LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Flying Dagger

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1. Why would only 25 kn will fit?
The RR engine is expensive. Moreover, we were discussing about an engine with 40kn of thrust. If uprating was cheaper HAL would have gone in for a TD of an uprated engine, rather than an afterburner.
2. A 97kn engine uprated to 116-119kn would be approx a 20-25% bump. But 25 to 40 is 60% bump. Not possible to do it with same engine size. New engine would have to be developed.
Comparing size n thrust of two different engines from Russians and Americans or any two engines is out of context. The discussion is about uprating a 'given' engine from 25 to 40.

Precisely HAL is doing HTFE 25 out of internal accruals as a business decision. Not to invest any further (as of now) on afterburner for HTFE 25 is also a business decision. I presented the fact that they will go on with HTFE 25 and won't invest in afterburner section in my previous posts. Dunno why it's being brought up by you.
No there isn't any line which says 40 kn to be exact. But HAL's engine div. stated they can uprate it to 30 kn (15-20%)

RR engine isn't expensive it's the Honeywell which raised the price.

The point of bringing two diff engines is that despite one is of smaller dimension it produces similar thrust than bigger one.

So only a 25 kn will fit on Jags isn't true you can put a higher thrust engine as long as it fits the airframe dimensions with minimal changes.

Period.
 
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Dessert Storm

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No there isn't any line which says 40 kn to be exact. But HAL's engine div. stated they can uprate it to 30 kn (15-20%)

RR engine isn't expensive it's the Honeywell which raised the price.

The point of bringing two diff engines is that despite one is of smaller dimension it produces similar thrust than bigger one.

So only a 25 kn will fit on Jags isn't true you can put a higher thrust engine as long as it fits the airframe dimensions with minimal changes.

Period.
The discussion started @Chandragupta Maurya saying that DRDO is developing an engine for Jags.
I clarified it about being an HAL venture not DRDO.
HAL venture in context of Jaguar is only HTFE25 with an afterburner, which would provide a thrust of approx 40kn.
Rest of it is digressing from the original discussion.
To summarise:
1. Engine program for Jags is not being run by DRDO.
2. HAL from its own internal accruals has developed a TD of HTFE25 and an afterburner section for HTFE25, which can generate approx 40kn.
3. The only Indian solution that's feasible is (2) above. I mention Indian solution cuz the original post I replied to mentioned DRDO to mean(to me) Made in India.
4. The HTFE 25 cannot be uprated to 40kn of dry thrust without increase in dimensions. That's my assessment cuz of 60% increase in thrust.
5. What RR or Honeywell is offering may be a subject matter of a separate discussion.
Edit- Didn't realise you put a period too. So as u said.
Period.
 

Knowitall

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This is the new "deescalation ho gya?" 😂😭
I'm confused as hell.

Few months ago they said project has been sanctioned I was like finally fir kuch mahine baad firse project has been cleared.

I was like bc chal kya raha hai...


This has been going for 2 years now.
 

Knowitall

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My question still remains unanswered??

Is hal going ahead and producing them knowing orders are confirmed or have they decided to wait.
 

Flying Dagger

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But mk1a have to be developed first by HAL then IAF will get a look at it and production will start.

It is the same airframe with integration of ASRAAM /R73/74/ Derby ER may be Astra from the go.

Elta Aesa Radar

And other improvements like weight etc

Until then mk1 will be produced.

My question still remains unanswered??

Is hal going ahead and producing them knowing orders are confirmed or have they decided to wait.
 

Dessert Storm

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My question still remains unanswered??

Is hal going ahead and producing them knowing orders are confirmed or have they decided to wait.
The order for any number of MK1As has not been placed, as on date.
Are MK1As being manufactured without an order? Yes and No. Certain preparatory and preliminary (but vital) steps are completed before start of 'manufacture'. These steps are in motion. It may be noted that these preparatory and preliminary steps actually are a part of the manufacturing process itself. Attaching an article so as to make sense of what I tried to communicate.
 

patriots

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in terms of time how much can it affect AMCA program??
Bdw the time frame is 10 years ....for the engine and the amca mk2 will fly with this engine ....so well within the time limit .
 

Dessert Storm

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F136 engine was a 60:40 JV between GE and RR. The program apparantly was cancelled in 2012. GE had put in approx $2.5 billion by 2012. Around 1200 hrs of testing was done on the engine.
My thoughts on engine being based on F136:
(1) Even if the programme was cancelled, both GE and RR would have got IP on it.
(2) Why would GE part with IP, given that engines is a core business area for them? They would use the learning in their future projects.
Therefore, Indian JV for the engine may not be based on F136.
 

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