LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Blood+

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
Messages
2,775
Likes
4,335
Country flag
so u r saying 3 brahmos ng cant fit on current su 30 mki😝😂....its better to just leave su 30 mki as it is now, as a small bomber. nd invest that 8 billion dollar in 36-40 more full weapon rafale. su 30 mki will get soon many long standing weapons, its high RCS isnt going to reduce by new upgrade. new upgrade dont make su 30 mki doing SEAD nd DEAD missions in enemy airspace. it will remain second strike fighter, when rafale or mirage 2000 clear enemy SAMS nd radar. su 30 mki can do it even current configuration. it should be equipped by these weapons:-
1:- astra 2 (160 km).
2:- astra 3 (200+ km).
3:- rudram 1 (150-200 km).
4:- rudram 2 (300 km).
5:- rudram 3 (500 km).
6:- brahmos A (450-600 km).
7:- brahmos ng (300 km).
8:- rampage (150-250 km).
if u want it even more capable, than only thing which needed to upgrade in su 30 mki:-
1:- uttam aesa radar.
2:- new infrared sensor.
3:- new RWS.
4:- duel band MAWS.
5:- towed decoys.
6:- digital cockpit.
this upgrade isnt more than 30-40 million dollars per aircraft. think again bro. we r talking about 95 million dollar. a "new" su 30 mk cost in russia is near 55 million nd su 30 mki costed near 60-65 million dollar.
in 8 billion dollars, we should upgrade all 260 su 30 mki...its a 4.5 genration upgrade (coz su 30 mki is 4 genration, due to lacking many 4.5 genration capability). we r not upgrading our su 30 mki in 5 genration.
Projected weight of Brahmos NG is more or less the same as the 3M54E Club-N missile, of which five can be carried by a single Su-27 at a time; so I don't see why an MKI wouldn't be able to carry 3 Brahmos NG (this of course assuming the weight of the finished product does not overshoot).
 
Last edited:

Blood+

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
Messages
2,775
Likes
4,335
Country flag
How do you know 25 years old non composite airframes capable to carry 3x 1.6+T + other A2A ammunition for defence ?
It's perfect time to upgrade Su 30 fleet in phased manner for next 20-25 years.

And RCS can actually be reduced with the usage of Composite material in the airframe.
They are actually trying to keep the weight below 1.5 ton.
 

vin bharat mahan

Kumaoni, Uttarakhand
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2023
Messages
1,151
Likes
3,783
Country flag
How do you know 25 years old non composite airframes capable to carry 3x 1.6+T + other A2A ammunition for defence ?
It's perfect time to upgrade them.

And RCS can actually be reduced with the usage of Composite material in the airframe.
su 30 mki size, engine heat etc is huge..even u use composite material its RCS remain huge with all weapons.
su 30 mki can equip 4-5 brahmos ng nd tejas mark 2 will equip 3 brahmos ng.
brahmos ng weight is 1.5 ton. so 4-5 missile will weight 1500×5= 7500 kg. su 30 mki can carry 8000 kg weapon payload.
or in other formation one brahmos A (3500 kg approx) will equip with 2 brahmos ng (1500×2=3000 kg). total 6500 kg weapon load.
 

NutCracker

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2022
Messages
5,077
Likes
27,242
Country flag
su 30 mki size, engine heat etc is huge..even u use composite material its RCS remain huge with all weapons.
su 30 mki can equip 4-5 brahmos ng nd tejas mark 2 will equip 3 brahmos ng.
brahmos ng weight is 1.5 ton. so 4-5 missile will weight 1500×5= 7500 kg. su 30 mki can carry 8000 kg weapon payload.
or in other formation one brahmos A (3500 kg approx) will equip with 2 brahmos ng (1500×2=3000 kg). total 6500 kg weapon load.
TBH.Metalic airframe of Su30 will be detected on normal radar before appearing on IRST in any case. Irrespective of where IR sensor is tracking it's from front or even chasing the hot tail.

Btw.. aren't you proving my point, that why upgradation of that irreplaceable platform is literally essential.
I'm just guessing where that extra 40-50m$ is going.
 

vin bharat mahan

Kumaoni, Uttarakhand
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2023
Messages
1,151
Likes
3,783
Country flag
How do you know 25 years old non composite airframes capable to carry 3x 1.6+T + other A2A ammunition for defence ?
It's perfect time to upgrade Su 30 fleet in phased manner for next 20-25 years.

And RCS can actually be reduced with the usage of Composite material in the airframe.
KAB 1500 L is 1500 kg precision guided weapon....nd su 30 can carry 3 off them. so its proved su 30 mki can carry atleast 3 brahmos ng (1500 kg) currently.

IMG_20231202_175928.jpeg


IMG_20231202_175905.jpeg


images (2).jpeg
 
  • Like
Reactions: SKC

vin bharat mahan

Kumaoni, Uttarakhand
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2023
Messages
1,151
Likes
3,783
Country flag
TBH.Metalic airframe of Su30 will be detected on normal radar before appearing on IRST in any case. Irrespective of where IR sensor is tracking it's from front or even chasing the hot tail.

Btw.. aren't you proving my point, that why upgradation of that irreplaceable platform is literally essential.
I'm just guessing where that extra 40-50m$ is going.
if u can proof, that extra 40-50 million is going in composite material or stealth coating (which IIT nd drdo developed) nd it will successfully reduce its RCS quite low. that 95 million dollar upgrade isnt make sense too me...thnk u. 🙏
 

NutCracker

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2022
Messages
5,077
Likes
27,242
Country flag
if u can proof, that extra 40-50 million is going in composite material or stealth coating (which IIT nd drdo developed) nd it will successfully reduce its RCS quite low. that 95 million dollar upgrade isnt make sense too me...thnk u. 🙏
I can not proove that extra money is going to that specific modification ,
But I can guarantee that even without stealth coating , just using the composite material in airframe can reduce the RCS because of its lesser reflection coefficient compare to metalic airframe.

Defence Matrix or Alpha defence reading the comment section.
this is the content for Your next video
 

Blood+

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
Messages
2,775
Likes
4,335
Country flag
If SU30's pylon allows then let it be heavier for range and safety. Let the lighter variants be equipped with Rafale or Tejas Mk2
Dude, I don't think they are gonna produce two different versions of the NG for different aircrafts.
 

vin bharat mahan

Kumaoni, Uttarakhand
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2023
Messages
1,151
Likes
3,783
Country flag
I can not proove that extra money is going to that specific modification ,
But I can guarantee that even without stealth coating , just using the composite material in airframe can reduce the RCS because of its lesser reflection coefficient compare to metalic airframe.

Defence Matrix or Alpha defence reading the comment section.
this is the content for Your next video
ohhh...defense matrix nd alpha defense also here?? by which names.
 

NutCracker

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2022
Messages
5,077
Likes
27,242
Country flag
@vin bharat mahan

Quoting from DRDO thread.
View attachment 230759
Some people really believed j16 would be limited to A2G ground role while j11 will be the one doing A2A fights.
Here is j16 with 10 AAMs and a freakin 1700+ trms AESA a composite airframe and RAM coatings.
Better and longer range AAMs.
These will eat the MKIs for breakfast.
Some people really believed j16 would be limited to A2G ground role while j11 will be the one doing A2A fights.
Here is j16 with 10 AAMs and a freakin 1700+ trms AESA a composite airframe and RAM coatings.
Better and longer range AAMs.
These will eat the MKIs for breakfast.


BTW this Deino wumao was being shat upon by porkies on PedoForum.
 

Gyyan

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2022
Messages
1,469
Likes
9,313
Country flag
@vin bharat mahan

Quoting from DRDO thread.





BTW this Deino wumao was being shat upon by porkies on PedoForum.
Nothing to do with the deino guy I am talking about the platform and the weapons j16 is superior to MKI in almost every way and now with even longer AAM these are getting more dangerous everyday meanwhile AMCA remains and decade or more away and mk2 half a decade or more away.
 

NutCracker

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2022
Messages
5,077
Likes
27,242
Country flag
Nothing to do with the deino guy I am talking about the platform and the weapons j16 is superior to MKI in almost every way and now with even longer AAM these are getting more dangerous everyday meanwhile AMCA remains and decade or more away and mk2 half a decade or more away.
That's why I'm under assumption that our 100m $ super sukhoi upgrade include coposite material usage in the airframe, partial or complete.
That was the discussion above few hours back.
 

Gyyan

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2022
Messages
1,469
Likes
9,313
Country flag
That's why I'm under assumption that our 100m $ super sukhoi upgrade include coposite material usage in the airframe, partial or complete.
That was the discussion above few hours back.
How would they add more composite materials to airframe?
Also what's the deal about deino guy being shat upon by pedo forum guys?
 

Blademaster

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Messages
9,353
Likes
27,272
even 1000 MK2 production isnt problem...problem is price. 83 tejas mark 1a cost us 6 billion dollars approx. definitely 100 tejas mark 2 will cost us 7-8 billion dollar. 1000 tejas mark 2 will cost us near 70-80 billion dollars. we can afford maximum 200 tejas mark 2.
And if you spread the cost over 35 years, it comes out to be 2-3 billion dollars a year.
 

FalconSlayers

धर्मो रक्षति रक्षितः
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 14, 2020
Messages
27,441
Likes
189,435
Country flag
even 1000 MK2 production isnt problem...problem is price. 83 tejas mark 1a cost us 6 billion dollars approx. definitely 100 tejas mark 2 will cost us 7-8 billion dollar. 1000 tejas mark 2 will cost us near 70-80 billion dollars. we can afford maximum 200 tejas mark 2.
There is something called economies of scale. Mass production will bring down costs, and create jobs locally which compensates for the cost paid initially. The local industrial capabilities being developed is what is of strategic importance.
 

Azaad

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2022
Messages
6,782
Likes
25,227
Country flag
That's why I'm under assumption that our 100m $ super sukhoi upgrade include coposite material usage in the airframe, partial or complete.
That was the discussion above few hours back.
I think a decent amount of it is royalties to Russia as well to not raise too many objections to the indigenous upgrades & continue with the warranty of the MKI. Maybe some Russian ToT of latest tech too.

I also believe apart from composites , RAM coatings, airframe overhaul & upgrade they'd be going in for a new improved FBW. A Bangalore based vendor is already working on it.

Be that as it may , the tip of the PLAAF spear in the WTC is still the J-20 & if the Rafale is the answer to the J-20s we still have only 36 of them.

At least we're moving somewhat on the MKI front . Hopefully by the end of the decade all 260-272 nos would be brought upto Super Sukhoi standards though I don't believe that would be the case.
 

Blood+

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
Messages
2,775
Likes
4,335
Country flag
Nothing to do with the deino guy I am talking about the platform and the weapons j16 is superior to MKI in almost every way and now with even longer AAM these are getting more dangerous everyday meanwhile AMCA remains and decade or more away and mk2 half a decade or more away.
Dude, relax. Just wait for the Super Sukhoi upgrade to go online and they will surpass the J-16.
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top