Sukhoi Su 30MKI

[JBH22]

Flashback to 2003 just following Op Parakram, IAF was having a fan moment with acquisition of such a plane. Just like 20 years from now Rafale will no longer be the blue eyed boy
SU-30Mki was a worthy investment, I just hope the upgrade they choose gives it new lease of life

 

[bhramos]

 

[BON PLAN]

 

[BON PLAN]

View attachment 91019

Su-30MKI and HAL Tejas
Sharp contrast in physical size

It is NLCA. see the moving part in front of the cranked delta.
See also how the wings and the frame are linked : very smoothly to have a great fuel capacity.

 

[Tang]

Flashback to 2003 just following Op Parakram, IAF was having a fan moment with acquisition of such a plane. Just like 20 years from now Rafale will no longer be the blue eyed boy
SU-30Mki was a worthy investment, I just hope the upgrade they choose gives it new lease of life

Super Sukhoi will make it a beast.

 

[BON PLAN]

Super Sukhoi will make it a beast.

A SU30MKI with an AESA big radar, more potent air to air missiles (ASTRA 3 ?), a new electronic counter measures system, without new engines but just reliable ones will be a fierce dominant fighter.
The sole weakness : a huge RCS... impossible to change, just some minor upgrades here and here maybe.

 

[Tridev123]

A SU30MKI with an AESA big radar, more potent air to air missiles (ASTRA 3 ?), a new electronic counter measures system, without new engines but just reliable ones will be a fierce dominant fighter.
The sole weakness : a huge RCS... impossible to change, just some minor upgrades here and here maybe.

I know the French would never be comfortable speaking highly of Russian fighters and the reverse is also true.

But if the Su30 mki could have a customised Spectra suite then the enemy plane will find it difficult to get a firing solution. I guess the Su30 mki needs something like the Spectra more than the Rafale. Because the Rafale even without the Spectra has a lower RCS.

In case something like this materialises the Super Sukhoi would really be a game changer.

Wonder if Russia and India are working to achieve it.

 

[hawwk]

this one got me

 

[BON PLAN]

I know the French would never be comfortable speaking highly of Russian fighters and the reverse is also true.

But if the Su30 mki could have a customised Spectra suite then the enemy plane will find it difficult to get a firing solution. I guess the Su30 mki needs something like the Spectra more than the Rafale. Because the Rafale even without the Spectra has a lower RCS.

In case something like this materialises the Super Sukhoi would really be a game changer.

Wonder if Russia and India are working to achieve it.

A SPECTRA like system is tailor made to the plane fitted with. In the Su30MKI, with a farm door RCS, needs a far higher power system. But it's a solution.
SPECTRA drained 25% of the whole R&D financial effort of the Rafale program. It's huge. And the actual SPECTRA rely on 20+ years of refinements, soft improvements, hardware changes (GaAs to GaN for exemple), improved library ... It's not as easy. Maybe more difficult than to study a new radar.
It is very sensible, so difficult to share know how on this specific kind of subject.

 

[FalconSlayers]

I know the French would never be comfortable speaking highly of Russian fighters and the reverse is also true.

But if the Su30 mki could have a customised Spectra suite then the enemy plane will find it difficult to get a firing solution. I guess the Su30 mki needs something like the Spectra more than the Rafale. Because the Rafale even without the Spectra has a lower RCS.

In case something like this materialises the Super Sukhoi would really be a game changer.

Wonder if Russia and India are working to achieve it.

It’s better to have higher RCS sometimes to make an ass out of your enemy. How do you think Pakis wasted 5 AMRAAMs on 1 Sukhoi yet were unable to take it down?

 

[Tridev123]

A SPECTRA like system is tailor made to the plane fitted with. In the Su30MKI, with a farm door RCS, needs a far higher power system. But it's a solution.
SPECTRA drained 25% of the whole R&D financial effort of the Rafale program. It's huge. And the actual SPECTRA rely on 20+ years of refinements, soft improvements, hardware changes (GaAs to GaN for exemple), improved library ... It's not as easy. Maybe more difficult than to study a new radar.
It is very sensible, so difficult to share know how on this specific kind of subject.

Yes, I know designing an new Spectra like system for the Su30 mki is hard work.
But it may be a solution to mitigating the problem of large RCS of the aircraft.

A question. How does the F15 manage to tackle the problem of its rather large RCS. I guess its RCS must be at least equal to the Su30 RCS.

Any progress on designing an analogue to the French Spectra will have an good spillover effect. If we can master the technology it can be fielded on the Tejas also. The Tejas already has a low RCS and the new addition will make it a semi stealth aircraft. Similarly for the MWF.

Anyway hope dreams turn into reality. India is already quite ahead in EW technology though not one of the the leaders.

 

[Tridev123]

It’s better to have higher RCS sometimes to make an ass out of your enemy. How do you think Pakis wasted 5 AMRAAMs on 1 Sukhoi yet were unable to take it down?

I have a lot of faith in the Su30 mki but we need not be lucky always.
The radar range of the Su30 mki is far greater than the F16 Block 52. The only thing lacking was a long range BVR missile which could at least match the AMRAAM 120C5 or even exceed it. The PAF F16's in their fear of the Su30 mki prematurely fired their AMRAAM's at Dmax range hoping for a miracle. Our planes had very good jammers which negated the threat.

Being on the defensive always might not be a good strategy. The Su30 mki needs to lock on to the Pak aircraft and fire its BVR missile.

The Astra mk1, mk2 and mk3 will provide the necessary teeth to the Su30 mki to take the initiative.

 

[FalconSlayers]

I have a lot of faith in the Su30 mki but we need not be lucky always.
The radar range of the Su30 mki is far greater than the F16 Block 52. The only thing lacking was a long range BVR missile which could at least match the AMRAAM 120C5 or even exceed it. The PAF F16's in their fear of the Su30 mki prematurely fired their AMRAAM's at Dmax range hoping for a miracle. Our planes had very good jammers which negated the threat.

Being on the defensive always might not be a good strategy. The Su30 mki needs to lock on to the Pak aircraft and fire its BVR missile.

The Astra mk1, mk2 and mk3 will provide the necessary teeth to the Su30 mki to take the initiative.

The reason they fired at Dmax was because of MKI’s huge RCS, they detected it and firedit once locket at dmax, if they would have detected a MiG-21 at a distance of let’s say 50km, they would still have had a higher chance of bringing her down, because the range was optimum for it.

 

[Tridev123]

The reason they fired at Dmax was because of MKI’s huge RCS, they detected it and firedit once locket at dmax, if they would have detected a MiG-21 at a distance of let’s say 50km, they would still have had a higher chance of bringing her down, because the range was optimum for it.

Yes, bad tactics by the PAF pilots.
The AN/APG - 68(v)9 radar on the Pak F16 Block 52 has a 105 km detection range for a 5 m2 target. It is a Pulse Doppler radar and not even an PESA radar. It is inferior to the Su30mki PESA radar as far as raw power goes.

In an ideal situation the Su30mki radar should have spotted the Pak F16 first. The F16 though having a lower RCS than the Su30mki is not an stealth aircraft.

 

[Srinivas_K]

The reason they fired at Dmax was because of MKI’s huge RCS, they detected it and firedit once locket at dmax, if they would have detected a MiG-21 at a distance of let’s say 50km, they would still have had a higher chance of bringing her down, because the range was optimum for it.

They got the taste of Jammers IAF is using, any experienced pilot will make sure that missile kill probability is at least 70% when firing it.

Either Pakistanis are firing the missiles to distract with out engaging the Su 30 MKI with their fighters trying to drop bombs or their missiles are jammed successfully.

Anyway the bombs they dropped are also not locked correctly or guided correctly and fell far away from their target.

As a result they are now trying to revamp their missile systems and planning to induct J10's.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Yes, bad tactics by the PAF pilots.
The AN/APG - 68(v)9 radar on the Pak F16 Block 52 has a 105 km detection range for a 5 m2 target. It is a Pulse Doppler radar and not even an PESA radar. It is inferior to the Su30mki PESA radar as far as raw power goes.

In an ideal situation the Su30mki radar should have spotted the Pak F16 first. The F16 though having a lower RCS than the Su30mki is not an stealth aircraft.

Fun fact is that their radar is a pulse doppler radar used in F-16, so if MKIs would have had BVR edge, Paki F-16s would have been a target practice for the BARS radar of the Flanker, now India has the BVR edge in the form of our indigenous Astra missile and some 130km R-27 missiles.

 

[Tridev123]

Fun fact is that their radar is a pulse doppler radar used in F-16, so if MKIs would have had BVR edge, Paki F-16s would have been a target practice for the BARS radar of the Flanker, now India has the BVR edge in the form of our indigenous Astra missile and some 130km R-27 missiles.

Yes, now the desperate Pakistanis are looking at Chinese BVR missiles as some sort of viagra for their Air force.
Pl10, pl15 and what not. Nobody knows whether they would work at all.
My advice to the Chinese, supply your so called advanced missiles to Syria and Iran. They will use it against Israel and the truth will come out. Except for some drones I doubt whether any major weapon system of the Chinese have been tested in battle.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Yes, now the desperate Pakistanis are looking at Chinese BVR missiles as some sort of viagra for their Air force.
Pl10, pl15 and what not. Nobody knows whether they would work at all.
My advice to the Chinese, supply your so called advanced missiles to Syria and Iran. They will use it against Israel and the truth will come out. Except for some drones I doubt whether any major weapon system of the Chinese have been tested in battle.

Anyways, never seen Chinese missiles being tested, they are just CCPee vids and all, and their weapons have always failed everywhere else, just look at their UAVs.

 

[Kalkioftoday]

Even if we put a great radar on Su30 mki it still won't cut it in this era. It's truck size RCS is it's bane. The J10c those pakis are buying are very advance in terms of avionics, weapons and RCS reduction. Frontal part of J10c has very low radar cross section combined with an AESA and PL15, it'll be a force to reckon with. Honestly speaking i don't see MKI as our primary air superiority fighter anymore, i'll replace it with Rafale or Tejas Mk2. Somewhere on twitter i saw someone posting that in a testing Tejas' radar detected our MKI even befor our MKI's radar detected the Tejas. Though the J10 has a bigger radar even than i'll put Tejas Mk2 as our answer to J10s of pakistan and china. We don't know how advance china's airborne radars are but i'm pretty sure they're using GaN based TSA antennas for their J20 radars and pretty sure it'll be soon featured on their newest version of J10s and J16s. It's somehow very funny to think that the Russians are touting super sukhois radar upgrade as some sort of out of the earth upgrade even though they're still using those f*king PESA radars. God knows what'll happen to our Sukhoi upgrade but whatever happens i don't want to see another soviet garbage, i mean the russian radar on it

 

[pipebomb]

Is possible to remove the canards on mki, will it help in rcs. su-35 doesn't have canards. j-16 as well.