Sukhoi Su 30MKI

[Tang]

RCS is not the issue if you have larger Radar & potent BVR missiles.
F15, Chinese Su27 clones, Russian Su30 and Su35 all have similar RCS.
In the case of 4th gen fighter -> With a larger size, RCS will increase but you have option of a powerful radar, so that you could see your enemy first.

So, therefore, Su30MKI with Aesa radar and better BVR can easily shot down even the best of the jets.

Your RCS theory is overblown.

Su30MKI will remain the backbone of IAF for at least 2 decade.
As how Su30SM,Chinese Su27 clones & F15 will be for their respective forces.

Further Su30MKI will be far more effective as a Drone Mothership.(This project is going on)

 

[BON PLAN]

regarding the chinese technology, well yes they might lack combat experience but they are way ahead of russia.

Chinese engines are copy or russian product.
J11 is a copy.
J10 is inspired (and not only inspired) by Lavi
J20 is.... strange.
only FC31 seems an original design.
Nothing impressive.

 

[lixun]

RCS is not the issue if you have larger Radar & potent BVR missiles.
F15, Chinese Su27 clones, Russian Su30 and Su35 all have similar RCS.
In the case of 4th gen fighter -> With a larger size, RCS will increase but you have option of a powerful radar, so that you could see your enemy first.

So, therefore, Su30MKI with Aesa radar and better BVR can easily shot down even the best of the jets.

Your RCS theory is overblown.

First, the RCS of F15 is smaller than that of SU27.
Second, the radar and missiles of su30mki are not good.
It doesn’t make much sense to consider RCS before the fifth-generation fighter

 

[lixun]

Chinese engines are copy or russian product.
J11 is a copy.
J10 is inspired (and not only inspired) by Lavi
J20 is.... strange.
only FC31 seems an original design.
Nothing impressive.

I remember that before the Chinese mainland flew around the island of Taiwan, Taiwanese pilots thought that our planes were bad replicas of the Soviet Union.
As a result, in a real confrontation, we can hear "The ground radar is gone again Please search by yourself."on the public channel.

 

[pipebomb]

The main source of the RCS value of su27 is that the two inlets can directly see the engine blades.

But that's also true for su-57.

 

[Tang]

First, the RCS of F15 is smaller than that of SU27.
Second, the radar and missiles of su30mki are not good.
It doesn’t make much sense to consider RCS before the fifth-generation fighter

Nope RCS of f15 and Su30MKI is comparable, I am not talking about Su27
The radar and missiles can be upgraded, btw Russian also use the same missiles.
Fifth gen fighter, you mean to say F35 or F22,
We don't consider J20 to be 5th gen

 

[MiG-29SMT]

The aircraft uses the engine casing to generate electricity. This is related to the design of your aircraft and has nothing to do with several engines. Generally speaking, twin-engine fighters have larger internal volume and stronger electronic warfare capabilities. The radar depends on the size of the fighter's nose.

engines also generate electricity to be used on the aircraft electronics a twin engined aircraft thus has always larger radar range

 

[MiG-29SMT]

I suspect that the aircraft data is wrong. The su30SM with two-seater, canard and vector thrust has the same weight as the su27, which is very abnormal, and the engine thrust is still the data of the old AL31.

Su-30MKI is a bit heavier than regular Su-30MKK, the increase in weight from single seat Su-27 aircraft forward of the center of gravity and the fact canards allowed better vortex control coupled with TVC nozzles allowed a new airframe.

The best is to re-engine with 117s engines Su-30MKIs and fit it with a new radar, basically a super sukhoi

 

[Tang]

View attachment 106085

Su-30MKI is a bit heavier than regular Su-30MKK, the increase in weight from single seat Su-27 aircraft forward of the center of gravity and the fact canards allowed better vortex control coupled with TVC nozzles allowed a new airframe.

The best is to re-engine with 117s engines Su-30MKIs and fit it with a new radar, basically a super sukhoi

We are not going for re-engine, we will go for Avionics and missiles upgrade.
Btw if you watch closely, Su30MKI has been our test mule for various avionics developed by DRDO.

With uprated AESA radar(1500+ TRM) with around 400KM range
Astra and Asraam missile range, along with Brahmos for few.
MAWS, RWR, IRST upgrades, It will be a beast.

 

[MiG-29SMT]

We are not going for re-engine, we will go for Avionics and missiles upgrade.
Btw if you watch closely, Su30MKI has been our test mule for various avionics developed by DRDO.

With uprated AESA radar(1500+ TRM) with around 400KM range
Astra and Asraam missile range, along with Brahmos for few.
MAWS, RWR, IRST upgrades, It will be a beast.

Those are your aircraft, but Russia will go for a re-engined version of Su-30MS, which will allow faster speed and supercruise speeds.

That is a good benefit since supercruising will allow tiring regular aircraft.

 

[lixun]

Nope RCS of f15 and Su30MKI is comparable, I am not talking about Su27
The radar and missiles can be upgraded, btw Russian also use the same missiles.
Fifth gen fighter, you mean to say F35 or F22,
We don't consider J20 to be 5th gen

Are Russian weapons good? Although the NO11 radar is a PESA, the back-end processing system is still an analog circuit, and the peak power is only 1.6KW. And due to the limited scanning angle, a mechanical rotating base is installed, which adds a lot of Many people say that the detection distance is long. In fact, this is a problem of measurement standards. Russian radars usually concentrate a very narrow beam at a height of 2000m to scan, while China and the United States scan at a height of 1000m. According to Chinese standards, the performance of the Su35 radar is only 70% of the Russian advertised performance. In fact, the performance of the NO11M radar and the 1493 on the J11B and the APG71 on the F14D are not much different, and even some are behind.
I bet the RCS value of su30MKI is greater than that of Su-27. First of all, two-seater will increase the height, plus the canard, the RCS value will definitely increase.

 

[lixun]

engines also generate electricity to be used on the aircraft electronics a twin engined aircraft thus has always larger radar range

Generally speaking, the radar has independent power supply facilities, and the power supply capacity of the aircraft has nothing to do with the engine thrust. The engine of the JH7 is Spey MK202, but the power generation is larger than that of the J16.

 

[lixun]

View attachment 106085

Su-30MKI is a bit heavier than regular Su-30MKK, the increase in weight from single seat Su-27 aircraft forward of the center of gravity and the fact canards allowed better vortex control coupled with TVC nozzles allowed a new airframe.

The best is to re-engine with 117s engines Su-30MKIs and fit it with a new radar, basically a super sukhoi

Wrong, the weight of SU30 is 1t heavier than su27. According to my information, the weight of SU30MKI should be 18900KG. To be precise, it should not be called canard, it should be called Front delta wing which can improve the rolling performance and instantaneous angular. velocity

 

[lixun]

But that's also true for su-57.

Su57 has a baffle that can block the inlet, and the inlet of su57 is slightly curved,

 

[Dark Sorrow]

Is possible to remove the canards on mki, will it help in rcs. su-35 doesn't have canards. j-16 as well.

You will have to modify flight control software. if you remove canards. All flight control software are developed with aircraft's aerodynamics in mind. You can't change aircraft's aerodynamics at will.

 

[Dark Sorrow]

There are two way to execute this rcs problem

1} A high power radar that nullifies opponent's rcs advantage & an equally long range weapon to execute the target at that range.( for eg. easiest mod mki can do is to integrate astra or similar class missile, it enhance mki's deadlines manyfold }

2} Optimise mki's rcs significantly.

In real combat all aircraft tend to keep its radio emission to the minimum to avoid detection by adversary.
AWACS are used to detect enemy and forward the firing solutions to fighter aircraft. Fighter aircraft tend to keep their radar off and get situational awareness from IRST and AWACS.
No matter how powerful radar is installed in Su-30 MKI, it won't be able to compete against AWACS radar.

Optimizing MKI's RCS at this stage won't be easy specifically if it involves changing aircraft skin as it may required us to redo aerodynamic study.

I think EW is way to go/

 

[JBH22]

Are Russian weapons good? Although the NO11 radar is a PESA, the back-end processing system is still an analog circuit, and the peak power is only 1.6KW. And due to the limited scanning angle, a mechanical rotating base is installed, which adds a lot of Many people say that the detection distance is long. In fact, this is a problem of measurement standards. Russian radars usually concentrate a very narrow beam at a height of 2000m to scan, while China and the United States scan at a height of 1000m. According to Chinese standards, the performance of the Su35 radar is only 70% of the Russian advertised performance. In fact, the performance of the NO11M radar and the 1493 on the J11B and the APG71 on the F14D are not much different, and even some are behind.
I bet the RCS value of su30MKI is greater than that of Su-27. First of all, two-seater will increase the height, plus the canard, the RCS value will definitely increase.

Are Russian weapons good, yes if not better than Chinese one. You get value for money.
Is it better than Western one, that is highly debatable. However, based on our experience in using them we have had good results. MIG 21 gave good account of itself when faced to Pakistani F-86 or F 104. Even during the 2019 events the Su 30Mki gave a decent performance, it dodged a barrage of Amraam if we go by official sources.

 

[MiG-29SMT]

Wrong, the weight of SU30 is 1t heavier than su27. According to my information, the weight of SU30MKI should be 18900KG. To be precise, it should not be called canard, it should be called Front delta wing which can improve the rolling performance and instantaneous angular. velocity

I am not wrong, the Su-27K/Su-33 had canards to improve lower speeds.

Su-27M/Su-35/Su-37 had a heavier nose thus needed canards to regain lift.

Su-30MKI is basically a Su-30 with canards using the expertise gained by Su-35/Su-27M

 

[MiG-29SMT]

Generally speaking, the radar has independent power supply facilities, and the power supply capacity of the aircraft has nothing to do with the engine thrust. The engine of the JH7 is Spey MK202, but the power generation is larger than that of the J16.

your statement is pretty wrong, Tempest will have a super radar thanks to new engines generating lots of voltage.

Su-30 generates more electricity, they also have batteries but bateries add weight, a smarter way is generate electricity with the engines, Sorry your chinese pride might be offended but J-10 can not compete with a twin engine Su-30 in radar potentiality.

J-20 is different

 

[MiG-29SMT]

Generally speaking, the radar has independent power supply facilities, and the power supply capacity of the aircraft has nothing to do with the engine thrust. The engine of the JH7 is Spey MK202, but the power generation is larger than that of the J16.

Rolls-Royce is adapting to the reality that all future vehicles, whether on land, in the air or at sea will have significantly increased levels of electrification to power sensors, communications systems weapons, actuation systems and accessories, as well as the usual array of avionics.

The launch of phase one of the E2SG programme saw significant investment in the development of an integrated electrical facility – a unique test house where gas turbine engines can be physically connected to a DC electrical network.

Rolls-Royce develops world-first electrical technology for next-generation Tempest programme

Rolls-Royce develops world-first electrical technology for next-generation Tempest programme

www.rolls-royce.com