414 and EJ-200.

 

[nrj]

The AMCA was earlier called the Medium Combat Aircraft. This [AMCA] is very different from the design of the MCA," an official says.

Seems IAF updated their requirements again!
I wish the product specifications are frozen once announced & money allocated by GOI in 6months...

 

[nitesh]

some news from irdw

http://idrw.org/?p=1385

Indian Air Force has issued Air Staff Requirements for the Countries Next Generation Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) which will be designed and build in India .

Requirements laid down by Air force is

1 ) AMCA will not exceed 25 tons weight .

2 ) Twin engine powered aircraft with higher thrust.

3) AESA Radar

4) Semi – Stealth is not an option , IAF wants it to be fully Stealthy aircraft with low RCS .

5 ) Redesign in its currently proposed air frame design to make it more stealthier

6 ) More of Locally developed technology and less imported technology (Radars,Engines,Avionics)

Aircraft will be completely different then what earlier DRDO and ADE had put forward which was earlier known as Medium combat aircraft (MCA ) with Semi-stealth features , Government of India has not officially sanctioned the project but the ASR issued to DRDO will be studied and then government will be approached for the funding .

DRDO will approach government in next six to seven months and by 2011 project funding will start with its first flight to be made by 2016-17 period and induction into air force by 2025 . DRDO is confident in developing most of the avionics for the AMCA in house ,while the Engine most probably will be Kaveri-2 which will be a joint venture between India and France , Sources close to idrw.org had indicated that contracts between India and France on development of Kaveri-2 was not signed due to requirements of the engine was not put forward by the air force .

Engine requirements should be 90kn in thrust ,Its almost sure that the first aircraft will not be powered by the Kaveri-2 since it will take more then 5 years to develop this engine for the aircraft and will only power the later developed prototype , mostly likely new engine which will power Tejas MK-2 either Ej-200 or Ge's F414 will power initial aircraft . DRDO is currently planning three Prototypes of AMCA which will carry out initial test flights .

 

[pavanvenkatesh]

30 - 40 yrs and still IOC is pending and they are talking about MCA, i would like to see the LCA first before even talking about MCA they are doing the same mistake that they did on LCA they promise 5th gen technology when they do not even have the technical knowhow to develop even a decent 3++ or a 4th gen A/C (Radars, Engines,EW suites)then they blame the airforce for not supporting them

 

[nitesh]

30 - 40 yrs and still IOC is pending and they are talking about MCA, i would like to see the LCA first before even talking about MCA they are doing the same mistake that they did on LCA they promise 5th gen technology when they do not even have the technical knowhow to develop even a decent 3++ or a 4th gen A/C (Radars, Engines,EW suites)then they blame the airforce for not supporting them

from where this figure of 30-40 year came?

 

[pavanvenkatesh]

from where this figure of 30-40 year came?

was'nt the LCA programme commissioned to begin on 1983? if not i apologise

 

[ppgj]

30 - 40 yrs and still IOC is pending and they are talking about MCA,

i guess, you are talking the development of LCA. can you confirm this 30-40 yrs??

why do you forget under what circumstances they were working? think of the meagre funding and the non cooperation from the foreign collaborators. still it is current with open architecture. in mark 2 version it will even beat Mirages and mig 29's. not a single crash testifies to its FBW and CLAW which was wholly done by indian scientists!! says something about indian designers, right?

i would like to see the LCA first before even talking about MCA

it is done with flight testing and IOC is pretty much done. needs only the MMR so IAF can test A2A/A2G/BVR missiles to validate FOC post induction which can happen anytime now. MMR is stated to be in an advanced stage to be integrated on LSP 3.

there have been many instances before aircrafts being inducted even before IOC!! gripen being a prime example.

it only speaks volume of the indian scientists that they want to be doubly sure before IAF inducts them. positive or negative??

they are doing the same mistake that they did on LCA they promise 5th gen technology when they do not even have the technical knowhow to develop even a decent 3++ or a 4th gen A/C (Radars, Engines,EW suites)then they blame the airforce for not supporting them

when they promised LCA they had to start from scratch as they had no experience building such aircrafts. 20+ years in development time is common even with countries with experience!!!

neither the circumstances nor the the technology is static. they keep moving. so is the case with the designers.

they have mastered the art of building aircrafts now. plus experience in FGFA will aso come in handy. interesting thing to be noted here is India has made rapid strides in avionics (particularly on EW), has the capability in composites, has got acquainted it self with RAM and other stealth elements. LCA derives its stealth nature due to its composites!!

with MMR experience and CAB's and DARE'S own experience with AEW&CS - radar can be visualised in the time frame MCA will come online.

even on the engines, snechma is collaborating with DRDO in bringing Kaveri to fruition.

irrespective of all that, what is the harm in trying?? do you want independance in defence or want to remain being arm twisted by all and sundry??? plus sending the money and the jobs outside.

 

[nitesh]

was'nt the LCA programme commissioned to begin on 1983? if not i apologise

mate please don't get in to media information. yes in 1983 LCA was started as a concept but no real work began till 1989 and at that time also it was not supposed to be the fighter that it is and even there is change in ASR in terms of weapon suites the avionic suite and all. And this is a small part of the story LCA has given a lot to the country in terms of spin off's so don't be critical unnecessarily please

 

[pavanvenkatesh]

why do you forget under what circumstances they were working? think of the meagre funding and the non cooperation from the foreign collaborators.

Why are you discussing this point here? have i ever blamed the scientist for anything? I am not arguing that aspect at all i completly agree with the circumstances they faced all i am saying is before issuing any comments on future projects please make sure there is enough technical capabilities on our end which is possible only after we succesfully develop the LCA mk-2 and mk-3 versions (only around 2015 to 2020)

in mark 2 version it will even beat Mirages and mig 29's. not a single crash testifies to its FBW and CLAW which was wholly done by indian scientists!! says something about indian designers, right?

Please don't get hyper sensitive here please be practical they have not even delivered the mk1 version yet and you are already assuming it will beat other a/c!! moreover mig 29's are a diff class of fighters altogether nobody can comment how much time it will take to be ready so no use comparing. all i am saying is our indian scientists need to be careful when they comment that they CAN or they have to DEVELOP

when they promised LCA they had to start from scratch as they had no experience building such aircrafts. 20+ years in development time is common even with countries with experience!!!

you mean to tell me that our scientist just started developing jet engines with 4++ gen a/c without doing 1st 2ne and 3rd gen a/c thats a load of C@#P remember HF Maarut! you cannot just wake u one day and decide to build a fighter jet like that GTRE and DRDO has been building and developing a/c engines for a loong time check out there website this was just a lack of proper project management by MOD (READ MOD NOT OUR SCIENTIST) and don't compare other countries scientist they have systematically evolved by every generation

they have mastered the art of building aircrafts now. plus experience in FGFA will aso come in handy. interesting thing to be noted here is India has made rapid strides in avionics (particularly on EW), has the capability in composites, has got acquainted it self with RAM and other stealth elements. LCA derives its stealth nature due to its composites!!

Again please be practical they have yet to prove there capabilities of LCA and you already assumed that they have mastered building a/c !! you do realise that there is still a LOONG road ahed to make a 100% indegineous radar or EW suite and engines for LCA which are the main areas of an a/c which we are still developing but already we are masters? lets just be practical you do realise the amount of research needed to master the stealth technology and just by adding composites you cannot make the a/c automatically stealthy please, compare the B-2 with any of the a/c in the MMRCA and you will know

irrespective of all that, what is the harm in trying?? do you want independance in defence or want to remain being arm twisted by all and sundry??? plus sending the money and the jobs outside.

There is absolutly no harm in trying but all i am saying is first do a self assessment of your capabilities and then comment do not commit saying that you will develop 5th gen technology when you are yet to master the 4th gen technology

Againn i am not critisizing the LCA or our scientist all i am saying is first finish and sort out the probs on this project(read radar, engines and avionics which will only be ready by 2015-2016) first so we can atleast carry the expertise to the MCA then go to the next level

 

[Armand2REP]

i why do you forget under what circumstances they were working? think of the meagre funding and the non cooperation from the foreign collaborators. still it is current with open architecture. in mark 2 version it will even beat Mirages and mig 29's. not a single crash testifies to its FBW and CLAW which was wholly done by indian scientists!! says something about indian designers, right?

You think Mk 2 is going to beat a Mirage Mk 2... dream on. 2000-5 Mk2 shares the same architecture as Rafale.

it is done with flight testing and IOC is pretty much done. needs only the MMR so IAF can test A2A/A2G/BVR missiles to validate FOC post induction which can happen anytime now. MMR is stated to be in an advanced stage to be integrated on LSP 3.

Last I heard they were going to buy an MMR from Israel because DRDO has had tough luck making radars.

they have mastered the art of building aircrafts now. plus experience in FGFA will aso come in handy. interesting thing to be noted here is India has made rapid strides in avionics (particularly on EW), has the capability in composites, has got acquainted it self with RAM and other stealth elements. LCA derives its stealth nature due to its composites!!

How has India mastered the art of building aircrafts now? They don't have a single domestic production fighter. FGFA production won't get ramped up until 2020 and the time it takes to assimilate that knowledge for own use could take a decade or more.

Strides in avionics, particularly EW? You mean the Tarang Mk 2 that failed to warn MKI pilots at Red Flag?

with MMR experience and CAB's and DARE'S own experience with AEW&CS - radar can be visualised in the time frame MCA will come online.

If there is one thing I have learned from watching India over these past years is that you never visualise a time frame with DRDO. They never meet it.

even on the engines, snechma is collaborating with DRDO in bringing Kaveri to fruition.

Snecma isn't doing anything yet. GoI are still dragging their feet on signing a contract.

irrespective of all that, what is the harm in trying?? do you want independance in defence or want to remain being arm twisted by all and sundry??? plus sending the money and the jobs outside.

I think I have stated here before that DRDO spends too much time looking into the future rather than fixing the problems they have now. Too much on their plate is not going to help them overcome challenges, it only leads GoI to have to outsource more of the problems that go unresolved. The biggest thing = delays, delays, delays