Know Your 'Rafale'

[Immanuel]

The sole real 5th gen is F22.

LM said itself that a 5th gen must have : stealth/super cruise/high agility (on par with F16)/sensor fusion.
And LM add : affordable in the F35 case (but it was in 2001... prehistoric date)

Rafale is short on VLO (only LO).
F35 is short on agility and supercruise. Even sensor fusion is not clear so far, but it will be solved.

What is the nearer of a 5th gen according to the LM definition ????

****
Kaveri 9, 10. Why not 15? Truth is that all was stalling until Safran Help. Just facts.

****
SU35 better stealth than Rafale? Of course you have a source.

You are 'Fake News'

Nobody begged for Safran help on Kaveri, if anything the begging occurred on the French side once the first MRCA process was cancelled

 

[Jackd]

Since Meteor is pretty expensive, can IAF afford to test-fire some of them during exercises like Gagan Shakti?

 

[Advaidhya Tiwari]

Since Meteor is pretty expensive, can IAF afford to test-fire some of them during exercises like Gagan Shakti?

Meteor can be fired only by rafales and nothing will be inducted without test fire. Even meteor has to be tested to check how it works. India will test as well as study meteor to gain knowledge out of it.

 

[Armand2REP]

There is a reason why we call you 'fake news'

MKI's availability had already crossed 60% in Jan 2017. By now it should be holding steady at 75%.

Talk about your Fake News...

The Rafales that have an operational range one and a half times of our current day best fighters, the Sukhoi 30 MKI. Also, the manufacturer Dassault has assured that at all times, 75% of the Rafale fleet would be kept airworthy. This compares well with our Sukhois which have never crossed the 60% serviceability mark.

https://www.timesnownews.com/india/...gress-bjp-upa-nda-indian-air-force-iaf/279141

Check the date on that, Sep 03, 2018

 

[Kchontha]

Astra will be better than meteor if the new engine development is successful.

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[BON PLAN]

But once it flies, it will be enough for all needs. By the way, the current design of turbofan was in 2006. Earlier, the requirement was for 78kN engine, similar to F404 and that has been reached. So, again wrong information.

YOU are miss informed !
The full indian Kaveri suffer from vibrations and noise perturbations in full reheat, and failed in high altitude. That is why it fill not plane so far.
This is the truth, and not a meli melo of gossips.

 

[BON PLAN]

You don't know that by not materialising mmrca1 DA/French has lost a wonderful military aviation business opportunities with an economically emerging nation like India, mmrca1 couldn't be materialised more because of French/DA bad bussinesmanship rather than India's. Now you have to do similar business obligations with a reduce quantity of product numbering 36 only. Moreover a few of your product may be added provided if you obliged to our demands. That is the sign of bad businessmanship your part not of the customer.
As far as other options are concerns, it seems like you have forgotten other contenders of mmrca1, more numbers of the mki, tejas mk2/MCA, amca, f16 etc or 'other options' phrase could be the dummy to lure the OEMs to fall in the lines. Lol!

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Absolutely not.
I think the opportunity was missed by indian side. Indian top brass put a unbearable pressure on Dassault, which couldn't accept the HAL exigences. The risks were far too high.

- I'm sure the final Indian Rafale number will be more than 126 at the end.
- Under MMRCA1 only 18 was to be delivered from France (to be clear : it's the thing that interest DA the more. Giving you a line and ToT is to be avoid the more possible by ANY fighter supplier. It's just the reality). Now it is no less than 36, and probably a little bit more (48? and MMII to follow)
- MMRCA2 will be won by Rafale, for a lot of reasons. And then you will see the mastery of Dassault because after MMRCA2 and the MII installed thanks to the co enterprise, the 57 for indian navy will also be won by DA...

Just see how Dassault is cool and relax, even when the Modi opposition say all but mainly anything.
The counter attack came from the IAF. Cool, Relax, Dassault is just following its strategy from the beginning...

 

[BON PLAN]

So are you telling India will ever make Rafale 100% in India? Give me a break

NO. I just answer the question about Su30.

You are some to be very tolerant with the lazy and short Su30 Russian TOT, but are hard with Rafale. In other words You are tolerant and blind with the past and present but hard with the future. Just surprising.

 

[Jackd]

Absolutely not.
I think the opportunity was missed by indian side. Indian top brass put a unbearable pressure on Dassault, which couldn't accept the HAL exigences. The risks were far too high.

- I'm sure the final Indian Rafale number will be more than 126 at the end.
- Under MMRCA1 only 18 was to be delivered from France (to be clear : it's the thing that interest DA the more. Giving you a line and ToT is to be avoid the more possible by ANY fighter supplier. It's just the reality). Now it is no less than 36, and probably a little bit more (48? and MMII to follow)
- MMRCA2 will be won by Rafale, for a lot of reasons. And then you will see the mastery of Dassault because after MMRCA2 and the MII installed thanks to the co enterprise, the 57 for indian navy will also be won by DA...

Just see how Dassault is cool and relax, even when the Modi opposition say all but mainly anything.
The counter attack came from the IAF. Cool, Relax, Dassault is just following its strategy from the beginning...

I am skeptical about DA receiving the IN contract, as the Rafale isn't geared towards taking off from a ski-jump carrier as well as not having foldable wings.

 

[BON PLAN]

By now it should be holding steady at 75%.

"it should"... Source please?

But i'm afraid it's just a wet dream. Or is it called a fake news?


=> https://www.timesnownews.com/india/...gress-bjp-upa-nda-indian-air-force-iaf/279141

"...This compares well with our Sukhois which have never crossed the 60% serviceability mark."

excuse me but.... in the a** my friend !!!!

 

[BON PLAN]

Astra will be better than meteor if the new engine development is successful.

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk

Better and better !
Are you so disapointed to say such idioties ?

Astra 21, in 2047, will maybe be better than 2018' Meteor.

as said in France : "if my aunt had some (balls) we would call her uncle".

 

[BON PLAN]

I am skeptical about DA receiving the IN contract, as the Rafale isn't geared towards taking off from a ski-jump carrier as well as not having foldable wings.

Is the SH18 able to take off now from a ski jump? No évidence.

Rafale is a mature plane, perfectly known by DA. If they say it's possible, that means it is possible.
Anyway a ski jump field test will occur in 2019 with SH18 and with Rafale.

Folding wings : no, but Rafale will have removable wings tips (10 minutes to remove, 15 minutes to put). Enough for the indian carrier.

 

[Jackd]

Is the SH18 able to take off now from a ski jump? No évidence.

Rafale is a mature plane, perfectly known by DA. If they say it's possible, that means it is possible.
Anyway a ski jump field test will occur in 2019 with SH18 and with Rafale.

Folding wings : no, but Rafale will have removable wings tips (10 minutes to remove, 15 minutes to put). Enough for the indian carrier.

I can say the same for F-18 and it is even more mature than the Rafale. Boeing has done a computer simulation to show that F-18 can take off from a ski-jump carrier and 'if they say it is possible, then it is possible'. Plus, there is no hassle of removing wing tips as you can just fold the wings.

Anyways, let's wait for 2019 tests.

 

[proud_indian]

YOU are miss informed !
The full indian Kaveri suffer from vibrations and noise perturbations in full reheat, and failed in high altitude. That is why it fill not plane so far.
This is the truth, and not a meli melo of gossips.

not anymore

Ok, the GTRE folks I spoke to say that the six main design issues with the Kaveri engine have mostly been solved now, either in-house or with foreign inputs. Apparently, screech is not an issue anymore.

 

[Advaidhya Tiwari]

NO. I just answer the question about Su30.

You are some to be very tolerant with the lazy and short Su30 Russian TOT, but are hard with Rafale. In other words You are tolerant and blind with the past and present but hard with the future. Just surprising.

Russia has given full engine ToT. Let France give engine ToT first. Then we can see how much we will also tolerate rafale

 

[BON PLAN]

I can say the same for F-18 and it is even more mature than the Rafale. Boeing has done a computer simulation to show that F-18 can take off from a ski-jump carrier and 'if they say it is possible, then it is possible'. Plus, there is no hassle of removing wing tips as you can just fold the wings.

Anyways, let's wait for 2019 tests.

You're right.
If Boeing is able to make a computer simulation, so is DA (Don't remember that the DA "sister" made Catia !). Dassault never made promises it don't want or can't kept (MMRCA1 is a perfect exemple)

Folding wings/ removable fins.... It's probably not the real problem : Just look at the SH18 lenght....18.3m.... The folding wing is one thing, but there is no folding nose.

 

[BON PLAN]

not anymore

Ok, the GTRE folks I spoke to say that the six main design issues with the Kaveri engine have mostly been solved now, either in-house or with foreign inputs. Apparently, screech is not an issue anymore.

Very nice news .

 

[BON PLAN]

Russia has given full engine ToT. Let France give engine ToT first. Then we can see how much we will also tolerate rafale

India made all the AL31F blades? India made all the FADEC?

Rafale is already there. Time of tolerance is over. And IAF like it and will love it.

 

[Kchontha]

Better and better !
Are you so disapointed to say such idioties ?

Astra 21, in 2047, will maybe be better than 2018' Meteor.

as said in France : "if my aunt had some (balls) we would call her uncle".

Dude! don't you know indian missile development is very rapid. How dare you bad-mouthed a nation's strategic program! Who the hell do you think you are?

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[Advaidhya Tiwari]

India made all the AL31F blades? India made all the FADEC?

Rafale is already there. Time of tolerance is over. And IAF like it and will love it.

Yes, India makes all the blade and has FADEC codes. 100% indigenous production of Al31FP/

Let us see how much France offers for Rafale