Small arms and Light Weapons

[FalconSlayers]

AKs are popular not because of its accuracy but for its ruggedness, stopping power, easy to manufacture. It can also fire from hip while tabor can't.

That doesn’t mean we’ll buy AK-203.

 

[Vishalreddy3]

I don't mind our AK-203, if it looked like the last one with green paint job!!

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

That doesn’t mean we’ll buy AK-203.

We should buy ak 203
Its a proven design and it is rugged.
Since it will be made by ofb ,I hope they make it like SLR not like insas.

 

[Kchontha]

That doesn’t mean we’ll buy AK-203.

I didn't mention anything about you buying ak 203 or not.

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

I saw video about a packie telling difference about darra ak and original ak.
Oh boy , the difference he said was that the hand guard has quite space but darra ak has not.
Plus that knob or what ever it's called which is used to change the moDe of fire come out completely in darra ak when the top cover is opened , which is very light compared to original Russian one.
Then cleaning rod will , if present will be very short in darra ak as compared to Russian ak.
Plus there is a sound difference when the top cover is hit with the magazine of each ak .

 

[ALBY]

Thanks @Gessler @Johny_Baba thanks for the effort. All these tjme i was thinking, putting an M-lok handguards will make an Ak somewhat free floating.
Btw whats the rationale of making stocks righward folding in Aks where fire selectors are placed in right side. Sorry if its easy to manipulate the controls even with the stocks righward folded.Asking because i had personally came across only fixed stocks ones until now.

 

[Whitecollar]

Thanks @Gessler @Johny_Baba thanks for the effort. All these tjme i was thinking, putting an M-lok handguards will make an Ak somewhat free floating.
Btw whats the rationale of making stocks righward folding in Aks where fire selectors are placed in right side. Sorry if its easy to manipulate the controls even with the stocks righward folded.Asking because i had personally came across only fixed stocks ones until now.

Can you find and put some pics where buttstock gets folded rightwards?

 

[Whitecollar]

I saw video about a packie telling difference about darra ak and original ak.
Oh boy , the difference he said was that the hand guard has quite space but darra ak has not.
Plus that knob or what ever it's called which is used to change the moDe of fire come out completely in darra ak when the top cover is opened , which is very light compared to original Russian one.
Then cleaning rod will , if present will be very short in darra ak as compared to Russian ak.
Plus there is a sound difference when the top cover is hit with the magazine of each ak .

They have come quite far. For a price of Honda Unicorn 150, they will offer you almost original AKM with original bolt, trigger, barrel, etc. That should also last long with dubious Darra made 7.62x39 ammo.

This is also a problem we will face when we get back POK. A lot of locals armed with Darra rifles(be it accurate to only 20 mtrs) will create another battle front for our troops to fight back.

 

[Vishalreddy3]

CMMG MK47 (rifle on the right) looks good for our carbine requirements!!

 

[Whitecollar]

CMMG MK47 (rifle on the right) looks good for our carbine requirements!!
View attachment 96680

This time, I guess OFB Carbine is on the cards for MoD. We can only imagine about these...

 

[Kchontha]

Seems like ofb doesn't care whether their products sell or not since their employees salary is ensured.

 

[Gessler]

AKs are popular not because of its accuracy but for its ruggedness, stopping power, easy to manufacture. It can also fire from hip while tabor can't.

Wut

Thanks @Gessler @Johny_Baba thanks for the effort. All these tjme i was thinking, putting an M-lok handguards will make an Ak somewhat free floating.
Btw whats the rationale of making stocks righward folding in Aks where fire selectors are placed in right side. Sorry if its easy to manipulate the controls even with the stocks righward folded.Asking because i had personally came across only fixed stocks ones until now.

AK103/203 as well as the old Krinkov stocks all fold to the left, not right.

Far as I know, only some variants like the MPi-KMS fold to the right...and those wireframe stocks are shaped in order to not obstruct the fire selector as much as possible.

 

[Johny_Baba]

Why would you want this polish AK when we already have just best alternative to that in service i.e. Arsenal M5F41 ?
View attachment 96303

besides if you want to get a polish assault rifle then why even asking for Beryl M762 when this beauty exist
View attachment 96307
...oops...i mean this beauty in her hands of course
View attachment 96310
Fabryka Broni MSBS Radom // Grot, a modular rifle based heavily on Magpul Masada//Bushmaster ACR//Remington ACR

@Bhumihar somewhere asked my opinions on ACR, well what to say just ask Poles who based their next-gen rifle on that one after importing some ACRs for their Special Forces and now in process of replacing all their Beryl and other Kalashnikov based rifles with MSBS

Oh and of course MSBS comes in two configurations based on exact same internals, one is conventional one shown above and other is bullpup one, both takes same exact upper receiver and internals - just railed top section + buttstocks + lower receivers and handguards are different between two configurations...TLR; a true modular rifle, fully ambidextrous too...one can even change side of ejection by disassembly-based modifications

Poles even offered MSBS in 7.62x39mm in just same configurations as Bren 2,
one with conventional AK style lower receiver, to accomodate AK magazines (this came out in 2014 btw)
View attachment 96311
and other that could take STANAG compatible 7.62x39mm magazines just like regular Bren 2 (MCIWS ?) and so, came in later stage
View attachment 96312
...so given a chance which one would you pick up from above ?

finally, MSBS DMR version in 7.62x51mm NATO, currently undergoing trials with Polish Army
View attachment 96313

Having said all these MSBS (or in general ACR in my view) aren't perfect,
one major issue is, to make these firearms lighter they used polmyer parts wherever possible and those polymer made lower receivers and buttstocks are fragile - prone to crackings and what not...even bolt carrier of MSBS was given some milling to shed off some weight that made it prone to crackings and so,

on the other hand MSBS perfected one of the major issue on ACR design that was quick detachable barrel swap, ACR one required no tool to lock/remove a barrel from barrel extension in receiver but it was somewhat malfunction prone design - after some time barrel would loosen up and start wobbling etc...MSBS fixed that one with a threaded nut-affixed barrel that provided much tighter fit and worked well enough, only downside was it required a hex key for locking-unlocking barrel.
ACR barrel swap mechanism, you use that U-shaped lever attached to barrel nut to lock-unlock barrel
View attachment 96314
MSBS also has barrel swap feature but simplified barrel locking on it by just using this hexagonal headed nut, you use appropriate Hex Key to loosen the barrel in barrel extension, pull it out, insert new barrel and tighten the nut
View attachment 96315

In this post i briefly talked about issues with MSBS, like cracks in polymer lower receiver, buttstock and even on metal bolt carrier but didn't provide pics etc,
thought i should throw some pics to give a better overview of situation...
>"cracks" in polymer lower receiver
hhmm what lower receiver ? it's gone!

>cracks in polymer buttstock
welp buttstock retaining button is gone and now you can't lock it on rifle...

oh wait...in some cases even buttstock=gone!

There also were complaints that length adjustable buttstock would totally jam up and won't allow adjustments after sand or other shit gets inside and accumulates on sliding surfaces...

Speaking of Sands....Rifle completely failed in sand tests...like once sand goes in the receiver it simply jams up working parts (see video in second,ORIGINAL media article comprising all issues)
>cracks on metal bolt carrier
So this is the flat surface on which that spring loaded piston rod of short stroke system strikes during firing yada yada...just look how it literally cracked the metal and even bent it downwards that carrier rail channel at front got closed so your rifle perhaps won't be able to cycle or go fully into battery afterwards (notice in first pic where magazine well is gone in lower receiver, bolt carrier isn't fully into battery...perhaps this on is from same rifle-same bolt carrier ?)

and even if bolt carrier survives strikes of its own gas system, it couldn't survive rusting from humidity in environment or such conditions it seems

oh and speaking of Gas System itself...They literally have to tie gas regulator on their rifles with cords or whatever comes handy so that it doesn't fall off the rifle...sigh

We may diss on OFB a lot for their hutiyappas with INSAS but even a supposed 21st generation rifle like MSBS suffered catastrophic failures during its early induction period, nowadays they say they have fixed all these issues by improving their QC during manufacturing etc but...yeah...

This is also example why i don't like polymer guns much...specially polymer in receivers...

whole story is even more interesting...like how Fabryka Broni later sued those media wallahs who broke it out with defamation laws and made much hulla-ho, reminds me of a Gujarati kahavat here "Kaagadaa Badhey Kaalaa" = Crows Are Black Everywhere (people are same everywhere)
read it at -
> https://www.overtdefense.com/2021/0...-causes-national-security-concerns-in-poland/
> https://wiadomosci.onet.pl/tylko-w-...s-jego-wad/0yent0v?utm_campaign=leo_automatic

 

[MisraZ]

In this post i briefly talked about issues with MSBS, like cracks in polymer lower receiver, buttstock and even on metal bolt carrier but didn't provide pics etc,
thought i should throw some pics to give a better overview of situation...
>"cracks" in polymer lower receiver
hhmm what lower receiver ?
View attachment 96746
>cracks in polymer buttstock
welp buttstock retaining button is gone and now you can't lock it on rifle...
View attachment 96747
>cracks on metal bolt carrier
So this is the flat surface on which that spring loaded piston rod of short stroke system strikes during firing yada yada...just look how it literally cracked the metal and even bent it downwards that carrier rail channel at front got closed so your rifle perhaps won't be able to cycle or go fully into battery afterwards (notice in first pic where magazine well is gone in lower receiver, bolt carrier isn't fully into battery...perhaps this on is from same rifle-same bolt carrier ?)
View attachment 96748

We may diss on OFB a lot for their hutiyappas with INSAS but even a supposed 21st generation rifle like MSBS suffered catastrophic failures during its early induction period, nowadays they say they have fixed all these issues by improving their QC during manufacturing etc but...yeah...

This is also example why i don't like polymer guns much...specially polymer in receivers...

whole story is even more interesting...like how Fabryka Broni later sued those media wallahs who broke it out with defamation laws and made much hulla-ho, reminds me of a Gujarati kahavat here "Kaagadaa Badhey Kaalaa" = Crows Are Black Everywhere (people are same everywhere)
read it at - https://www.overtdefense.com/2021/0...-causes-national-security-concerns-in-poland/

This is the same reason why US army didn't opt for XM8, I guess. Thanks for the pics bhai, i'll keep it handy for Polish simpers.

 

[Johny_Baba]

This is the same reason why US army didn't opt for XM8, I guess. Thanks for the pics bhai, i'll keep it handy for Polish simpers.

Heh thanks i actually wanted to talk about next part of AK Free-Floating Barrel vis that Iron Sight Block and Alternatives to that etc but guess i need to find some more pictures of what i have in mind etc...also this single explanation of what i have in mind might require to cover lots of different Kalashnikov derivatives including our Indian ones so yeah...might take some time...even AK-12 journey, as we know it now...

So for now just provided some insights of "dark side" of MSBS after showing off much of its brighter side...

BTW XM8 despite being AR-18 derivative at its core isn't much near to Masada/ACR/MSBS designs, rather it's just reworked H&K G-36 which is also an AR-18 derivative of course.
I mean it's more near to one derivative - G-36 - than others.

 

[Gessler]

I don't mind our AK-203, if it looked like the last one with green paint job!!
View attachment 96664

In service, our 203s will probably look similar to this config:

(^^ that example is 5.45 AK-74 but other than the mag, rest all is pretty much the same between 545 & 762)

> Non-standard vertical/angled grips of some kind (ProMag PM007, FAB TFL etc are some models seen with likes of RR and will likely carry over).

> Non-standard optics (FALKE LE Gen 1&2, ADTL magnifier etc used currently)

> Non-standard weapon light (FAB G2 etc)

Due to not being standard issue, the availability of this peripheral kit will be very spotty & inconsistent.

In addition, we will also get to see some other kit like BEL PNVS I2, Tonbo Arjun TI etc. mounted from time to time depending on situation.

 

[Kchontha]

Some paid media or dalals are at their best to show their true colour, I feel sympathy for their lack of integrity, in order to push their product they cried faults on insas after next day they will cry for 5.45 against ak rounds without any hearts for the men at the fields. These people are bastards they will sell their mothers for one peisha.

 

[Whitecollar]

Why doesn't anybody talk about yet another scam during Congress days: the Beretta MX4 Storm deal. I never really understood why BSF were given these and how they were even selected in the first place.

 

[Marliii]

Why doesn't anybody talk about yet another scam during Congress days: the Beretta MX4 Storm deal. I never really understood why BSF were given these and how they were even selected in the first place.

View attachment 96874

They had some issues with the gun.but as its not indeginous it wasn't a big deal

 

[Marliii]

They had some issues with the gun.but as its not indeginous it wasn't a big deal

Faulty weapons worth Rs 200 crore given to BSF jawans

Italian arms major Beretta has agreed to replace faulty weapons supplied by them after they failed at a BSF test fire facility in Gujarat recently.

www.indiatoday.in