Is the tank becoming obsolete?

Khagesh

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Tank in a trench!

Does not sound like a good idea with the proliferation of the top attack missiles and 155 mm Smart EFP?
 

Ray

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Every military unit in the defense got its sector of fire.
A tank in a trench, almost invulnerable target.
Why have a huge tank in a trench when there are better equipment to do so?

Use missiles. They are smaller and equally effective and with more range.
 

Akim

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Tank in a trench!

Does not sound like a good idea with the proliferation of the top attack missiles and 155 mm Smart EFP?

You read a lot of fiction? How are you to target? Using drones? They shot down at the earliest.
 

Akim

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Why have a huge tank in a trench when there are better equipment to do so?

Use missiles. They are smaller and equally effective and with more range.
Nobody refuses other types of fire damage. However. no one except tanks will not stand the fire of artillery and mass of fragments.
 

Ray

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Nobody refuses other types of fire damage. However. no one except tanks will not stand the fire of artillery and mass of fragments.
Heard of Cluster bombs? CBU 105 cluster bomb?

Maybe this video will allow your to realise its effect.


Artillery's aim against armor is to force them to button up and to eliminate tank-riders (who can basically be treated as if they were standing). Actual kills would be rare unless the target was immobile and precision fire could be used..
http://www.poeland.com/tanks/artillery/targets.html

Static is immobile.

Proves my point that manoeuvring with speed and thus quick movement builds in the inherent protection.
 
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Akim

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Heard of Cluster bombs? CBU 105 cluster bomb?

Maybe this video will allow your to realise its effect.


Artillery's aim against armor is to force them to button up and to eliminate tank-riders (who can basically be treated as if they were standing). Actual kills would be rare unless the target was immobile and precision fire could be used..
WWII Artillery Notes - Targets

Static is immobile.

Proves my point that manoeuvring with speed and thus quick movement builds in the inherent protection.
Modern battlefield so rich air-defense systems, fighter aircraft and tactical missiles are less likely to survive than the tank. The destruction of the tank using howitzers more appropriate.
 
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Ray

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Modern battlefield so rich air-defense systems, fighter aircraft and tactical missiles are less likely to survive than the tank. The destruction of the tank using howitzers more appropriate.
Great.

If AD is so effective, then by that suggestion we should do away with the Air Force, since they are redundant, right?

Heard of ECM and ECCM, stealth bombers and so on?
 

Khagesh

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You read a lot of fiction? How are you to target? Using drones? They shot down at the earliest.
And you do not read at all.

Are all europeans like yourself?


Step by step procedure for dummies, to using an EFP Cargo shell [enlarged to make sure you get it. And no your drone hunting air defences won't be of any use against something like this]

 

Akim

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Great.

If AD is so effective, then by that suggestion we should do away with the Air Force, since they are redundant, right?

Heard of ECM and ECCM, stealth bombers and so on?
Everything should be. The aircraft can also evade air defenses. However, it is not a panacea In the war inevitable loss.
 

Akim

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And you do not read at all.

Are all europeans like yourself?


Step by step procedure for dummies, to using an EFP Cargo shell [enlarged to make sure you get it. And no your drone hunting air defences won't be of any use against something like this]


The tanks began to protect the upper projection armor with ERA's new generation and Active protection system.
 
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Khagesh

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Even Eras will not matter. Currently the weapons designers designed these skeets for 130 mm penetration because that is what they thought is necessary and sufficient. There is enough understanding of explosive chemistry available today to make it work at least 20%-50% better without changing skeet dimensions. Then there is no reason why they cannot reduce the number of skeets from 2 to just 1. The precision achieved is already enough to make sure >90% of the skeets hit the targets top attack. And the tank is expensive enough to justify a single skeet larger cargo.

So whatever the tank men do they are threatened.

@Ray sir, isn't it strange that with so many weapons and decoys and sensors and armours we still need a human to stand ground and stake claim. The man still remains the winner (or loser).
 
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Ray

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Even Eras will not matter. Currently the weapons designers designed these skeets for 130 mm penetration because that is what they thought is necessary and sufficient. There is enough understanding of explosive chemistry available today to make it work at least 20%-50% better without changing skeet dimensions. Then there is no reason why they cannot reduce the number of skeets from 2 to just 1. The precision achieved is already enough to make sure >90% of the skeets hit the targets top attack. And the tank is expensive enough to justify a single skeet larger cargo.

So whatever the tank men do they are threatened.

@Ray sir, isn't it strange that with so many weapons and decoys and sensors and armours we still need a human to stand ground and stake claim. The man still remains the winner (or loser).
"When it was the victory, the cavalier claimed it outright, the gunner boasted of his calibre but the infantryman stood silent with victory at his feet."
Field Marshal Wavell.
 
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Ray

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Everything should be. The aircraft can also evade air defenses. However, it is not a panacea In the war inevitable loss.
Nothing is perfect.

Victory and Defeat is all a game of Luck and Chance.

Read Military History.
 

Akim

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Nothing is perfect.

Victory and Defeat is all a game of Luck and Chance.

Read Military History.
Indian troops have such ammunition? Or Paks? My answer is no. But these armies have tanks. The threat is real, and not hypothetical
 

pmaitra

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"When it was the victory, the cavalier claimed it outright, the gunner boasted of his calibre but the infantryman stood silent with victory at his feet."
Field Marshal Wavell.
There is no victory without the infantryman. Air and naval power only act as auxiliaries. This is true even today.
 

Ray

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There is no victory without the infantryman. Air and naval power only act as auxiliaries. This is true even today.
Actually, to be fair, all contribute equally well.

However, victory is still measure in areas captured and held. That is only by having boots on the ground. The Infantry provides that with other assisting them.

Since Infantry is the arm in direct confrontation, the are called PBIs or Poor Bloody Infantrymen.
 

pmaitra

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Actually, to be fair, all contribute equally well.

However, victory is still measure in areas captured and held. That is only by having boots on the ground. The Infantry provides that with other assisting them.

Since Infantry is the arm in direct confrontation, the are called PBIs or Poor Bloody Infantrymen.
Sir, Russian military doctrine might stress a bit more on the land forces. It assumes the possibility that there would be no air power in war. I do agree that all arms of the military can contribute in varying degrees depending upon the situation.
 

Ray

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Cluster munitions are different. Video homing elements with cumulative effect or the effect of "explosively formed penetrator (EFP)". This ammunition is new generation.
If you are unaware as to what is happening around the world, why don't you research for the same on your own? Must I hand feed you?

But never mind. Here it is for you.

Air Weapons: Little Robots Over India

India is buying 510 CBU-105 sensor fuzed weapons. Average cost is $735,000 each (including spares, maintenance gear, some training equipment and technical support.) First used during the 2003 Iraq war, the CBU-105 Sensor Fuzed Weapon is a cluster type bomb that releases computer controlled and radar equipped submunitions that hunt for tanks below and destroy them. Little robots, in effect. The CBU-105 can be used to attack formations of tanks, giving most of the submunitions an opportunity to destroy a vehicle.

Air Weapons: Little Robots Over India
 

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