LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

[Rohan Naik]

DRDO was developing a dry engine for Jaguars

Wait another 35 years for DRDO to develop. At times I feel like putting ISRO rocket behind DRDO and do our manned mission today.

 

[Dessert Storm]

What is the thrust of that engine ?

HTFE25= 27kn
HTFE40= Expected 40.
Current Adour on Jag =37 kn

 

[The Maverick]

It's criminal the state of air force .
It's so obvious what is needed
Immediate order for mark 1a and another 40 rafale order as interim order
And then massive investment in mark 2 and Amca as a national. Emergency
China is looking to humiliate us and put us in place and the porkistamis are egging them.to do this .
We need to be on war footing
I hate our typical pacifist babbu mindset
We need leaders with courage and decisive decision makers

 

[Bleh]

Our soon-to-be-Mark1A LSP-8 carrying Derby missiles with no forward control fins!..

 

[mist_consecutive]

Our soon-to-be-Mark1A LSP-8 carrying Derby missiles with no forward control fins!..

Is that even possible? Won't that completely change the flight characteristics of the missile? I think it is just removed for some testing/dummy flight purposes.

After thinking about it, no forward flight control fins will mean no glide capability for Derby (BVRs glide on their initial booster speed for the majority of the flight), and it will probably fall straight to the ground after booster burnout is completed.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

We should have perfected the engine technology and the onboard mission computer rest everything else could have been imported before getting replaced by our own indigenous ones

 

[Bleh]

Is that even possible? Won't that completely change the flight characteristics of the missile? I think it is just removed for some testing/dummy flight purposes.

After thinking about it, no forward flight control fins will mean no glide capability for Derby (BVRs glide on their initial booster speed for the majority of the flight), and it will probably fall straight to the ground after booster burnout is completed.

Possibly they were testing that only.
Maybe they did something like this to Python-5 as @Flying Dagger was wondering how it could be back after having flutter issues.

I doubt about the falling to the ground but the most missiles fly on their initial boost. ASRAAM don't fall to the ground because it don't have forward feels like R-73

 

[mist_consecutive]

Possibly they were testing that only.
Maybe they did something like this to Python-5 as @Flying Dagger was wondering how it could be back after having flutter issues.

I doubt about the falling to the ground but the most missiles fly on their initial boost. ASRAAM don't fall to the ground because it don't have forward feels like R-73

Python-5 is back? That's news to me Any pictures/news source of Python-5 on Indian jet?

But removing fins from Python-5 makes even less sense since Python-5 relies on its large amount of fin area to maneuver rather than thrust vectoring (case for R-73, ASRAAM & AIM-9X). Plucking the fins of Python will just make it a straight arrow.

BVR missiles are generally propelled to very high Mach numbers (> 4) by initial boosters and glide down to their targets. Notice that all BVR missiles have some kind of "wing", or minimal lift surface to keep them in air.

However, derby removing front fins will mean back-fins have to compensate for the torque generated by the frontal part of the missile weight around its center-of-mass. Understand it as its center-of-lift will be way-way away from its center-of-mass and will need to provide enough force to keep the missile balanced. Otherwise, it will become unstable.

WVR missiles just change directions using thrust vectoring.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

DRDO was developing a dry engine for Jaguars

Dry engine can not work except it is of 45 KN power which is an afterburner thrust requirement. This will be a 60pc rise in dry thrust of Jaguar from 27 kn to 45. Naturally, engine size will become bigger whch may not be accommodated in same space. What HAL may be trying is an afterburner variant of HTFE 25 with afterburner power between somewhere 40 to 45 KN.

 

[Bleh]

Python-5 is back? That's news to me Any pictures/news source of Python-5 on Indian jet?

Knaha the vai?..

Search for "Python-5" keyword in this thread... It's somewhere in there.

I meant possible modification of the wing structures, not necessarily complete removal.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

I don’t know why DRDO ADA HAL etc decided to bite more than they can chew
they should have focused on developing an engine only
the 2nd step should have been the Radars
Next mission computer and so on
instead of trying to develop a whole new aircraft and end up importing different systems and subsystems from ourtsude because indigenous ones are not ready
How many of you agree that These public and private sector units should unite and focus on engine development as the first priority

 

[Bleh]

I don’t know why DRDO ADA HAL etc decided to bite more than they can chew
they should have focused on developing an engine only
the 2nd step should have been the Radars
Next mission computer and so on
instead of trying to develop a whole new aircraft and end up importing different systems and subsystems from ourtsude because indigenous ones are not ready
How many of you agree that These public and private sector units should unite and focus on engine development as the first priority

Nah..

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Nah..

We are wasting money on these multiple projects better focus on engines and upgrade the engines in Su30mki , mig29 , Jaguars , Tejas and Rafale(after 10 years ) with our indigenous ones

 

[Bleh]

We are wasting money on these multiple projects better focus on engines and upgrade the engines in Su30mki , mig29 , Jaguars , Tejas and Rafale(after 10 years ) with our indigenous ones

Why not actual tech improvements?..

 

[porky_kicker]

Our soon-to-be-Mark1A LSP-8 carrying Derby missiles with no forward control fins!..

The missile on the left side without fins could be a dummy " generic " missile or best guess a dummy ASRAAM .

I highly doubt derby design configuration has been changed . No OEM will do that because it is going to be very expensive and quite time consuming . It doesn't make any sense. Nor will the python 5 existing design configuration will be changed . At most they will change the pylon position ( increase height ) with respect to wing so the python does not interact adversely with the wind flow of the wing . If it doesn't work python will be discarded.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Why not actual tech improvements?..

That’s what I am saying unfortunately we don’t have funds for everything so we should focus on one thing and move step by step taking small steps
we should follow the Iranian model they are focused on engine development and despite being much smaller than India and resource constrained country with negligible experience in Engine tech (compared to India) they’re close to develop a working turbofan engine

 

[Dessert Storm]

That’s what I am saying unfortunately we don’t have funds for everything so we should focus one thing and move step by step taking small steps
we should follow the Iranian model they are focused on engine development and despite being much smaller than India and resource constrained country with negligible experience in Engine tech (compared to India) they’re close to develop a working turbofan engine

Generating a thrust of?

 

[Bleh]

That’s what I am saying unfortunately we don’t have funds for everything so we should focus on one thing and move step by step taking small steps
we should follow the Iranian model they are focused on engine development and despite being much smaller than India and resource constrained country with negligible experience in Engine tech (compared to India) they’re close to develop a working turbofan engine

So? Why engines instead of AESA?.. Or EW?

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

So? Why engines instead of AESA?.. Or EW?

AESA is almost finished the UTTAM AESA is almost ready btw I am saying we should focus on one thing at a time and Channelise the funds to that particular project not on multiple projects our engine program was poorly funded but we spent billions on upgrading our fleet with new engines

 

[Bleh]

...btw I am saying we should focus on one thing at a time and Channelise the funds to that particular project not on multiple projects.

I see. No funds are not alternative to timeline.