Indian Special Forces (archived)

[rkhanna]

This interview was before AFSOD. Now and hopefully more in the future, we will see increases in budgetting and technology for the SF guys.

Fair - But the proof will be in the pudding. Fingers crossed. Hopefully if things are going right, we will never hear about it.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

PARA SF.
2013 encounter.
..................

 

[Assassin 2.0]

1971 war gallantry award citations of 'Desert Scorpion' commandos destroyed

BCCL
On night 5/6 December 1971, Pakistan launched a massive attack with 51 Infantry Brigade, supported by a Regiment of T-59 and Squadron of Sherman Tanks with the aim to capture Longewala and Ramgarh. (File image)

NEW DELHI: The citations of gallantry awards conferred on the commandos of the Army's elite 10 Para (Special Forces) during the 1971 Indo-Pakistan war have been destroyed, the unit has said in response to an RTI query.

The elite 10 Para (Special Forces), eponymous as 'Desert Scorpions', was raised by splitting the 9 Para unit of special forces in 1967 and faced its first action within four years.

The 1971 war was convincingly won by India, carving out Bangladesh from Pakistan, and the members of the elite unit were awarded with Battle Honours and gallantry medals, including a Mahavir Chakra to Brigadier Swai Bhawani Singh, the Maharaja of Jaipur, aka Tiger, who led it.

During the war, the unit had successfully conducted surgical strikes 80 km inside Pakistan, capturing four strategic towns without suffering any loss.

In response to a query seeking the details of the awardees, the CPIO gave the list but said the relevant record of citations have been "destroyed as per policy in vogue" and hence not available, Information Commissioner Divya Prakash Sinha noted in an order.

He passed the order after the applicant approached the Central Information Commission (CIC), saying the list has no meaning without the citations

citation, in this context, is a brief summary of the valour shown by a soldier during war which is read out when he is being accorded the gallantry award.

During the two hearings at the CIC, the highest adjudicating body in RTI matters, the CPIO remained absent, which irked Sinha.

"The commission takes grave exception to the conduct of the CPIO on all the aforesaid counts. It reflects on the respondent office's utter disregard for the directions of the commission as well as towards the provisions of the RTI Act," he said.

The commission directed the CPIO to provide a copy of the extract of the relevant Defence Services Regulation under which the records were destroyed.

The commissioner also issued a notice to the CPIO to explain why show-cause proceedings should not be initiated against him under the RTI Act.

"A copy of this order is also marked to the Commanding Officer, 10 Para SF, to take note of the adverse observations of the commission as well as to ensure compliance of above directions by the CPIO," he said.

The 10 Para (Special Forces) unit's meticulous planning and successful implementation led to the capture of Chachro and Virwaha towns in Sindh province on the western front, destroying the supply chains of the Pakistan army.

After the successful capture of Chachro, where the headquarter of the Pakistan Rangers was located, on December 5, 1971, the team continued and clinched their second and third targets, Virwaha and Nagarparkar, by December 8.

The unit was immediately reassigned to capture Islamkot, which it did without any trouble in a nimble operation. Altogether, 36 Pakistani soldiers were killed by the Paras and 22 others were taken prisoners.

The unit led by Brigadier Swai Bhawani Singh had trained in desert warfare for nearly five months before hitting the operation.

 

[abhay rajput]

Thanks for posting.

This sums up the last 50 pages of this thread pretty well. Maybe the good General is also an inferior feeling Indian?

Well sir when opposition demands proof and create ruckus then you need to show something.
Have you heard in us , Russia , China opposition asking proof .

 

[armyofhind]

Hopefully if things are going right, we will never hear about it.

But will eventually get to see some leaked pics :biggrin2:

By the way, there were some reports of an additional unit with around 300 operators (if I remember correctly), along with support staff and intelligence people. Somewhat along the lines of a true Tier-1 unit.

Has there been any additional info about it?

 

[vampyrbladez]

Fair - But the proof will be in the pudding. Fingers crossed. Hopefully if things are going right, we will never hear about it.

Check this out.

https://www.aninews.in/news/nationa...rrorists-pak-army-on-loc20191211084805/?amp=1

This might also interest you.

https://indiandefenceindustries.in/indian-sf-get-us-sfweapons

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ti...rmys-special-forces-to-get-new-weapons/459700

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Well sir when opposition demands proof and create ruckus then you need to show something.
Have you heard in us , Russia , China opposition asking proof .

I am taking a dive in a gutter but ok..

Have u seen the Obama administration brag about OBL raid and making it a election campaign?

Nothing is ever one sided.

And regarding the opposition...in the US SF operators are persecuted with media covering them.

Nothing is above constitution my friend and the constitution gives a right for a open debate on everything.

 

[Deathstar]

I am taking a dive in a gutter but ok..

Have u seen the Obama administration brag about OBL raid and making it a election campaign?

Nothing is ever one sided.

And regarding the opposition...in the US SF operators are persecuted with media covering them.

Nothing is above constitution my friend and the constitution gives a right for a open debate on everything.

Yes Obama did brag , raid happened exactly a year before his re election and he had a press conference right from the white house wwith his supporters cheering

 

[Deathstar]

I am taking a dive in a gutter but ok..

Have u seen the Obama administration brag about OBL raid and making it a election campaign?

Nothing is ever one sided.

And regarding the opposition...in the US SF operators are persecuted with media covering them.

Nothing is above constitution my friend and the constitution gives a right for a open debate on everything.

Yes Obama did brag , raid happened exactly a year before his re election and he had a press conference right from the white house wwith his supporters cheering

 

[Gessler]

Lot of people whining about me or others complaining that our equipment isn't good enough. What ulterior purpose of mine is served by pointing out quite obvious & glaring faults based on fairly educated comparisons (and a fair bit of understanding of why other units use what they use)? The reason why I do it is because I want our personnel to get the best stuff money can buy, maximizing their chances of survival and efficiency in field.

I've been seeing for years how mind-boggling sums are spent to procure mediocre and/or crap equipment from Ordnance Factories, have been seeing how operations are suffering due to non-availability of critical enabling equipment like Night Vision for CI/CT, been seeing how even those problems for which indigenous solutions exist from Pvt sector are unable to be met due to these sectors being reserved for crappy govt companies only, and who end ups paying the price for all this? Not you or me but the same soldiers who you claim to care so much about.

But what they really care about is THEIR sense of identity - which gets damaged when someone says the soldiers that they identify so much with are not geared adequately, regardless of how dead-obvious such an observation might be.

So, I think its pretty clear who're the ones suffering identity problems. I'd advice to stop caring so much about your identity and care more about the ones who are actually risking their lives. And caring does not mean saying whatever they do is right.

I have no confusions regarding this. I've seen such 'patriots' abuse people who asked back in late-2000s and early 2010s (when I first found my way to forums of this ilk) that why our infantry is not being issued proper modern helmets like PASGT or ACH (at that time even Pak army issued LWH-spec helmets which were basically improved PASGT). But we've all seen what eventually happened there - Army themselves got their sh!t in order and went in for the ACH standard issue.

Yes, ACH is a phoren standard defined by phoreners. Yes, we were attempting to mimic the gear used by American soldiers who we've been seeing for years by that time in annual Yudh Abhyas exercises, in an attempt to hopefully achieve the same results wrt protection standards (the older Model 1974 non-Kevlar helmet couldn't even adequately stop 9mm pistol rounds).

Similarly I hold true to my original assertions made several months ago on this very thread. The Indian SFs will, invariably, end up being carbon-copies of Western SOF eventually. Even the Russians (sworn enemies of the West) couldn't avoid but admit that the way shown by Western SOF is the best way forward, we can't avoid it either and there's no reason to except a misplaced sense of pride/self-righteousness or in many instances, simple case of institutional lethargy. Our only problem is that we move too slowly - the destination however is fixed. Write that down.

If it wasn't for the PKM, how many without a trained eye could say conclusively that this guy is actually Russian and not American/Westerner?

A unit like NSG (arguably one of best-equipped tactical unit in India), is probably a prime example of this process of evolution. Even if you look at NSG during 26/11 or shortly thereafter, you'll see they were carbon copies of SAS operators in terms of equipment (black-clad BDUs, MP-5s), tactics & shooting styles...from back in the Iranian embassy siege days in 1980...

...we were still emulating this model in 2008 (and in many ways, still do). So mimicking the Western units, their equipment & ways of operating, is not something new that I'm proposing. It is and always was a part and parcel of Indian special units.

Only idiots with superficial knowledge fail to see the tradition & inspiration our Para Regmt draws from their British counterpart, and how much Para SF draws from SAS or Rangers. Or how much SFF/SG drew from CIA SAD (they were instrumental in creating them). Unfortunately our problem is that while these foreign units moved ahead with a constantly evolving outlook in every aspect (not least in terms of equipment, as that's the point of contention here), our units have unfortunately remained stuck in a time capsule for the most part.

But like I said, don't worry...we'll break out of it soon. Steps are in the right direction.

My 2 paisa (from my experience) - why i dont like them

1) The zipper Vests make for horrendous load bearing gear. Anybody who has hiked or is into mountain climbing will understand the mechanics of loadbearing equipment including the need to clasp higher on the chest for stability and reducing pressure off the lower spine. -

- Keep in mind everything (from the zips to the velcros) are made by the lowest bidder. Having a vest zip break in the middle of an operation would be a real bitch.
- The buckles on them just add to the chaos on your vest when you are tyring to find crap in the middle of a firefight without looking or in the dark.

2) they are generally looser to accommodate the Kevlar plates underneath which need their own vests- you will end up having all your gear banging around inside the vests and the vest itself moving with your body - UNCOMFORTABLE

3) Decent amount of Real Estate between the Neck and Upper chest becomes useless and cannot accommodate any gear. - With everything lower on your body higher change of your gun sling getting stuck on your mag pouches

But they still exists and are made and a few military units do sport them....

Also, have seen quite a lot of BPJs worn too low because of loose fitting...leaving vital organs like the heart & lungs mostly exposed while covering only the guts & liver.

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

Navy MARCOS Officers
Captain, Commander & Sub Lieutenant or Commodore ?

 

[Waanar]

Lot of people whining about me or others complaining that our equipment isn't good enough. What ulterior purpose of mine is served by pointing out quite obvious & glaring faults based on fairly educated comparisons (and a fair bit of understanding of why other units use what they use)? The reason why I do it is because I want our personnel to get the best stuff money can buy, maximizing their chances of survival and efficiency in field.

I've been seeing for years how mind-boggling sums are spent to procure mediocre and/or crap equipment from Ordnance Factories, have been seeing how operations are suffering due to non-availability of critical enabling equipment like Night Vision for CI/CT, been seeing how even those problems for which indigenous solutions exist from Pvt sector are unable to be met due to these sectors being reserved for crappy govt companies only, and who end ups paying the price for all this? Not you or me but the same soldiers who you claim to care so much about.

But what they really care about is THEIR sense of identity - which gets damaged when someone says the soldiers that they identify so much with are not geared adequately, regardless of how dead-obvious such an observation might be.

So, I think its pretty clear who're the ones suffering identity problems. I'd advice to stop caring so much about your identity and care more about the ones who are actually risking their lives. And caring does not mean saying whatever they do is right.

I have no confusions regarding this. I've seen such 'patriots' abuse people who asked back in late-2000s and early 2010s (when I first found my way to forums of this ilk) that why our infantry is not being issued proper modern helmets like PASGT or ACH (at that time even Pak army issued LWH-spec helmets which were basically improved PASGT). But we've all seen what eventually happened there - Army themselves got their sh!t in order and went in for the ACH standard issue.

Yes, ACH is a phoren standard defined by phoreners. Yes, we were attempting to mimic the gear used by American soldiers who we've been seeing for years by that time in annual Yudh Abhyas exercises, in an attempt to hopefully achieve the same results wrt protection standards (the older Model 1974 non-Kevlar helmet couldn't even adequately stop 9mm pistol rounds).

Similarly I hold true to my original assertions made several months ago on this very thread. The Indian SFs will, invariably, end up being carbon-copies of Western SOF eventually. Even the Russians (sworn enemies of the West) couldn't avoid but admit that the way shown by Western SOF is the best way forward, we can't avoid it either and there's no reason to except a misplaced sense of pride/self-righteousness or in many instances, simple case of institutional lethargy. Our only problem is that we move too slowly - the destination however is fixed. Write that down.

If it wasn't for the PKM, how many without a trained eye could say conclusively that this guy is actually Russian and not American/Westerner?

A unit like NSG (arguably one of best-equipped tactical unit in India), is probably a prime example of this process of evolution. Even if you look at NSG during 26/11 or shortly thereafter, you'll see they were carbon copies of SAS operators in terms of equipment (black-clad BDUs, MP-5s), tactics & shooting styles...from back in the Iranian embassy siege days in 1980...

...we were still emulating this model in 2008 (and in many ways, still do). So mimicking the Western units, their equipment & ways of operating, is not something new that I'm proposing. It is and always was a part and parcel of Indian special units.

Only idiots with superficial knowledge fail to see the tradition & inspiration our Para Regmt draws from their British counterpart, and how much Para SF draws from SAS or Rangers. Or how much SFF/SG drew from CIA SAD (they were instrumental in creating them). Unfortunately our problem is that while these foreign units moved ahead with a constantly evolving outlook in every aspect (not least in terms of equipment, as that's the point of contention here), our units have unfortunately remained stuck in a time capsule for the most part.

But like I said, don't worry...we'll break out of it soon. Steps are in the right direction.



Also, have seen quite a lot of BPJs worn too low because of loose fitting...leaving vital organs like the heart & lungs mostly exposed while covering only the guts & liver.

I have genuinely stopped mentioning gear or lack thereof regarding our special operations. Some guys jump out of nowhere and start lecturing me about the glorious history of Para SF in Sri Lanka, Pakistan and what not.

I say, in clear terms, that I don't doubt our men's caliber but it's like they want me to say like "NO, THE SHEMAGH CAN BE USED AS AN IR STROBE TO PREVENT BEING BOMBED BY FRIENDLY FORCES WHEN CALLING IN CAS" or something.
Such shortsightedness. Criticism is not slander.

Calling gucci gear "gucci gear" doesn't change the fact that it makes task ten times easier.

Martyr Captain Pawan Kumar (10th Para) died because his BPJ didn't cover his heart region. (I'm not sure he even had a BPJ)

He would still be serving and alive if he did have that BPJ.
Seriously.
Gear matters.
Beat it into your head.

Gear MATTERS!
GUCCI GEAR MATTERS!
If you think naming a thing you don't like as a women's purse company is going to reduce it's effectiveness, you have another thing coming.

 

[Holy Triad]

This is what happens when self hating indians take over a thread,now we are left with bunch of facepalm emojis and gooochi drooling,


For those fanboys drooling over "GYAN",trust no one,just Google "fire team manoeuvres" and read as much as possible on the subject.(watch some hollywoohoos too)

Then come back and read this thread. And you will get how homogeneous this thread has become.


Now read this stuff on afsod and its chief,

Officers’ responsibilities:

Top sources said a lot of thought went into the selection of the officers to head this new division.

Maj. Gen. Dhingra, a Sri Lankan ops veteran, has been the commander of India’s only independent Para Brigade, and has served as the defence attaché in Washington. The concept of this division is also influenced from the US, which has the Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC).

The newly-appointed officers have been asked to form the structured organisation by November-end, which will also include selecting where the headquarters will be based and what kind of equipment is needed.


https://theprint.in/defence/india-g...gets-miles-inside-enemy-territory/235786/?amp

Titbit about our incoming chief,

The other bloke in redtie next to Ashok is also a coursemate - Joe Sengupta another 9 PARA (Cdo). 17 SIKH to PARA ... Both buggers were in the thick of fighting in Srilanka! Both got Shot up in Action, both were thick-skinned enuf to survive to tell the tale.

Both are decorated!



Now tell me,do you guys still think,he is a kind of person goes on "vacation" in "Andaman".


P.s.: the reason why,the first mission was setup in andaman.


The Andaman and Nicobar Command is the first and only Tri-servicetheater command of the Indian Armed Forces, based at Port Blair in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands, a Union Territory of India.[2][3] It was created in 2001 to safeguard India's strategic interests in Southeast Asia and the Strait of Malacca by increasing rapid deployment of military assets in the region. It provides logistical and administrative support to naval ships which are sent on deployment to East Asia and the Pacific Ocean.[4][5][6]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_and_Nicobar_Command

What did I tell you?




Tacticool!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

Lightweight compact plate carrier
Doesn't cover much area but good for the ops where they don't prefer any armour. Better than nothing.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

not aware of any SAS involvement: P.C. Katoch
6 min read . 02 Jun 2014
Aman Malik, Elizabeth Roche
The lessons learnt from the hastily-planned Operation Blue Star helped in the smoother conduct of later operations, says retired Special Forces officer Lt. Gen. P.C. Katoch

Topics
operation-blue-star-30-years-later1984Operation Blue StarPC Katoch

The lessons learnt from the hastily-planned Operation Blue Star helped in the smoother conduct of later operations against terrorists in Punjab, including Operation Black Thunder I and II, said retired Special Forces officer Lt. Gen. P.C. Katoch. As a young major, Katoch led a unit of Special Forces commandos into Golden Temple. Excerpts from an interview:

Take us briefly through the hours leading up to Operation Blue Star. How were the final stages of the operation planned and at what stage were you, along with your special forces, pressed into service?

Well, I was a Major at that point of time and we got the information only on the morning of 2 June and the same day, a part of my unit along with my CO (commanding officer), we moved to Amritsar. We were given a briefing, but intelligence was practically zero. So, we went around in the evening and eventually on the night of 5-6 June, we went in (into the Golden Temple).


What kind of planning did you have in terms of the number of people that were part of your special forces division. What was the paraphernalia that you had at your disposal in terms of arms and ammunition and in terms of other things that you may have had?

Firstly, it was only a part of the unit which went, not the complete unit. There were a lot of news items of a paradrop and what not, whereas it was practically a ground operation. In the inner parikrama, troops from three sides were pumped in, so we went in from the southern direction and it was practically a ground operation. It was like infantry and it was nothing to do with something special.

What was the final trigger for the beginning of the operation? Were the people inside given final warnings? Were the first shots fired from the inside or did the army fire the first shots?

Loading video
But were any of your seniors briefed by the SAS?

None, none, none, zero. But you see there are other forces which are outside the army. Now that may have happened. Like the special group of the Special Frontier Force etc. If something happened there, the army is not aware, at least nobody from my unit knew about it.

Was the Special Frontier Force part of the operation?

It was the special group, part of which did come on 5th morning (5 June). They were part of people who went in, but I am not aware whether they had any briefing or were in touch with SAS and all, I have no idea.

[British foreign secretary William Hague says Britain sent a British military adviser to India between February 8 and 17, 1984, to advise Indian intelligence services and Special Group on contingency plans for Operation Blue Star.]

There was a complete media blackout before and during the operation, which further fuelled speculation and rumours. Was such secrecy needed?

I personally feel the media should have been taken in, especially, if there were any people who had done some war correspondent course, because after all you don’t want to get the media knocked out there. It was a built-up area which was just about 350 metres by 250 metres, and all doors were shut and (with) just the pillars to take refuge. If you take the media inside, well, that could have got people killed. May be that was the reason (for the blackout).

Some people who were inside the premises of the Golden Temple, claim that had Khalistan been declared by Bhindranwale, Pakistan might have opened a front. Do you believe that was possible?

No. I think that’s highly stupid. It is like somebody saying that in Gilgit-Baltistan people declare independence and India opens up the front against Pakistan. That is pure nonsense. But yes, Pakistan was definitely part of the terrorism, which they are even trying to revive today.

There have been allegations that the army actually shot several people in cold blood. Also, that the official casualty figures were underplayed. How would you react to that?

Let me put it this way, that we went in, they were firing like hell. I mean they meant business. In fact, even on 2nd, 3rd night (the night of 2-3 June) when we went around, with my CO and climbed the buildings and saw, they had sandbagged the area and had proper pickets to fire. And, even the lower marble in the Akal Takht, which is facing the Darshani Deori, had been cut open. So, subsequently what happened, I really don’t know—I was wounded on the first night and I was evacuated— but I don’t think you have an army which will shoot in cold blood.

Several people, including the likes of (former Punjab police chief) K.P.S. Gill, say that although Operation Blue Star was necessary, it was ill-conceived. They compare it with Operation Black Thunder-II and say that had it been better planned, the job would have been done with far fewer casualties. Would you agree?

Well, let me put it this way: Operation Black Thunder-II was done because they had known what happened in Blue Star. And in Black Thunder-II, while K.P.S. Gill may have been given all the credit because of whatever political reasons, the fact is that the special action group of the NSG (National Security Guard), which went in, and they did the job, they were hundred per cent army. So, what happened in Blue Star is, may be, that the planning was done in haste for whatever reason, because, last minute if the army was told that we want this to be cleared soon, well, that could have happened, otherwise, in built-up area, you really don’t go in from all directions knowing what is inside. So, in Black Thunder, they could cut out the electricity and water and starve these people. Whereas, I don’t know what the political direction was in Blue Star because the orders were that you clear them the fastest. What had happened is that the division that had been there for decades —the 15th Division—had been moved out to the border, and, in fact, a division was brought in from Meerut, which was new to the place altogether. So, intelligence was practically zero. But the fact is that on 1 June also, when the firing took place with the CRPF, it was very clear that inside people mean business and they want to fight it out and they are well-armed. Normally, in special operations, you don’t go through the gates, which is known to everybody; you blast your way through. That sort of a damage was not permitted, although we had the explosives.

At the end of the day, is the Punjab issue is qualitatively different from say the northeast or the Naxal issue?

If you have the political will, both at the centre and the state, I think everything is possible. But as far as Punjab is concerned, for example, last year, we had some officers from a friendly country for training with us, and they had been to Pakistan earlier, and they said Pakistan is very clear that we are going to revive the insurgency in Punjab. Whether they succeed or not is a different thing altogether. And, they also said that the induction of drugs in Punjab is part of that plan.

Now, if you don’t know how to manage your youth, it is very easy to start an insurgency.

Topics
operation-blue-star-30-years-later1984Operation Blue StarPC Katoch

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

Plate Carrier vs Bullet Proof Jacket
Simple visual difference

Just highlighted the part getting protection
BPJ fabric also offers protection so covered whole
Both have their pros & cons

 

[Assassin 2.0]

we were still emulating this model in 2008 (and in many ways, still do). So mimicking the Western units, their equipment & ways of operating, is not something new that I'm proposing. It is and always was a part and parcel of Indian special units

Well actually NSG is based on the basis of mix GSG-9 and SAS.
But their is no official data which claim that SAS trained NSG and many anti terror squads all over the globe use Black uniform and MP-5.
Every country need to develop and create training infrastructure in itself only. We cannot believe to have a big battalion which is just roaming around the world just to get training because we don't have infrastructure.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...counter-terror-force/article16892790.ece/amp/

NSG with german GSG - 9

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Why the hell india would thumb down the offer from American SOCOM CHIEF?

Btw I have substantial data which claim SAS and other American special forces trained NAPAK SSG. Even at the time of Musharraf when huge anti terror operations were started SSG was closely training under British and American.

 

[Gessler]

Well actually NSG is based on the basis of mix GSG-9 and SAS.
But their is no official data which claim that SAS trained NSG and many anti terror squads all over the globe use Black uniform and MP-5.

Majority of European CT units were set up in immediate aftermath of 1972 Olympics. SAS was active since much earlier, even in the CT role. By the time the Iranian embassy siege was going on, units like GSG9 were frankly kiddies. Even during Flight 181 assault GSG9 were still asking SAS to advice.

Every country need to develop and create training infrastructure in itself only. We cannot believe to have a big battalion which is just roaming around the world just to get training because we don't have infrastructure.

Obviously. The purpose of joint exercises is never to get your uninitiated greenies trained by someone else - but to allow the sharing of information, experiences & techniques between professionals, which can then be implemented as seen fit by either party.

Why the hell india would thumb down the offer from American SOCOM CHIEF?

What book/article are these snaps from?

Btw I have substantial data which claim SAS and other American special forces trained NAPAK SSG. Even at the time of Musharraf when huge anti terror operations were started SSG was closely training under British and American.

Obviously...Pak was and still is crucial to the war in Afghanistan and is always seeking to leverage that fact. Real material assistance (more F16s, artillery, money etc.) is far harder to get sanction from US government, but most decision-makers find it much easier to sign off on training for Foreign Internal Defense (one of chief peacetime roles of SOCOM), which is requested by Pak on the premise that these skills will be put to use in the WOT within FATA/rest of Pak.

And paks are never one to refuse any help that comes their way, especially knowing the military/intelligence-led establishment and affliction for sub-conventional warfare.

 

[MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00]

Interview with Lt Gen Prakash Katoch, PARA SF Veteran on Special Forces & Surgical Strikes
By
Raghav Gakhar
-
July 15, 2018
0
3511

Lt Gen Prakash C. Katoch, PVSM, UYSM, AVSM, SC is a Special Forces veteran of the Indian army. DefenceLover spoke to Lt. Gen Prakash Katoch on his thoughts over many things, ranging from Para SF, to special forces of US, UK, Pakistan and China, and lastly with Surgical Strikes. We hope that those who aspire to join Indian army and special forces learn from his experience.

Question: Since the time Para Special Forces is raised, where are they majorly deployed?

Answer: Their deployment has been largely within the country other than in Sri Lanka – where the then three Parachute Commando battalions were deployed and did exceptionally well. In fact the LTTE intercepts stated they were very afraid of these units. During the IPKF tenure, the Parachute Commando battalions were renamed Special Forces. In addition, Special Forces have also been deployed in UN missions.

Question: What was the purpose of creating an another unit when we already had parachute units in the Indian army?

Answer: Parachute units are like regular infantry units that are trained for aerial induction. Once they are inducted by air and touch ground, their tasks are like the infantry – holding ground. Special Forces undertake special missions and do not hold ground.

Question: From Siachen to Sri Lanka to J&K and others, you have served at almost every where a soldier can be deployed, which posting was the most challenging of all of them?

Answer: The experience is different and cannot be really equated. In Sri Lanka I was commanding a battalion and challenges were very different – thick jungles, lagoons, counter-insurgency, well trained and motivated LTTE that used knowledge of ground very well. In Siachen, I was commanding a Brigade and though I made sure to spend nights at forward posts whenever possible, at ground level Siachen is the toughest for troops.

Question: What are the different rifles used by Para Special Forces till now?

Answer: They were initially having the same rifle as the rest of the Indian Army – the bulky 7.62 mm SLR which was semi-automatic, and even had this rifle when they went to Sri Lanka while fighting the LTTE equipped with the lighter, fully automatic and virtually no-stoppage AK-47. During the IPKF in Sri Lanka, Army was forced to import 1,00,000 AK-47 rifles because the DRDO was unable to produce an indigenous rifle– these AK-47 rifles were distribute to units, with each Special Forces battalion getting about 120 AKs. Eventually, the DRDO produced the 5.56 INSAS rifle but was not anywhere top of the line. Special Forces battalions were also were equipped with these, in addition to the AK’s they got in Sri Lanka. In early 2000s, the Tavor assault rifles were imported from Israel. However, there was rapid expansion of the Special Forces battalions after that, because of which the Tavors got shared with the new units. Therefore, the Special Forces presently are holding mix of Tavor’s and AKs.

Question: Are our Para special forces equipped with the latest technology and weapons? How good is the Tavor as a weapon?

Answer: Better than rest of the army, but you really cannot say it is the latest technology in the world. Moreover, equipping is not packaged and there are plenty voids. Not being packaged implies that if a 5-man assault squad is not given the complete set of weapons and equipment it is authorized that there would be that less combat capability. For example, the hand-held laser target designators are yet to be procured more than 15 years after these were authorized. There is tremendous scope of improvement in communications and surveillance systems. There is even shortage of GPS. Even rucksacks are being purchase at unit level using own funds because the ones supplied by ordnance factories directly under ministry of defence are sub-standard.

Question: What is the primary task of Indian para special forces? Are we using them Optimally?

Answer: The main task of Special Forces should be: one, employment on politico-military missions at strategic levels to shape the environment in India’s favour, and; two, act as force multiplier to operations by military. We are not using them optimally at all – employment on politico-military missions at strategic levels to shape the environment in India’s favour is totally missing.

Question: How are the countries like US, UK, and China are using their special forces?

Answer: These countries are using their Special Forces pro-actively in their areas of strategic interests with covert deployment. US Special Forces (USSF) are deployed today in some 186 countries. They also undertake direct actions in covert manner individually or in conjunction irregular forces and mercenary outfits. Same goes for UK, Russia and Pakistan. Chinese special forces along with PLA elements are deployed in development projects around the world, including in India’s immediate neighbourhood.

Question: What are the notable differences between Indian and American special forces units?

Answer: Equipping (as mentioned earlier), command and control, and employment philosophy – there is no thinking at the national level.

Question: Is Indian Intelligence working closely with Para SF? How badly do we need intelligence to work with our special forces?

Answer: There is no concept of external intelligence agencies operation together with Special Forces for strategic tasks – like practiced by US, UK, Israel, Russia, China, Pakistan. In our case that cooperation is limited to operations within J&K. That is why we have adverse strategic asymmetry vis-à-vis China-Pakistan in terms of sub-conventional warfare.

Question: Talking about two year old surgical strike, we still hear about the same in documentaries, movies or in news. Do our Special Forces need so much of exposure?

Answer: Special Forces operations are covert and are never publicized. Have you heard CIA, MI-6, Mossad, FSB, ISI, Chinese intelligence brag about their actions? Such publicity gives away capability, technical prowess, and modus operandi, all of which are dangerous for conduct of similar operations in future.

Question: The videos of Surgical strikes has been released. How does it effect our security limits or measures? Was the response of Indian Government to surgical strike was of a mature one?

Answer: Government has acted in highly immature and foolish for gaining political mileage, timing it with the next general elections, even as it violates the unwritten code of intelligence operations and special operations that are not to be made public. The surgical strikes were an excellent operation but the mere fact that these have not been repeated despite numerous terror attacks makes us the laughing stock. Besides, the self-aggrandizement that it would stop future Pakistani cross-border actions was childish. But then Defence Minister Mohan Parrikar saying that he taught the army their capabilities and sent them into POK like Hanuman shows how ridiculously juvenile our politicians are in terms of matters military. We need the response mechanism like Israel, but that looks highly unlikely because of lack of political will.

Question: As a Veteran who served for more than 40 years, what is your message for the youth who aspire to achieve Balidan Badge and serve in special forces?

Answer: These are the best forces that the Army has, that is why they are called “Special”. If the youth want to join the outfit you need determination and preparation. Having been brought up in a village of Himachal Pradesh, I did not know cycling and swimming when I joined the Indian Military Academy. So I was perpetually on punishment and even detained in the break after first term till I cleared all swimming tests

I like this Guy but I disagree with him on the Publicizing the Surgical Strikes to the world. Publicizing the Surgical Strikes was important but it could have been done in a better way. We should have brought back evidences that belong to Terrorist themselves or Belonging to the PorkiShitani Dogs to prove our point and lead the narrative on our side.