Know Your 'Rafale'

[Godless-Kafir]

Something tells me Reliance into the foray is bad.Those brothers are plain thugs.If the TATA's had been in the foray it would have been a different matter

Your right, Indias huge size as a market for telecom and refineries is what is keeping Reliance afloat. They are a mass market based industry, so its not clear how they may run it if they took up specialist industries like aircrafts because it requires quality not mass quantity like cheap telecom and oil.

The flip side is because they are private they can hire the best brains in the world for management, like Richard Branson said all you have to do is start a industry and hand it over to the most capable people and they will run it for you. That is something DRDO or HAL can never do, they are socialist based laggards who rely on the government and not on talent.

 

[sayareakd]

yeah ambani is smart guy, he can buy weapons from China and use it against them.

 

[anoop_mig25]

isn`t tata has tie-up with an american firm i donot recall the name . i thibk its with LM so i think reliance was default choice for dasault.LM even flewed Ratan tata on f-16 durning one of airshows

 

[H.A.]

Oh my god Reliance entering the defence market is a shockingly great news, however i don't feel right about this its probably only because of timing. I mean announcing the deal within a week of the government announcing the winner means either Mukesh Ambani (MA) was in negotiation with Rafale from before probably sniffed out the result of the tender or maybe MA was in talks with both EF and RAFALE to represent the winner or maybe he was the reason Rafale won, but then it can be anything.

My only question is that how can such a BIG deal be finalised within a week of the announcement of the winner.

 

[Daredevil]

I think all the competitors were in talks with one or the other Indian private companies (Like TATA, Mahindra, Reliance etc) to show that they will comply with off-set clauses and Technology transfer through collaboration with Indian companies because foreign companies cannot have their own companies in India because the foreign players investment in defense companies is capped at 24% I guess.

 

[H.A.]

I think all the competitors were in talks with one or the other Indian private companies (Like TATA, Mahindra, Reliance etc) to show that they will comply with off-set clauses and Technology transfer through collaboration with Indian companies because foreign companies cannot have their own companies in India because the foreign players investment in defense companies is capped at 24% I guess.

Then why the choice of Reliance, I am aware of TATA & MAHINDRA being in the defence industry however I never heard about Reliance in this area. Isn't there any experience clause in the agreement?

 

[sayareakd]

isn`t tata has tie-up with an american firm i donot recall the name . i thibk its with LM so i think reliance was default choice for dasault.LM even flewed Ratan tata on f-16 durning one of airshows

TATA had F18 tie up MRCA.

 

[Param]

Using such a diversified, and well run company as Reliance will make it easy to distribute offsets and absorb technologies. Staying away from India's public sector is wise.

Now I want MMRCA cancelled.

 

[Godless-Kafir]

Atleast Mahindra and TATA have some background in Aviation. What the hell does Mukesh know about aeroplain?

 

[sayareakd]

If Ambani had his way all the planes, 80 of MRCA, 40 of SFC and 40 of navy MRCA would go for rafale.

that is 160 a part from 126, just think about more then $20 billion of work and profit for him.

 

[H.A.]

+1 to Param, suddenly i am feeling sick about MMRCA. The question is why reliance it could be any of the more experienced players in the defese field. Its just about not how much investment Reliance can make it should be how good the quality of workmanship can the company deliver.

 

[Param]

Atleast Mahindra and TATA have some background in Aviation. What the hell does Mukesh know about aeroplain?

He has the moolah

 

[sayareakd]

Atleast Mahindra and TATA have some background in Aviation. What the hell does Mukesh know about aeroplain?

he owns gulfstream ...................................................

 

[sayareakd]

Now I want MMRCA cancelled.

no one has touched him in 2G what makes you think he will allow anyone to do this.

 

[Param]

If Ambani had his way all the planes, 80 of MRCA, 40 of SFC and 40 of navy MRCA would go for rafale.

that is 160 a part from 126, just think about more then $20 billion of work and profit for him.

I really want the Americans to do something and screw this deal some how.

I never liked American machines but Now,I would be happier with India buying F16 and LM partnership with TATA.

 

[pmaitra]

Atleast Mahindra and TATA have some background in Aviation. What the hell does Mukesh know about aeroplain?

TATA - background in running an airline is not the same as background in designing and building aeroplanes.
Mahindra - did not know they had a background in aviation. Any citations?

 

[H.A.]

call in Reinforcements call in Swamy and Anna Hazare....

 

[Param]

no one has touched him in 2G what makes you think he will allow anyone to do this.

There were no external forces in 2 G, were there?

 

[sayareakd]

France govt has given Guarantee for substantial TOT for rafale so even if it is Reliance we should not worry

 

[Godless-Kafir]

France Cuts Rafale Price To Win Brazil Deal: Paper | Defense News | defensenews.com

France initially asked for $338m per plane in Brazil, revising to $283m (after making heavy cut backs) per plane over 30 years.
That's $35.7b in terms of Indian size procurement, with similar offsets and ToT.

Armand, can you explain how Dassault manged to cut to $158m per plane over lifetime (if Dassault's bid is $20b) in India?
(you can send me PM is you don't wanna EF economists see that)
Is it the vision and glossy display spread over mere 20 pages, unlike EF's boring and over-detailed 150 pages one, that wins the deal?

The very same day India announced MMRCA deal the Brazilian Defense minister was on the phone with the Indian Defense ministry over suggestions and insights into the deal. It was rumored that Indian defence minister suggested the Dassult to his brazalian counter part. Today i read Brazil has bought Dassult fighter to!!!

Moral of the story. Britain bad for EU keep the pigs out.