Indian Special Forces

Arjun Mk1A

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Ok, based on brochure they are manufacturing products for normal Infantry soldiers. Thus,lot of SF specific products still needs to buy from abroad.

But TCL have some products which can also be sold in Consumer markets. I believe Decathlon have Camping products, climbing equipment's etc. May be TCL can sell them in online market. But being a PSU, they will sit and enjoy.
 

jai jaganath

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I think that's the reason I didnt find this ship CQB footage interesting or to the standard of MARCOS, like they've rescued hostages at sea before, they are not the kind who havent seen combat. So why this average thing. Cause they believed carrots really give your eyes superpowers? I mean DEVGRU and Delta are known for CQB and yet the most they developed at night was better NVGs. Imagine Ronaldo missing a goal cause he didnt wear his shoes, what kind of a shitty excuse is that supposed to be. Will anyone take you seriously in class if you say that you are the topper, yet dont bring your books ever. Like why? Just why?
That's why I always say this but get a bad bashing for it
Until our forces haven't hit badly or be defeated then nothing is gonna change and that's the truth bcoz it's not about money or resources or talent etc that we are not having a world class force or military
It's bcoz no one is able to push neither government nor MoD
The only thing which can push them is another military (military for military) and well defined defeat until then u will see depleting Sq strength, no orders for artillery, helicopters, rifles, even basic pc or bpj and helmets, drones
 

Jedi Operator

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That's why I always say this but get a bad bashing for it
Until our forces haven't hit badly or be defeated then nothing is gonna change and that's the truth bcoz it's not about money or resources or talent etc that we are not having a world class force or military
It's bcoz no one is able to push neither government nor MoD
The only thing which can push them is another military (military for military) and well defined defeat until then u will see depleting Sq strength, no orders for artillery, helicopters, rifles, even basic pc or bpj and helmets, drones
Today Indian Army is known for it's experience, expertise and soldiering at high altitude. Remember, India didnt have any good resources or mountain warfare capabilities prior to 1962, our defeat from China made us realize that. We didnt have our external intelligence agencies at the time, no special forces units etc. Then in 1967 we defeated them.

Same with the withdrawal in Sri Lanka, after that we were known for peacekeeping and counter insurgency. How many defeats did USA have to face in order to get where it is.

Let me remind you, in Beirut 1983, a truck bomb killed 284 American Marines, almost their entire battalion and they did not even respond to it, instead they had to wage war on Grenada. They didnt even retaliated. (three years after failed eagle claw and ten years before Black Hawk Down in Somalia).
So anybody can tell you it's the mindset that needs to change.

This means that when common sense no longer prevails in the leadership, you need to get knocked off. Something needs to hit you hard if you want to come back. How did India get united. Years of Sultanate and Mughal rule followed by Britishers was one such thing. Someone said it right, "Indians need a kick in the nuts, to start using their brains". Mindset problem sir!
 

jai jaganath

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Today Indian Army is known for it's experience, expertise and soldiering at high altitude. Remember, India didnt have any good resources or mountain warfare capabilities prior to 1962, our defeat from China made us realize that. We didnt have our external intelligence agencies at the time, no special forces units etc. Then in 1967 we defeated them.

Same with the withdrawal in Sri Lanka, after that we were known for peacekeeping and counter insurgency. How many defeats did USA have to face in order to get where it is.

Let me remind you, in Beirut 1983, a truck bomb killed 284 American Marines, almost their entire battalion and they did not even respond to it, instead they had to wage war on Grenada. They didnt even retaliated. (three years after failed eagle claw and ten years before Black Hawk Down in Somalia).
So anybody can tell you it's the mindset that needs to change.
Seriously brother mountain warfare capabilities
The world's most experienced mountain warfare military had to buy winter clothing from USA by emergency procurement
This is the condition of so called best
If clothing is an issue for them even that they have to import then u can assume about other deficiencies in our mountain warfare
 

Jedi Operator

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Seriously brother mountain warfare capabilities
The world's most experienced mountain warfare military had to buy winter clothing from USA by emergency procurement
This is the condition of so called best
If clothing is an issue for them even that they have to import then u can assume about other deficiencies in our mountain warfare
lack of priorities brother. People with no background in the military sitting and making decisions.
 

Jedi Operator

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Watch SAS rogue heroes Series on John sterling
Even read the book brather.

Also, @jai jaganath you are partially write. Their are multiple factors and not just one. But all of that boils down to "mindset". Ye change kab hoga pata nehi. I feel Lt Gen PC Katoch and Vikram Sood writing good books and could be informative to the upcoming officers, if they ever care to read them.
 

jai jaganath

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Even read the book brather.

Also, @jai jaganath you are partially write. Their are multiple factors and not just one. But all of that boils down to "mindset". Ye change kab hoga pata nehi. I feel Lt Gen PC Katoch and Vikram Sood writing good books and could be informative to the upcoming officers, if they ever care to read them.
Jo bhi ho bhai sab
The ones who are suffering are junior soldiers and nation
 

Alamarathan

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Essentially we lag behind both in training and equipment area,later can be solved by creating a sizeable discretionary fund for the respective CO's which is the easy part.

But the training issue only can be resolved by changing the doctrine and doing (meaningful)exercises with our western counterpart's. (Just hire the ex operators to share skills,if needs to be)Which take years to master if not months.

But,this might break egos of many so,i wouldn't count on it (atleast in our near future).

As a civvy,I only hope and pray for our protectors.

Anyway don't get offended, i just posted after observing the issues being discussed here, that's all
 

Aditya Ballal

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Ok, based on brochure they are manufacturing products for normal Infantry soldiers. Thus,lot of SF specific products still needs to buy from abroad.

But TCL have some products which can also be sold in Consumer markets. I believe Decathlon have Camping products, climbing equipment's etc. May be TCL can sell them in online market. But being a PSU, they will sit and enjoy.
They’re already there on Amazon.
 

ManhattanProject

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This guy is an exception not the norm, given the size of the army there are bound to be some people like him. Problem is he will probably never be in any kind of position to bring these drills into implementation.
 

Meal Team 6

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(Just hire the ex operators to share skills,if needs to be)
Unfortunately they are bound by NDA so we can not hire ex operators of other nation, the instructor we can and do hire like that foxtrot something guy are sub par with no combat experience who use tacky complicated not so usefull tactics, or even worse ,shifuji 🤡.
Best we can do is increase bilateral exercises with other succesful sf units including those who were ones in same situation as we are now like indo kopassus and learn from them.
 

Angel of War

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No brother it's due to people with military background sitting on higher positions of our military
what do you mean ? Incompetence in decision making comes with the short sightedness of all the parties involved including senior army leadership , MoD and bureaucracy and of course the cabinet which has always kept armed forces on the sidelines
 

jai jaganath

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what do you mean ? Incompetence in decision making comes with the short sightedness of all the parties involved including senior army leadership , MoD and bureaucracy and of course the cabinet which has always kept armed forces on the sidelines
Pehli bat ap itne dino bad aye
Ap kese hain ?
The state of our sof is due to generals and CO who are filled with jai ho syndrome
They themselves want to be commando rather than operator
They are not dynamic at all when it comes to equipments and training of sof
They themselves never pushed for modernization then forget about senior leadership
 

Fire and groove

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Bruh what are you even talking about, vis red laser is just additional feature for day operation, in night you use ir laser and ir illuminator,not vis laser, stop watching so much movies, range is around 16 km on older peq-2 , newer dbal a-2 have great laser range and about 3.5 km illuminator range
Nobody uses vis lasers except for zeroing the IR. Which brings me to the fact that active aiming (IR laser) is objectively superior to passive aiming (night vision optics) passive aiming suffers from horrendous vision and parallax shift while active aiming only gives your position away for the few seconds you aim to an opponent using night vision with 40 degrees FOV. Even then the position you see the laser on as well as the range makes a huge difference as to how well you see it, a 90 degree offset makes seeing the laser very hard and you can only see the point of origin and the splash.
 

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