ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[rvjpheonix]

LCA Flight test update:

From :
LCA-Tejas has completed 2395 Test Flights Successfully. (11-Nov-2013).
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-242,PV2-222,PV3-376,LSP1-74,LSP2-286,PV5-36,LSP3-170,LSP4-95,LSP5-231,LSP7-66,NP1-5,LSP8-54)

To:
LCA-Tejas has completed 2418 Test Flights Successfully. (25-Nov-2013).
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-242,PV2-222,PV3-376,LSP1-74,LSP2-287,PV5-36,LSP3-171,LSP4-99,LSP5-236,LSP7-70,NP1-5,LSP8-62)

 

[ersakthivel]

then what stops us from using the same SCB tech on the kaveri and raising the core temperatures? Does ToT mean that we can use this tech only on the said product?

This question must never be asked here. It is high treason!!!!

Also we should not ask what are the ,"raw materials" that russians are going to supply for the SCB when all of it is available here?

Any metallurgical guy wil know the absurdity of the statement made by some people here. The raw materials of SCB are not exclusively available in Russia.It is available here also.

What is top secret is the metaluurgical process along with various heat treatment processes in labs that make SCB.

It is hard to believe that Russians could transfer such sensitive tech to India.

I too am yet to come across any PDF whoch says that BLISK, Thermo baric coatings or SCB tech are transferred to HAL by russians.

But making these points is dead end argument. There is no proof for it or against it. SO it is of no use further indulging in this endless debate.

It will all boil down to either your word or my word type heated argument.

But in aeroindia 2013 a home grown SCB developed with home grown tech was displayed. I don't know whether it was mentioned that this pieces of SCB was developed with TOT from Russia for AL-31 engine. I haven't come across an open mention of that.

 

[pmaitra]

There are certain areas where the Russians are simply the best. Two areas are metallurgy involving Titanium and Lithium. Boeing depends upon Russia, and Masten Space Systems depends upon Russia, for Titanium and Lithium alloys, respectively. Even Atlas rocket's RD-180 staged-combustion engine (one that requires very good alloys) is imported from Russia, because, this 30 year old technology is still the world's best.

Let's make a reasonable assumption that no one is going to give us full ToT. We will have to learn to struggle and gain our own expertise. There is no other way.

 

[Twinblade]

then what stops us from using the same SCB tech on the kaveri and raising the core temperatures? Does ToT mean that we can use this tech only on the said product?

You need to read a little bit more on this. The Kaveri engine thread would be a better place. To keep it short, there is more to designing a single crystal blade than material technology and production technology. Each single crystal blade is a system in itself with cooling ducts and stuff. You cannot simply take material and production technology from Engine A and use it to make Engine B, for all we know the mechanical forces acting on the blades in one engine are completely different in another engine, so the material technology, production technology and design ability has to come together like three sides of a triangle to make a perfect product. With Al-31 ToT we have received the production technology. The alloys used to make Al-31 might not necessarily be compatible with what is needed in Kaveri engine. As of today we lack in material technology/design ability. There have been a few efforts to make single crystal blades at home, but they are not good enough.
http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/indian-air-force/5097-kaveri-engine-56.html

 

[ersakthivel]

AFAIK the tech involved in ANY SCB has three basic qualifications regardless of it being AL-31 or K-9

they are
1.Ability to withstand the high TET (turbine Entry temperature) above 1700 deg,
2. ability to withstand both the thermal loads and mechanical loads continuously at those high temperatures with sufficient cooling,
3. Ability to withstand the high pressure ratio as well.

Al-31 SC blades tech can be used on any engine that have comparable TWR and TET.

if an engine demands higher TET and pressure ratios than the AL-31,

then we can not use the AL-31 SCB tech in those engines.

if they are same we can. But design TWR for AL-31 and K-9 are very close at around 8.

If we want a meaningful discussion beyond this we need an expert in the field.



Unless we get authentic proof of SCB TOT from russia we can not assume anything based on simple statements like AL-31 from raw material stage means the russians have transferred their AL-31 SCB tech to us.

It is simply unfair to expect russia to transfer such commercially and strategically important tech to us as ap part and parcel of Su-30 MKI deal. No one will ever do that. because it will under cut their own export market.We are yet to get TOT for the brahmos engine.

if they did it means they have got a clear indication that our local tech effort on SCB has reached a critical stage that we may produce SCB by our own in a year or two's time, then they will make a magnanimous gesture of transferring the revolutionary game changing AL-31 SCb tech to us.Otherwise they won't

 

[p2prada]

then what stops us from using the same SCB tech on the kaveri and raising the core temperatures?

The reasons are as simple as why you can't find two exact designs of cars from two different companies on the road. IPR.

The purpose of Kaveri and LCA is indigenization. It becomes pointless if we use Russian SCBs for this. Anyway, the Russian SCB tech is only for MKI. Doesn't mean it can be used on LCA because the weight tolerances along with dimensions will be different.

Does ToT mean that we can use this tech only on the said product?

Yes. It is to ensure that we can do everything by ourselves on the aircraft in case the OEM cannot deliver for reasons outside their control. We don't have the kind of time and money required to reverse engineer equipment for our own use in entirely different products.

Like mentioned earlier, the ToT is for overhaul and production. We don't have design info on the engines. Design info is pointless anyway.

 

[ersakthivel]

Same stupid stuff again.
people never grow up!!!!!!!
Unless we have a source for SCB tech transfer to india it is pointless to insist on the same.

 

[Abhi9]

Good News on Tejas and other aeronautical news in the NAL_CSIR annual report

Wake test have bee completed on Tejas

Improved Air Data System(ADS) versions have been released for the LCA Air Force and Naval aircraft. Wake trials have been conducted after incorporating wake penetration feature in ADS.

As a part of LCA series production, new production standard tools were designed and fabricated through private partner M/s Tata Advanced Materials
Ltd. One set of Centre Fuselage parts (7 nos.) were delivered to the production group of LCA for series production (SP1) assembly. This contribution
is a major step in taking LCA from Limited Series Production (LSP) phase to series production (SP) phase. In an another achievement, the Engine Bay
door (middle) of LCA using high temperature Carbon/Bismaliemide prepreg system, with a service temperature of 200 deg C, was developed
using a novel vacuum bag technique which is currently undergoing
testing (Fig. 6).

MINI UAV slybird was tested in LEH

Details in the pdf[PDF]http://nal.res.in/pdf/dir-rep.pdf[/PDF]

 

[ersakthivel]

Tejas continues to fall behind revised schedules, causing inconvenience to the IAF and the Navy

IOC-1 was granted in January 2011, with a reluctant IAF agreeing to a number of concessions at the time. Wake Penetration Tests (verification of the robustness of Air Data System, Air Data Transducers and FCS against wake of another aircraft), all weather clearance which required lightening tests all had to be completed among many other parameters.

So now it seems NAL has completed wake penetration tests and the ADS has been updated,

SO bharath Karnard was not shooting in the dark when he said the wake penetration tests have been completed in tejas,

http://bharatkarnad.com/2013/11/10/technically-proficient-value-add-to-stop-wasteful-military-deals/

IS all weather clearance i.e the lightning test done?,

 

[ersakthivel]

IRSI-13
papers on ASEA radar algorithms and GaN modules development in the above link.

 

[dvdiyen]

IRSI-13
papers on ASEA radar algorithms and GaN modules development in the above link.

I agree with AESA radar algorithms part. But nowhere there is discussion of GaAs or GaN for Transceiver purpose.
Even though people talk about C-band transmitter in "Design of Compact C Band High Power Radar Transmitter" the developed design cannot be fabricated in BHARATH (depend on CHINA or TAIWAN which I personally hate). The doubt is whether developed transmitter has a GaN process itself.

One more thing AESA requires a minimum of 256 elements (Vivaldi antenna - Endfire array) and beemsteer with the developed algorithms and integration with transceiver is a challenge.

 

[ersakthivel]

Turn performance and agility,

http://www.aviation.org.uk/docs/flighttest.navair.navy.milunrestricted-FTM108/c6.pdf

Lots and lots of formulas,

 

[rvjpheonix]

LCA Flight test update:

From :
LCA-Tejas has completed 2418 Test Flights Successfully. (25-Nov-2013).
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-242,PV2-222,PV3-376,LSP1-74,LSP2-287,PV5-36,LSP3-171,LSP4-99,LSP5-236,LSP7-70,NP1-5,LSP8-62)


To:
LCA-Tejas has completed 2427 Test Flights Successfully. (03-Dec-2013).
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-242,PV2-222,PV3-378,LSP1-74,LSP2-287,PV5-36,LSP3-173,LSP4-101,LSP5-236,LSP7-72,NP1-6,LSP8-62)

 

[bose]

Hit & Run tactic ??

 

[ersakthivel]

http://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/2011/TFApril2011.pdf

An old PDF from 2011 which explicitly says that Single crystal blades and many other alloys developed and displayed in Aeroindia-2013 and 2011 are developed by DMRL and the production tech after certification was passed on to HAL.

SO the blades being made at Koraput HAL uses the indian tech delivered by DMRL and not tech transferred under Su-30 MKI TOT.

According to people who visited the aeroindia 2013 the SCBs produced under batch production techniques was awaiting CEMILAC certification before production begins at Koraput HAL plant.

 

[makmohan]

Tarmak007
Tejas fires missile killing the target

(Press Release | Unedited)

Tejas, India's first indigenously designed developed and productionised 4th generation plus Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) today at aroung 1100hrs achieved yet another milestone by launching an infrared seeking air to air missile that hit the target in a direct hit with precision and destroyed the target. The test, demonstrating required parameters was conducted off the coast of Goa in Arabian Sea, and has taken the aircraft closer to its induction in the Indian Air Force. Tejas, one of its kind combat aircraft, has been developed by DRDO with Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), Bengaluru, as the lead laboratory and HAL as the production partner. Shri Avinash Chander, Scientific Advisor to Defence Minister and Secretary, Deptt of Defence R&D congratulating the team said "with this launch of missile from Tejas and successfully hitting the target in the first shot, we have demonstrated the total weapon system capability of LCA Tejas".

Tejas has been undergoing weapon release flight tests, for its operational clearance. As a prelude today, Gp Capt Suneet Krishna, flying the Tejas aircraft commanded Infrared seeker missile through the fire control radar of the aircraft to lock on to the target. The target was towed by a pilotless target aircraft 'Lakshya' also designed and developed by DRDO's another premier lab, 'Aeronautics Development Establishment' (ADE), Bengaluru developed pilotless target aircraft (PTA). The target mounted on Lakshya was launched by a ship of the Indian Navy off the west coast of India. A team from the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC), Aeronautical Development Agency, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, ADE (DRDO), CEMILAC, DGAQA and the Indian Navy worked in perfect unison to achieve this feat. Shri PS Subramanyam, DS, Program Director Combat vehicles & Director ADA and Air Cmde KA Muthana VSM, Project Director, Flight Test supervised the operations from the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC).

 

[Defcon 1]

Tarmak007
Tejas fires missile killing the target

(Press Release | Unedited)

Tejas, India's first indigenously designed developed and productionised 4th generation plus Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) today at aroung 1100hrs achieved yet another milestone by launching an infrared seeking air to air missile that hit the target in a direct hit with precision and destroyed the target. The test, demonstrating required parameters was conducted off the coast of Goa in Arabian Sea, and has taken the aircraft closer to its induction in the Indian Air Force. Tejas, one of its kind combat aircraft, has been developed by DRDO with Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), Bengaluru, as the lead laboratory and HAL as the production partner. Shri Avinash Chander, Scientific Advisor to Defence Minister and Secretary, Deptt of Defence R&D congratulating the team said "with this launch of missile from Tejas and successfully hitting the target in the first shot, we have demonstrated the total weapon system capability of LCA Tejas".

Tejas has been undergoing weapon release flight tests, for its operational clearance. As a prelude today, Gp Capt Suneet Krishna, flying the Tejas aircraft commanded Infrared seeker missile through the fire control radar of the aircraft to lock on to the target. The target was towed by a pilotless target aircraft 'Lakshya' also designed and developed by DRDO's another premier lab, 'Aeronautics Development Establishment' (ADE), Bengaluru developed pilotless target aircraft (PTA). The target mounted on Lakshya was launched by a ship of the Indian Navy off the west coast of India. A team from the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC), Aeronautical Development Agency, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, ADE (DRDO), CEMILAC, DGAQA and the Indian Navy worked in perfect unison to achieve this feat. Shri PS Subramanyam, DS, Program Director Combat vehicles & Director ADA and Air Cmde KA Muthana VSM, Project Director, Flight Test supervised the operations from the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC).

Should be R73 again. No other missiles for Tejas are IR guided.

 

[Ganesh2691]

AK Antony to induct LCA into Air Force on December 20

NEW DELHI: After a delay of over two decades and several cost overruns, indigenously developed Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas will be inducted in the IAF later this month in Bangalore.

The under development aircraft achieved another significant milestone today with the launching of an infrared seeking air-to-air missile that hit the target with precision and destroyed the target, a DRDO statement said.

The Initial Operational Clearance-II of the aircraft will be done on DecThe under development aircraft achieved another significant milestone today with the launching of an infrared seeking air-to-air missile that hit the target with precision and destroyed the target, a DRDO statement said.

The Initial Operational Clearance-II of the aircraft will be done on December 20 at its home-base in Bangalore after which it will be inducted into the IAF by Defence Minister AK Antony, Defence officials said.

AK Antony to induct LCA into Air Force on December 20 - The Economic Times

 

[dealwithit]

Good news... Just good news for Tejas.........

 

[CuriousBen]

Great news !!!
Is there a plan to to integrate the guns and test it before 20 DEC 2013 ?
What about the naval version, would it be inducted in the navy ? How many tests pending for it ? So far only 3 flights .