ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[Armand2REP]

And how long has the F16 been in service compared to eurojet and how many air frames are flying around of the F 18, f-16 etc..??
A engine failure does not automatically equate to bad engine design ,recurring faults etc.. There are countless moving parts in a engine which are subject to high atmosperic wear and tear. A failure can be because of any countless set of reason from maintenance to defective parts to quality control in the batch of parts used. Unless an inquiry comes up with subjective reasons the rest are all merely speculative....
IT MAKES NO SENSE to debate the suitability of a new engine to be used in a new airframe like LCA based on the crash of a naval jet flying for no one knows how long and the kind of maintenance subjected to it..


An inquiry has been instituted as rightly should be.Lets wait for it...
Heck we don't know anything right now. Probably one engine blew up and disabled the other one or countless other reasons.
Moreover criticality is higher always in a single engine jet like LCA no matter what engine is used.

I wasn't the one who brought up irrelevant comparisons of legacy aircraft to LCA engine options.

Dual engine failure and mulitple failures at Leh do bring up suitability issues for LCA.

Considering it was a USN fighter, it was among the best maintained aircraft in the world so that matters too.

If the second engine of a Super Hornet can't save it, how is the single engine of LCA going to save it? These are important questions.

 

[p2prada]

No chance for the EJ-200 on LCA Mk2. ADA has taken two years just to design the aircraft with the F-414s. We don't even know ho much longer to integrate and test the engine on a test bed before LCA's first flight. Change to EJ-200 and we will see another delay of 3 to 4 years.

So, no chance for EJ-200. It is F-414 all the way.

 

[ersakthivel]

I wasn't the one who brought up irrelevant comparisons of legacy aircraft to LCA engine options.

Dual engine failure and mulitple failures at Leh do bring up suitability issues for LCA.

Considering it was a USN fighter, it was among the best maintained aircraft in the world so that matters too.

If the second engine of a Super Hornet can't save it, how is the single engine of LCA going to save it? These are important questions.

How come the LCA flew 2000 test flight sorties that too in a single engine configuration in such a failure prone GE engine?

All aircrafts of IAF including SU-30 MKI ( including RAFALE )will need modifications to operate in LEH. That was what A.K. Browne said in the link you posted. You are trying to make it as if this issue is LCA specific or GE engine specific.Don't try to twist the IAF chief's words. People already had a field day twisting the words of Former IAF chief Naik with his infamous mig-21 ++ quote. not again now on the leh trials.

 

[sathya]

Indigenous content of Tejas aircraft to go up | idrw.org


While work on obtaining the final operational clearance for India's light combat aircraft (LCA) –Tejas – is going on in full swing, agencies working on the project, parallelly, are vying to increase the indigenisation aspect of the aircraft.

Sources in the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), which is the nodal agency for the project, said: "We have invited local vendors to take up the development of the line replacement units (LRU), commonly called 'components' so as to completely avoid or, at least, reduce the dependency on imports."

Tejas, which was supposed to have been flying on an indigenously developed engine, has had to go in for imported GE engines after the project Kaveri—India's engine development programme—failed to meet specifications.

Barring the engine, which is the heart of the aircraft, there are about 358 components that go into the aircraft, including crucial components in important systems, like avionics, environmental control, electrical and flight control.

Out of the 358 components, 53 per cent, that is 190 components are indigenously manufactured, while the remaining 168 are being imported. Speaking to Deccan Herald, C Ranganayakulu, Scientist "G," ADA, said: "Currently, we are using imported LRUs to operate the flights for test flights and other sorties. When Tejas is ready for induction, we want to have as many indigenous LRUs as possible on the aircraft."

Self-reliance aim

The move is in line with the Centre's ambitions of increasing indigenisation, especially in crucial technologies. "There is no substitute for self-reliance," reiterated Defence Minister A K Antony at a function organised by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO).

Ranganayakulu, who is the convener for development of LRUs at ADA, explained that the agency was mulling to perform what they term "Drop-in Replacement. We will continue to use imported components but are hoping that indigenous products will eventually replace the imported items. We will stop the imports as soon as we have indigenous products meeting the exact specifications." Now, LRUs are imported from Europe, Israel, the UK, Germany, France and other countries as different nations have different specialisations. The engine is imported from the US. The Limited Series Production-8 (LSP-8) of Tejas, the last in the LSP series, successfully completed its maiden flight on Sunday.

Sources said the Tejas, which is going through the initial operational clearance-2 (IOC-2), will be ready to get the final clearance (FOC) by 2014. The Indian Air Force (IAF), which has been waiting to induct the aircraft, is planning to raise the first squadron in Sulur, Tamil Nadu, and has already placed orders for 40 aircraft.

 

[amanbat11]

There is no differenence and no changes were made to the wing twist since the beginning of the program.

The only major change was the addition of auxiliary intakes in the last few years.

Scrap Rafale, Viva Tejas!

This article says there will be changes in the Wingtip of Tejas Mk2, not sure where his information is coming from. Might they have done those changes to the wingtip of LSP-8 already?

 

[Bhadra]

Scrap Rafale, Viva Tejas!

This article says there will be changes in the Wingtip of Tejas Mk2, not sure where his information is coming from. Might they have done those changes to the wingtip of LSP-8 already?

Another inspired crap....

who does not want to be their bosses but where is the boss ?

Or good maneuvure to put pressure of Dassault....

 

[p2prada]

Scrap Rafale, Viva Tejas! | idrw.org

This article says there will be changes in the Wingtip of Tejas Mk2, not sure where his information is coming from. Might they have done those changes to the wingtip of LSP-8 already?

There is a huge difference between wing twist and wing tip.

Wing twist - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wing tip - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Please re-read what I posted.

I will repeat again, there has been no change in the wing twist of LCA Mk1 in its entirety.

Also, changes on Mk1 has less to do with LCA Mk2. That's because the LCA Mk2 design was independent of the LSPs of Mk1s which were already settled well before LCA Mk2 was designed.

The wing tip needed a bit of re-design to reduce trim drag and this is being done on Mk2.

Anyway, the article points that Rafales load carrying capacity is 6 tonnes which is wrong. It is 9.5 tonnes. The range is also horribly wrong.

 

[Decklander]

LCA needs some extra thrust as of yesterday to be able to comply with its 26*AOA limits. Delta designs bleed off energy very rapidly if not backed by adequate thrust. The wing twist and wingtip redesign has been done to reduce the induced drag at high alpha. But that won't help much.

 

[amanbat11]

There is a huge difference between wing twist and wing tip.

Wing twist - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wing tip - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Please re-read what I posted.

I will repeat again, there has been no change in the wing twist of LCA Mk1 in its entirety.

Also, changes on Mk1 has less to do with LCA Mk2. That's because the LCA Mk2 design was independent of the LSPs of Mk1s which were already settled well before LCA Mk2 was designed.

The wing tip needed a bit of re-design to reduce trim drag and this is being done on Mk2.

Anyway, the article points that Rafales load carrying capacity is 6 tonnes which is wrong. It is 9.5 tonnes. The range is also horribly wrong.

Well yeah the article is BS.......

 

[Shaitan]

old pic

 

[shuvo@y2k10]

i think the mmrca should be scapped in favour of tejas mk2 and super su-30mki

 

[vram]

Indigenous content of Tejas aircraft to go up | idrw.org


While work on obtaining the final operational clearance for India's light combat aircraft (LCA) –Tejas – is going on in full swing, agencies working on the project, parallelly, are vying to increase the indigenisation aspect of the aircraft.

Sources in the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), which is the nodal agency for the project, said: "We have invited local vendors to take up the development of the line replacement units (LRU), commonly called 'components' so as to completely avoid or, at least, reduce the dependency on imports."

Tejas, which was supposed to have been flying on an indigenously developed engine, has had to go in for imported GE engines after the project Kaveri—India's engine development programme—failed to meet specifications.


Out of the 358 components, 53 per cent, that is 190 components are indigenously manufactured, while the remaining 168 are being imported. Speaking to Deccan Herald, C Ranganayakulu, Scientist "G," ADA, said: "Currently, we are using imported LRUs to operate the flights for test flights and other sorties. When Tejas is ready for induction, we want to have as many indigenous LRUs as possible on the aircraft."

This article gels with what I had stated earlier regarding the process for manufacturing of the aircraft. It is critically important that INDIA is able to establish a supplier and vendor base for the aerospace industry. Recalling my earlier comments below ...

Agree with you . Outright cheap journalism for trying to sensationalize unrelated Item. THIS WAS MY CONCERN AS WELL THAT I EARLIER MENTIONED. WE WILL NOW SEE MORE AND MORE ATTEMPTS TO THROW MUD AT THE PROGRAM. AS THEY HAVE NOTHING LEFT TO COMPLAIN ABOUT.
LOL!! till now the natasha agents where shouting that the plane itself was only mig21 ++ an hence barely better than a third generation aircraft . NOW they are saying that the plane is 4th gen( Probably dont have any cooked up any facts to complain about left) but that the assembly line is 3rd gen. What the heck does that mean.
THe LSP-8 which is the most advanced Tejas aircraft was produced in this existing line only. Having worked in a Auto major company I can tell you this for a fact -----
THERE IS NOTHING CALLED AS GENERATION CONCEPT IN ASSEMBLY LINES . The production revolves around the concepts of EFFICIENCY, TOOLING, DEFECT REDUCTION, QUALITY and AUTOMATION.
1.)Here Automation and tooling are the two main factory contributing to the modernity and sophistication of the end product. Clearly HAL has this setup else they would never have been able to create the LSP's in the first place. Common sense this is actually.
2.)Now they have to concentrate on the Efficiency and Quality of the supply chain. Here we have the methodologies of Kaizan and Six Sigma that can contribute in helping streamline and achieve the targets without compromising on the critical metrics. HAL should be currently concentrating on this phase.
3.)Now the above two phase when implemented will automatically lead to defect reduction.

No company in this world will setup tooling and machinery for assembly lines for a end product that has not even come out of design phase. That is simply not how manufacturing works They have got the limited scale production unit running now for getting the LSP's out. The main production roll out phase starts now only.

Not every person writing articles out there can have knowledge on the manufacturing industry BUT throwing mud based on rumours and outright wrong understanding of ground situation is really pathetic showing they are not even interested in doing basic homework on your subject before writing. THe writer has confused design phase problems and linked it to SP-1 to prove manufacturing is slow ROLF what crap!!!!!!

 

[Somreet Bhattacharya]

Tejas aircraft deficient in at least 100 technical parameters: Experts

Weren't these parameters worked on??

 

[bose]

Who are these experts... not clear from the article...

 

[vram]

Tejas aircraft deficient in at least 100 technical parameters: Experts

Weren't these parameters worked on??

I am dumbfounded by this article.
WOW EXPERT that ...EXPERT this..EXPERT this that...That article is written like the comprehension assignment of a 9th standard student filled will allusions and all complete non sense. Not a single fact in there. It attributes all knowledge to the SO CALLED mythological god like EXPERT. tells you about some impressive sounding 100 technical parameters without a SINGLE SUBSTANTIAL evidence to provide. Heck everyone and his grandmother knows that IOC-1 did not achieve all parameters. WTF...troting out old stuff and half truths like pearls of wisdom and the pinnacle of investigating journalism...man the standard have gone down in this country..
Stunning...to call that an article or news item is a insult to intelligence.
MY STAND IS BEING VINDICTED HERE... SLOWLY MORE AND MORE MUD SLINGING HAS STARTED.
I thoughtnthe Natasha agents will start creeping out to try derailing stuff and build public opinion against the LCA and Indeginization. But the above article is a pathetic effort. looks like mud slinging has been outsourced to school kids.
Sadly the Indian public will accept the above article like its written from some holy book..

 

[Patriot]

Tejas aircraft deficient in at least 100 technical parameters: Experts

Weren't these parameters worked on??

Paid media propaganda. It is hilarious , there is comment "Tejas is being flown by test pilots". Who else is going to fly , if the plane is on test flight. Such articles are used to fool the laymen mango people & those who are not much involved in defence related updates.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

0. Paid media at work..

1. There are two IOC configuration, 1 is archived and 2 is going to be archived within 3 months..

2. All 40 LCAMK-1 are FOC Config..

3. Where from Test Pilots comes from ?, Also it is not a production variant to be manned by IAF pilot..

===========================

Not to bother, Its media under paid by foreign currency..

1. They also alleged that the initial operation clearance granted to Tejas two years ago was given despite the aircraft not meeting various crucial technical parameters.


2. Indian Air Force has already placed order for 20 LCA in IOC configuration and another of 20 LCA in FOC configuration," added the release.

3. The experts said as the aircraft has not achieved crucial technical parameters, it continues to be flown only by test pilots and its performance parameters too need to be monitored by ground-based stations. They also said the engine of Tejas lacked sufficient power.

.That article is written like the comprehension assignment of a 9th standard student:

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Tejas

 

[Kunal Biswas]

LCA Production Information >>

Source : http://hal-india.com/HAL-CONNECT/HAL-CONNECT-ISSUE-65.pdf

 

[Abhi9]

I think all the negativity surrounding the indigenous projects seems to be a propaganda from the paid media to radically destabilize our effort so that we never become self sufficient and always continue to be a market for arms. Arms lobby go every mile including falsification in media to bribery of our officers. While the media continues to rant about unfinished projects( which i dont even understand as to how they become defence reporters) they never seem to acknowledge the Finished things done by our scientist. I think lot of Indians are morally weak and not a supporter to emancipate our Motherland from clutches of Arms imperialism that exist.