Kaveri Engine

[darshan978]

Sukhoi 30 to be turned into super sonic test bed for testing jet engines like Kaveri, K9, K10...

CAN BE .

not TO BE.

 

[wraith96]

Can the kaveri be converted into a high bypass engine for commercial planes or business jets? can't we the design an aircraft for AEWCS and marine time patrol purposes baSd on that engine...like Japan has done with their kawasaki P1 by converting XF5-1 low by pass to XF7 engine.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Can the kaveri be converted into a high bypass engine for commercial planes or business jets? can't we the design an aircraft for AEWCS and marine time patrol purposes baSd on that engine...like Japan has done with their kawasaki P1 by converting XF5-1 low by pass to XF7 engine.View attachment 46653View attachment 46654

I personally think designing and development of strategic lifter or transportation aircraft will be difficult for now. And keep in mind that endurance level of the engines which are used in these types of aircraft should be very high that's why Chinese till now are using Soloviev D-30 in Y-20 aircraft.

BUt i think we can build medium weight transport aircraft and business aircraft with HAL build HTFE-25.

 

[rudresh]

View attachment 46063


Indigenously developed and integrated with the help of foreign collaborator M/s International centre for Electron beam technologies, Kiev, Ukraine

Specifications

Depending on requirements, Electron Beam Physical Vapour unit has been fitted with traditional evaporators (water-cooled crucibles with vertical shafts for displacement of evaporation ingots). The load chamber has the capability of cleaning of the job surfaces and fixing of jobs before moving into the working chamber. Electron beam guns are fitted with a two-stage system of differential high-vacuum pumping, allowing implementation of the evaporation process, it has capabilities with purging of various gases into the working chamber.

Details

A high energy electron beam physical vapour deposition (EBPVD) coating process which allows high deposition rates, precise composition and microstructural control capable of depositing thermal barrier coatings with MCrAlY as a bondcoat and high temperature oxidation resistant coatings that are used on gas turbine blades of aero-engine and power generating industries. The facility is capable of depositing coating of thickness ranging from a micron to a few mm, and also coatings with graded structure and properties.


More details about the system

A lot of stuff is getting online as how it is being made may not be good

 

[rudresh]

I personally think designing and development of strategic lifter or transportation aircraft will be difficult for now. And keep in mind that endurance level of the engines which are used in these types of aircraft should be very high that's why Chinese till now are using Soloviev D-30 in Y-20 aircraft.

BUt i think we can build medium weight transport aircraft and business aircraft with HAL build HTFE-25.

India lost a golden chance of letting an aeroengine manufacturing company without making any firm desition. At least a private company like bharat forge or tata should have cashed in this great opportunity.

 

[rudresh]

India lost a golden chance of letting an aeroengine manufacturing company without making any firm desition. At least a private company like bharat forge or tata should have cashed in this great opportunity.

India lost a golden chance of letting an aeroengine manufacturing company without making any firm desition when we had good money, geo political favoriteness at hand.India is an expert at loosing many once in lifetime chances like that an we spend in unwanted areas where there is no requirement at all I.e misplaced priorities. At least a private company like bharat forge or tata should have cashed in this great opportunity.Cunning Chinese are very adept at utilizing such situations to the most. I think a similar agreement as Chinese with the company would have given India a very good chance to get a an overall design, manufacture, production ideas wherein further we could have minimized a lot of production glitches in our current Indian engines. We could have got ready made working engines for ships or Russian origin planes etc....

 

[wraith96]

India lost a golden chance of letting an aeroengine manufacturing company without making any firm desition when we had good money, geo political favoriteness at hand.India is an expert at loosing many once in lifetime chances like that an we spend in unwanted areas where there is no requirement at all I.e misplaced priorities. At least a private company like bharat forge or tata should have cashed in this great opportunity.Cunning Chinese are very adept at utilizing such situations to the most. I think a similar agreement as Chinese with the company would have given India a very good chance to get a an overall design, manufacture, production ideas wherein further we could have minimized a lot of production glitches in our current Indian engines. We could have got ready made working engines for ships or Russian origin planes etc....

Recently Bombardier sold its Q400 production line... couldn't one of our pvt players bought it and bring tye production line to india.

 

[rudresh]

I Don't think what they will do. They should not get screwed this time. They should have some sense and think how saras with such difficulty came out this long torturous way (at one time all the lobbyist's were trying to close it). A similar program will take not less than minimum 10 years with all the testing etc etc....if they f**k up this time when they can get something like this @1.1 billion they are definitely retards.
What we got for rafale (as a part of investment)is assembling of the falcon jet that too assembling done by French company adani is just looking financial matters for around 9 billion $ without manufacturing.
Imagine if we had that Ukraine company already with us now.
A Ready made engine which is production ready and an air frame to mate with it.

we want tanker,engine test bed,civilian air liner, vvip plane etc ....and we pay for mispriority like apache 1billion$ though we have lch ready and waiting for orders.... This is shame ....

 

[rudresh]

OK let's come to kaveri engine always I thought something is missing thinking about kaveri since
M88 = 50/75
Ej 200= 60/90

The above 2 engines has half of the wet thrust added during the use of afterburner to make overall thrust.

But kaveri k9= 51/82. Like above examples k9 has to be 51/76.

I just got the answer from BRF matiyas post that is due to fan design (they have made fan section and bipass in such a way as to provide better dry thrust) can some gurus elaborate
can the new fan design can be incorporated into kaveri as such?

What will be its effect on the thrust of the current kaveri (kaveri with afterburner)?

 

[Bajirao]

Our active research on higher thrust engine may have already started.govt. sanctioned a project called ' high efficiency high temp. turbine' in 2017....drdo chief reddy in many interview also mentioned higher thrust aero engine as a active project

 

[Karthi]

India lost a golden chance of letting an aeroengine manufacturing company without making any firm desition when we had good money, geo political favoriteness at hand.India is an expert at loosing many once in lifetime chances like that an we spend in unwanted areas where there is no requirement at all I.e misplaced priorities. At least a private company like bharat forge or tata should have cashed in this great opportunity.Cunning Chinese are very adept at utilizing such situations to the most. I think a similar agreement as Chinese with the company would have given India a very good chance to get a an overall design, manufacture, production ideas wherein further we could have minimized a lot of production glitches in our current Indian engines. We could have got ready made working engines for ships or Russian origin planes etc....

Luckily US intervened still China got 40 percentage shares . Our Babus are idiots

 

[Alok Arya]

Our active research on higher thrust engine may have already started.govt. sanctioned a project called ' high efficiency high temp. turbine' in 2017....drdo chief reddy in many interview also mentioned higher thrust aero engine as a active project
Can you provide a link?
Thanks in advance.

 

[lcafanboy]

 

[rudresh]

The T/W ratio of Kavery is only about 6.0 ,about one generation behind F110 , AL31 and WS10... it is reasonable that Kavery is the tech of 1970s,about 40 years behind Yankees.

Do check the facts before writing. Kaveri engine thrust to weight ratio is 7.8 and not 6.0.
Thrust of kaveri is not 65kn it is 78kn-81kn.

 

[tsunami]

Do check the facts before writing. Kaveri engine thrust to weight ratio is 7.8 and not 6.0.
Thrust of kaveri is not 65kn it is 78kn-81kn.

If kaveri's weight is above 1200 kg then surely it's T/W is not above 7. I don't know how it is quoted to be 7.8, with just 81kn maximum thrust it's weight should be 1050 KGs approx to have T/W of 7.8.

 

[Suryavanshi]

The T/W ratio of Kavery is only about 6.0 ,about one generation behind F110 , AL31 and WS10... it is reasonable that Kavery is the tech of 1970s,about 40 years behind Yankees.

Do check the facts before writing. Kaveri engine thrust to weight ratio is 7.8 and not 6.0.
Thrust of kaveri is not 65kn it is 78kn-81kn.

This isn't bad by all means.
This is our first trial at making engine.
US has fielded more than 1000 engines betweens the invention of Planes and Current year.
They have massive IP, infra, experts in metallurgy and also more than anything a well established funding and Procurement structure.
So it kind of Baffles me that we are comparing ourselves to the US. We are level 1 noob they are Level 100 pro.

Pump some more money into Kaveri and it will start giving results.

 

[Karthi]

Rare Earth Metals limited developed Nano-structured Bi-layer YSZ-LZ Thermal Barrier Coating for Jet Engines.

Synthesis of high purity Nano-structured TBC materials, Lanthanum Zirconate and YSZ. They were prepared via wet chemical routes, starting from the indigenous source minerals such as zircon and monazite available in the beach sand. This is first time that the results of TBC materials synthesis from these base minerals, their purification and a high end application being presented comprehensively. Their characterisation and thermal barrier application on aeroengine components have been presented. The total oxide impurities being critical to the life of the coating, could be controlled within 0.03 per cent by weight. On comparison with other powders it was found that the indigenously synthesised YSZ powder had practically 100 per cent tetragonal prime phase and no monoclinic phase; whereas others had significant amounts of monoclinic phases present in them. Both YSZ and LZ powders were sinter agglomerated at 850 °C to preclude the possibility of any contamination and sieved. APS process was used to realise nano-structured bi-layer coating on the exhaust nozzle parts of an aeroengine. The components were subjected to rapid thermal transients during long accelerated endurance testing, equivalent to 1000 h of engine operations. The coatings also withstood the gas erosion of supersonic combustion products, vibratory loads of 4 g and more than 30000 nozzle actuations similar to aircraft maneuver


Currently 7-8 wt% Yttria stabilised Zirconia, with the maximum surface temperature capability of about 1200 °C is the industry standard for TBC material and has proved its worth for almost four decades. At higher temperatures, degradation of the coating takes place and changes in microstructure as well as mechanical properties result in reduced strain tolerance and a decrease in thermal fatigue life of the coating. On the other hand, Lanthanum Zirconate (LZ), with general formula A2B2O7 (pyrochlore structure), possesses attractive intrinsic properties such as higher thermal and phase stability (close to 2000 °C), lower sintering tendency and thermal conductivity (k) compared to YSZ. Thus LZ has received significant attention in recent times. Among the pyrochlores, La2Zr2O7 (LZ) seems to have great potential as a TBC material due to its excellent bulk properties vis-a-vis YSZ. But it has lower coefficient of thermal expansion and slightly higher specific gravity compared to YSZ. Though nano LZ can mitigate the problem to a certain extent, it cannot be applied directly on the MCrAlY bond coat. Therefore LZ is applied as a top coat material over YSZ for enhanced coating life. A nano-structured bi-layer is also expected to reflect certain amount of radiations thus providing a more effective TBC. This is significant since in the absence of cooling or heat losses the substrate temperature equals that of the environment eventually.


LZ Advantages

The RE pyrochlores (Re2Zr2O7, Re = La, Gd) are very stable materials even under a reducing atmosphere (APS coating atmosphere for example) and are potential candidates for TBC applications. The structure of ‘La’ and ‘Gd’ Zirconates remain stable under reducing atmosphere of Ar(g)/3%H2(g) at 1400 °C. It is reported that the formation and phase stability of Re23+ Zr24+ O72- pyrochlores can be attributed to the radius ratio of ions i.e. rc= r3+Re /r4+Zr. For rc= 1.46–1.78 at standard conditions, pyrochlore structure remains stable whereas fluorite is stable when rc is less than 1.46. LZ, with an rc= 1.61, can also form at a relatively low temperature5. The zirconates with pyrochlore structure, are predominantly cubic and ionic, allow variety of atomic substitutions at the A, B and O sites when the ionic radius and charge neutrality conditions are met. Double-layer coating with La2Zr2O7 as top coat was adopted since it is reported that such a bi-layer coating enhanced the temperature capability of the coating by >100K. LZ also has good chemical compatibility with YSZ at least upto 1250 oC. Due to low sintering tendency, the nano-grains could be observed in the coating after thermal cycling. LZ remains stable in a large La/Zr molar ratio range, from 0.87 to 1.15 and remains so even when the La2O3 composition changes ±10 per cent from the stoichiometry. Large amounts of metastable fluorite phase forms during rapid solidification, typical of plasma spray conditions. This fluorite transforms to pyrochlore. This is not critical, since no significant volume change is associated. But, due to the considerably higher vapor pressure of La2O3 compared to ZrO2, the processing of LZ by APS is challenging, resulting in non-stoichiometric coatings. The torch power exerts major influence on the coating stoichiometry. If the gun is operated with hydrogen as secondary plasma gas, as in the present case, the stoichiometry is strongly affected and is well reflected by the lattice parameter. ‘La’ depletion leads to a decrease of the lattice parameter.


Nano structured high purity grade YSZ and LZ could be prepared from beach sand containing monazite and zircon following wet chemical route i.e. co-precipitation method. The sinter-agglomerated powder could be successfully sprayed using APS and a bi-layer TBC was realised. The coating withstood the rigour of aero-engine endurance test. The following conclusions are made.

(a) Agglomeration of nano powders depends on the process, chemicals used and the degree of washing done during powder preparation.

(b) The adopted process could ensure very low level of oxide impurities (<0.03 %) which is beneficial to coating stability and life. The present process can be scaled up for bulk production.


(c) Nano structure could be retained after plasma spraying.

(d) Fluorite-pyrochlore transition does not affect coating integrity.


(e) LZ has good long term physico-chemical compatibility with YSZ. The bi-layer coating offers higher thermal insulation and is quite durable.


Early 2019 Report


In picture, comparative Quality of the improved coating on the two flaps ,

 

[Karthi]

This is how Thermal Barrier Coatings on Turbine Blade look like

 

[Kchontha]

Is India's 110kn turbofan engine for amca be a verson of item 30? Just a naive thought....

 

[Karthi]

A three stage axial flow compressor design and CFD analysis have been carried out at NAL which is mainly aligned with small gas turbine (SGT) applications. At design speed, PR of 2.32 and efficiency of 81.2 % is achieved with respect to targeted value. Detailed flow physics is investigated to analyze the interaction of all the stages together at CP, DP and NS conditions. During the simulation it was observed that convergence of the solution was very difficult at all three operating speeds for low pressure ratios with high fluctuations in the fluxes. This was mainly due to the rear stages operating at far off design conditions. SV is formed in the R1 and R2 due to interaction of TLV and upward drifting flow acted by centrifugal force. SV is found to be axially more dominant at DP and radially at NS. Unlike R1 and R2, R3 does not have upward moving flow due to high aspect ratio passage having lower centrifugal force being acted on the fluid particles. Designed multistage compressor under predict the pressure ratio and efficiency marginally. There is a need to fine tune the design and CFD aspects in future course of action.

3D model of the compressor stage

Stator streamlines at NS

Rotor streamlines at NS