INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

ghost

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The 3000 figure i wrote was based on the quote from Saurav Jha'S tweet.If you didn't read that ,then its not my fault.
Concerning the License given to East Block nations,That was only for manufacture and not for export.
And regarding the authenticity of tehelka ,AFAIK they had brought out the news on barak missile scam.
And against your repeated statement that i put NWFP arms as bench mark i had made it clear,I just said it literallyjust to show the plight of Indian small arms industry which couldn't produce a world class weapon.
Please give me thhe link for the OP or what ever youu are claiming for the massive order for 50000 figure.

@ALBY sir,

I agree with the you they could have made certain improvement over the original design ,they could have also develop whole new platform for 7.62 .I am sure GSQR did not state that they want copy of ak 47.Having said that Ak is a fine rifle and I think if it's not too revolutionary as a system, it is a reliable and proven in itself.They should look towards adopting Excalibur stock on it.I am also interested to see the magazine they have adopted.

I hope that CRPF issue red dot sight on these as standard.

I feel that they have mated INSAS trigger group with AK bolt carrier,I am not sure just a feeling.In the following pic you can see the similarity with the insas trigger group


Ghatak


Insas



Bulgarian AK.

@ladder sir, for your information ghatak was developed by RFI and SAF: 7.62mm Assault Rifle (Ghaatak) : RFI, SAF has developed this weapon and successfully
trial evaluated by BoO of MHA. PMS allocation received for 3007 nos.

http://bpms.org.in/documents/axn-tkn-on-16th-ordinary-meeting-ofb-en3c.pdf
 

ladder

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@ALBY sir,

I agree with the you they could have made certain improvement over the original design ,they could have also develop whole new platform for 7.62 .I am sure GSQR did not state that they want copy of ak 47.Having said that Ak is a fine rifle and I think if it's not too revolutionary as a system, it is a reliable and proven in itself.They should look towards adopting Excalibur stock on it.I am also interested to see the magazine they have adopted.

I hope that CRPF issue red dot sight on these as standard.

I feel that they have mated INSAS trigger group with AK bolt carrier,I am not sure just a feeling.In the following pic you can see the similarity with the insas trigger group


Ghatak


Insas



Bulgarian AK.

@ladder sir, for your information ghatak was developed by RFI and SAF: 7.62mm Assault Rifle (Ghaatak) : RFI, SAF has developed this weapon and successfully
trial evaluated by BoO of MHA. PMS allocation received for 3007 nos.

http://bpms.org.in/documents/axn-tkn-on-16th-ordinary-meeting-ofb-en3c.pdf
Yes, you are right about trigger group. It's similar with FNC and Insas. I have stated about it in an earlier post.

33007. Read the tender document. OFB can't issue tender without indent.

It is a part of order of 50,000 or so rifles.
 

ALBY

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What ever be the figure, i hope the weapon to be successful.Concerning the development of PKTM gun OFB should also try to develop a 7.62X51mm GPMG in the lines of PKM meant for regualr infantry as Brens lack ammo capacity and bulky,MAGs are good but too bulky comparedd with PKs used by SF.
 

sayareakd

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.

Found this from BRF



Isn't the desi model of PEQ 16 and the IR warning sensors on the Helmets..? Any idea's

@Kunal Biswas Sir, @Twinblade @sayareakd Sir :aww:
SJ its not PEQ 16. This is laser tag used for training purposes. Laser from the attachment is used to co witness with iron/day scope. Other part is sensor. When laser hit the sensor it register kill and it also give small shock to soldier and simulate bullet hit. Later on this data is analysed.

first seen with British forces when our guys conducted training exercises with them.
 
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Kunal Biswas

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IWESS Technology

Training infantry personnel of the future: Jawans supporting IWESS (Infantry Weapon Effect Simulating System). The IWESS is an electronic laser-based device designed to provide a real-time, accurate overview of the level of weapon handling skills developed during training in the field itself. Using the system requires recruits to wear a harness on which laser sensors are mounted and to attach a laser projector on the barrel of their weapons where normally a bayonet would be mounted.The harness consists of 14 sensors covering the head, arms as well as the body. An umpire control gun, something like an oversized pistol is manned by an instructor, which receives and processes data. When a weapon is fired, laser pulses are emitted by the projector, which are trapped by the sensors on a target's harness and transmitted to the control unit. The control unit then analyses the pulses and is able to tell whether the simulated bullet is on target or, if it has missed, then by what distance. The IWESS is effective up to a range of about 1000 metres.

The system is pretty old in IA ( The rifles here are SLR / FAL ), Active since Mid 90s, And constantly upgraded, The photo posted by Sanjeev is of Yudh Abhyas where GR unit visted in US, It is unknown they provided the Kit or we took with us ..

.Isn't the desi model of PEQ 16 and the IR warning sensors on the Helmets..? Any idea's

@Kunal Biswas Sir, @Twinblade @sayareakd Sir :aww:
SJ its not PEQ 16. This is laser tag used for training purposes. Laser from the attachment is used to co witness with iron/day scope. Other part is sensor. When laser hit the sensor it register kill and it also give small shock to soldier and simulate bullet hit. Later on this data is analysed.

first seen with British forces when our guys conducted training exercises with them.
 
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sayareakd

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@Kunal Biswas Sir, do you know about the system reported in this news item :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qe9hOHbU1SA


#IP 1138 14 - 20 July 2014

" D H V A N I " AN INDIGENOUS LOCATION OF BULLET ON TARGET SYSTEM (LOBOTS) FOR THE INDIAN ARMY

In the era of modern warfare, there is an immediate need to not only equip the Indian soldier with latest weaponry but also to revolutionize the techniques to train him for an efficient battlefield operation. Among the most basic skills of a soldier is marksmanship.

Marksmanship training requires positive and negative reinforcement of shooting techniques immediately after each shot is fired. It is not only essential to provide the marksman with an indication of where a bullet is fired at a target, but also provide a comprehensive statistics of how he/she has performed throughout his/her career as a marksman. Currently, the manual system used by the Indian Army involves the marksman firing shots at the target and subsequently walking up to the target (about 300m!) and identifying whether the shots were a hit or a miss. This primitive type of marksmanship training exhibits not only high turnaround times but is also inconsistent, unreliable, inaccurate and subjective.

Marksmanship training systems available from advanced countries for sale are mostly based on 1980s technology. Further they have exorbitant cost of ownership since they are not customized for the Indian environment and necessitate expensive after-sales service due to the black-box approach of the manufacturers.

The need was to develop a modern indigenous system which is tailor made to meet the requirements of the Indian Army at a cost lower than similar systems available elsewhere without compromising the performance.

Towards this end, the Experimental Aerodynamics Division at National Aerospace Laboratories, Bangalore and the Indian Army's Simulator Development Division, Secunderabad have jointly developed a state-of-the-art Location of Bullet on Target System (LOBOTS) named 'DHVANI' (Detection and Hit Visualization using Acoustic 'N'-wave Identification) for perfecting marksmanship skills by accurately determining the location of bullet impact and providing real-time feedback to the shooter.

The system is based on the basic principles of gas dynamics and aeroacoustics. Essentially, a bullet is a supersonic projectile which generates a shock wave from its leading edge, continuously at every point of its supersonic travel. At any instant along the bullet path, the shock wave envelope propagates in an invisible-cone continuously outward at an angle related to its Mach number.

The pressure wave in air caused due to the passing of the bullet results in a pressure profile known as the 'N' - wave because of its shape. If the rise in pressure and the associated frequencies fall within the range of audibility of human ear, the N-wave can be heard as a distinct sound. This sound is akin to the 'Sonic Boom' – the sound perceived on the ground when an aircraft flying overhead exceeds the speed of sound.

It is possible to determine the hit location of the bullet accurately by using an array of sensors to record the acoustic pressure rise due to the passing shock from the bullet and hence to detect the path of the incoming bullet. Using advanced algorithms developed at CSIR-NAL, the recorded signal from the sensors are analysed for the detection of the 'Nwave' and uses the geometrical shape of the shock wave to determine the co-ordinates of the bullet on the target. These co-ordinates are then wirelessly transmitted to a display at the shooter end. The whole process i.e. firing a shot to displaying at the shooter end takes less than a half a millisecond. At the shooter end, a multi-functional interactive GUI on a MIL grade laptop displays the results. A comprehensive database which will contain personnel details, shots fired and performance statistics ensures comprehensive logging for later analysis.

The entire process from the Indian Army's request to the prototype testing took only 10 months, and a shoestring budget of Rs 40L for two units, demonstrating that all military related R&D need not have protracted delays and costs. Each prototype currently costs Rs 9 lakhs/firer lane, which is significantly lesser than the Rs 15-18 lakhs for each firer lane of older generation wired systems offered to the Indian Army. When the lifecycle costs are added in, this indigenous system works out to only about 40% of the cost of an imported one.

Considering that there are over 2000 firing lanes all over the country, the saving to the national exchequer is significant.

The system has undergone rigorous field trials at Army ranges in Bangalore, Secunderabad and Infantry School Mhow. The formal handing over of DHVANI by Director CSIR-NAL to Commandant SDD Secunderabad took place on July 03, 2014.

SPECIFICATIONS
 A Multi-lane MIL-Standard, highly Ruggedized training System
 Accurate Hit Detection (within ±7mm)
 Immediate and detailed performance data using GUI display at the shooter and range controller levels (multiple lanes)
 Individual Shooter Performance data logging
 Auto triggered
 Lane detection – no credit to shooter if fired from other lane
 No susceptibility to interference from other simultaneous lanes
 Centralized Monitoring of lanes
 Wireless connectivity
 Completely field deployable in existing ranges
 Standard COTS hardware
 Capable of detecting burst mode from machine guns (2000 bullets/min)
 Caters to ranges up to 300m
 Extended to multi-lane ranges without limit or change in algorithm
 Cross-fire and Ricochet Detection
 Composite bar immune to changes in environmental temperature that can affect accuracy in metal bars as well as protection against rusting/oxidation
 Interfaced with Indian Army database of marksmen for improved training practices.
 Proprietary detection algorithm developed at EAD-NAL
 Significantly lesser setup and lifecycle costs(< Rs 0.75 Cr/ 8Lane Range) compared to Rs 2.4 Cr for similar foreign system – saving of nearly 60% in cost
NAL-Information Pasteboard
 
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anupamsurey

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effective range of 300 m, one will be dead before he reaches this range to kill an enemy. is this range normal for an assault rifle?
 

pmaitra

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effective range of 300 m, one will be dead before he reaches this range to kill an enemy. is this range normal for an assault rifle?
There are plenty of threads on assault rifles. 300 m is a normal range.
 

ALBY

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The pistol grip seems to be am indigenious development so is the vertical fore grip.Also a AR-15 type collapsible stock would have been useful for CQBs rather than fixed stocks.
 

Kunal Biswas

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The firearm is design for CQB, In that sense the Rifle range with respect to its specs fits the role ..

It is made to replace foreign origin AKs and to stop further import of AKMs ..

effective range of 300 m, one will be dead before he reaches this range to kill an enemy. is this range normal for an assault rifle?
==============




Excalibur fold-able butt stock
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Amogh carbine, Note the hand grip
========

They should have added Excalibur fold-able butt stock, The hand grip is from Amogh carbine ..
 

Kunal Biswas

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The most important part of these rifles are they are made in India, By doing so it is cheaper to produce in mass compare to imported AK rifles ..

That was the main purpose these Rifle are produced on first place ..
 

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