Indian Army T- 90 (Bhishma) and T- 72 (M-1) Tanks

[t 90s]

You need to check out new Eramk2 upgrade
It's Engine is already being upgraded

Currently 2040 T-90S 'Bhishma' ordered which were procured in 7 separate orders

In 2001, India purchased 310 T-90S tanks from Russia, of which 124 were delivered complete (42 featured the early cast turrets seen on Russian tanks) and 186 were to be assembled from kits delivered

Second follow-on contract, worth $800 million, was signed on October 26, 2006, for another 330 T-90S

Third contract third contract, worth $1.23 billion, was signed in December 2007 for 347 upgraded T-90Ms, the bulk of which will be licence-assembled by HVF.

Fourth contract ₹10,000 crore (US$1.4 billion) purchase of 354 new T-90SM tanks for six tank regiments for the China border was approved.
In 2012


Sixth contract
On 17 September 2013, India's Defence Ministry approved the production of 235 T-90S tanks under Russian licence for $1 billion in HVT

7 th contract On 11 November 2019, India announced that Heavy Vehicles Factory will produce 464 T-90S MBTs

Total order are 1674 , wiki article is inaccurate & indian T 72 are not the same T 72B in Russian service.

 

[WARREN SS]

Total order are 1674 , wiki article is inaccurate & indian T 72 are not the same T 72B in Russian service.

Its not Wiki article its Based on Trade Registers And 7 orders that made by India

as For ERA mk2 upgrade

And here is an image of the uprated version (780 to 1000 HP) of the V 46.6 diesel engine used by the T-72 MBT. Source: DRDO

 

[WARREN SS]

Elbit OEM, Alpha Design Tech Pvt Limited produced TIFCS

DRDO T-series Commanders Thermal Sights, ToT given to industry

DRDO T-series Driver's Thermal Sights, ToT given to industry

Bharat Forge Produced T-72 Barrel

 

[WARREN SS]

So Indian T-72 Upgrade is Better than T-72B3

its Has better Night Sights And thermal Cameras

Explosive Reactive Armour (ERA) Mk-II
Salient Features

• Integral type configuration on hull glacis, in which the panels have been welded on tank surface and a window for positioning of reactive elements.
• Adaptable to all the three tanks i.e. T-72, T-90 and Arjun Mk-II of Indian Army
• No sympathetic detonation between adjacent elements inside the panel and immune to detonation against small arms
• Additional weight on one tank : 1.5T
• Effective even after deep fording

The product has been accepted by the Users and likely to be inducted for fitment on MBT Arjun Mk-I A and import substitute for T-90 Tanks

 

[t 90s]

So Indian T-72 Upgrade is Better than T-72B3

its Has better Night Sights And thermal Cameras

Explosive Reactive Armour (ERA) Mk-II
Salient Features

• Integral type configuration on hull glacis, in which the panels have been welded on tank surface and a window for positioning of reactive elements.
• Adaptable to all the three tanks i.e. T-72, T-90 and Arjun Mk-II of Indian Army
• No sympathetic detonation between adjacent elements inside the panel and immune to detonation against small arms
• Additional weight on one tank : 1.5T
• Effective even after deep fording

The product has been accepted by the Users and likely to be inducted for fitment on MBT Arjun Mk-I A and import substitute for T-90 Tanks

Russian T 72B base armour is thicker made of composite ( super dolly parton ) is different from the one in export variant which were thinner aka monkey models including one sold to india. ERA MK2 is same as K 5. T 72B has better gun ( 2A46M-5) & better ammo ( svinets 1 & 2 ).

 

[WARREN SS]

Russian T 72B base armour is thicker made of composite ( super dolly parton ) is different from the one in export variant which were thinner aka monkey models including one sold to india. ERA MK2 is same as K 5. T 72B has better gun ( 2A46M-5) & better ammo ( svinets 1 & 2 ).

The base armour of t-72 is almost 50 years old design
There zero evidence support your claim.

Geez !!!Now don't start making up things

Firstly you have no idea what your talking about so your start making up random stuff.

T-72B is upgrade of older stocks of Soviet era T-72
With Kontakt-5 ERA panel Gun upgrade and thermal sights
And better engine started in 2010

The T-72 base design has same thickness for every variant sold outside.

The only difference is Kontakt-5 ERA panels
And relikt ERA for T-72B3 M



"T-72B3 (Ob'yekt 184-M3): this upgrade was initiated in 2010 using old stocks of T-72B tanks held in reserve. In addition to performing a general overhaul of every vehicle, certain tanks were equipped with the more powerful V-92S2 engines, a new steering system in the driver's compartment and older tracks were replaced with the new universal, twin-pin design. The upgrade program focuses instead on improving the tank's firepower, mainly through the implementation of the Kalina fire control system, albeit in a simplified form. The tank commander retains an upgraded version of the legacy TKN-3MK sight, which is a passive device with a range of only 600 m at night, but is augmented with a monitor that displays thermal imagery from the gunner's main sight. The commander also has a new turret control panel. The gunner still has the 1A40-4 FCS with 1K13-49 sight, but these are now part of the auxiliary sighting system to complement the new PNM Sosna-U panoramic multi-spectral sensor, which replaced the TPN-3-49 in its mounting. The Sosna-U is a multi-channel, panoramic sight stabilized in both vertical and horizontal axes with a built-in laser rangefinder and command guidance module used with 9M119M missiles. The most advantageous aspect of the Sosna-U is the Thales Catherine-FC thermal imager which extends the detection and identification range of a tank-sized target to 10,500 m and 3,300 m respectively, at night/day and in all weather combat conditions. The T-72B3 series vehicles also received the new 2A46M5 main gun which has a dispersion value significantly lower than previous generations,"


ERA MK2 is more modern design based on
Indian research on "Kachan armour" and Kontakt-5

It has better quality compared to
Both that is Published in DRDO magazine
Based on Field evaluation results

It's has peer reviewed and Published research papers.

As For ammo
India already has Israel or Russian Mango APFSDS or DRDO
Indigenously developed which can
Has 550mm penetration.

Right now DRDO Is developing APFSDS of 700-800 M penetration class


Compare R&D spending of India and availability of western technology to India.

That made us self reliable in radars, missiles,
Submarines technology.

Days of Russian dominance passed

India has now access to technology which
Russian only dreams about

Like Rafale F3R
Probably the most modern Fighter than any Russian has there inventory with Meteor BVR.

 

[t 90s]

The base armour of t-72 is almost 50 years old design
There zero evidence support your claim.

Geez !!!Now don't start making up things

Firstly you have no idea what your talking about so your start making up random stuff.

T-72B is upgrade of older stocks of Soviet era T-72
With Kontakt-5 ERA panel Gun upgrade and thermal sights
And better engine started in 2010

The T-72 base design has same thickness for every variant sold outside.

The only difference is Kontakt-5 ERA panels
And relikt ERA for T-72B3 M



"T-72B3 (Ob'yekt 184-M3): this upgrade was initiated in 2010 using old stocks of T-72B tanks held in reserve. In addition to performing a general overhaul of every vehicle, certain tanks were equipped with the more powerful V-92S2 engines, a new steering system in the driver's compartment and older tracks were replaced with the new universal, twin-pin design. The upgrade program focuses instead on improving the tank's firepower, mainly through the implementation of the Kalina fire control system, albeit in a simplified form. The tank commander retains an upgraded version of the legacy TKN-3MK sight, which is a passive device with a range of only 600 m at night, but is augmented with a monitor that displays thermal imagery from the gunner's main sight. The commander also has a new turret control panel. The gunner still has the 1A40-4 FCS with 1K13-49 sight, but these are now part of the auxiliary sighting system to complement the new PNM Sosna-U panoramic multi-spectral sensor, which replaced the TPN-3-49 in its mounting. The Sosna-U is a multi-channel, panoramic sight stabilized in both vertical and horizontal axes with a built-in laser rangefinder and command guidance module used with 9M119M missiles. The most advantageous aspect of the Sosna-U is the Thales Catherine-FC thermal imager which extends the detection and identification range of a tank-sized target to 10,500 m and 3,300 m respectively, at night/day and in all weather combat conditions. The T-72B3 series vehicles also received the new 2A46M5 main gun which has a dispersion value significantly lower than previous generations,"


ERA MK2 is more modern design based on
Indian research on "Kachan armour" and Kontakt-5

It has better quality compared to
Both that is Published in DRDO magazine
Based on Field evaluation results

It's has peer reviewed and Published research papers.

As For ammo
India already has Israel or Russian Mango APFSDS or DRDO
Indigenously developed which can
Has 550mm penetration.

Right now DRDO Is developing APFSDS of 700-800 M penetration class


Compare R&D spending of India and availability of western technology to India.

That made us self reliable in radars, missiles,
Submarines technology.

Days of Russian dominance passed

India has now access to technology which
Russian only dreams about

Like Rafale F3R
Probably the most modern Fighter than any Russian has there inventory with Meteor BVR.

T 72B model is not the same tank as other T 72. T 72B used a special composite armour inserts ( super dolly parton ).

T 72B3 is just an upgrade to T 72B

 

[Tang]

BTW some idiots on this forum don't know that it is India that has saved both the Tank industry and the aeronautical industry of Russia.

 

[t 90s]

BTW some idiots on this forum don't know that it is India that has saved both the Tank industry and the aeronautical industry of Russia.

Indian T 90S are still the most formidable MBT in subcontinent, better than anything pukes have. one upgrade and it's basically game over for pukes.

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

Indian T 90S are still the most formidable MBT in subcontinent, better than anything pukes have. one upgrade and it's basically game over for pukes.

That upgrade is APS.

 

[Marliii]

Porks have already got vt4 so any future tank that gets in the army should deal with those chinese tin cans

 

[Maharaj samudragupt]

Porks have already got vt4 so any future tank that gets in the army should deal with those chinese tin cans

T 90 can deal with them even now.
Plus it's not that only tanks will fight tanks.

 

[Marliii]

BTW some idiots on this forum don't know that it is India that has saved both the Tank industry and the aeronautical industry of Russia.

The future t14 will only materialise if we get some how involved other wise ruskies will not able to get even 200 t14 in their army by 2025 so that's the reason for their lobbying

 

[Marliii]

T 90 can deal with them even now.
Plus it's not that only tanks will fight tanks.

Its not always tank vs tank but in our case it is almost certain that rajasthan or punjab areas will witness massive tank attacks

 

[t 90s]

Porks have already got vt4 so any future tank that gets in the army should deal with those chinese tin cans

T 90 can easily deal with it, all it need a ammo , autoloader & gun upgrade. Do not believe to much into paki propaganda specially that clown Dazzler. The amount of BS they speak in PDF is next level specially about DOP of there tank rounds. Few days ago one guy there was claiming 650mm DOP for there DU round & he got a positive rating for that

The future t14 will only materialise if we get some how involved other wise ruskies will not able to get even 200 t14 in their army by 2025 so that's the reason for their lobbying

there's actually no need .Upgrading T 90 will do.

 

[Marliii]

T 90 can easily deal with it, all it need a ammo , autoloader & gun upgrade. Do not believe to much into paki propaganda specially that clown Dazzler. The amount of BS they speak in PDF is next level specially about DOP of there tank rounds. Few days ago one guy there was claiming 650mm DOP for there DU round & he got a positive rating for that

there's actually no need .Upgrading T 90 will do.

That I know the only usable tanks they have are vt4 and t80 rest is almost scrap metal.t90 is getting a APS and they should get upgraded to MS standard.

 

[t 90s]

That I know the only usable tanks they have are vt4 and t80 rest is almost scrap metal.t90 is getting a APS and they should get upgraded to MS standard.

Yes a upgrade is needed along with better ammo, new autoloader & gun.

 

[WARREN SS]

T 72B model is not the same tank as other T 72. T 72B used a special composite armour inserts ( super dolly parton ).

T 72B3 is just an upgrade to T 72B

Well it's slightly modification

Declassified documents from the CIA show an estimated turret armor protection equal to 450 mm & 500mm RHA against APFSDS and HEAT of basic
T-72M1

T-72B has

equivalent of 520 millimeter thick when faced by APFSDS kinetic energy penetrators, but an impressive 950 millimeters thick when attacked by HEAT shaped charge projectiles.

So T-72 ERA mk2 Or T-72 B3 with Kontakt-5
Will almost had same level of protection
With T-72B3 having slightly better.

Still Indian modification had edge in elbit
Thermal imaging Sights and over all
Situation awareness package

Lacks In the APFSDS department
With little availability
Though It can still fire 3BM42M/3BM44M ("Lekalo") or future DRDO APFSDS

But still T-72ERA mk2 modification will be superior or at par with to Al Khalid 1 & al Khalid 2

 

[Marliii]

Well it's slightly modification

Declassified documents from the CIA show an estimated turret armor protection equal to 450 mm & 500mm RHA against APFSDS and HEAT of basic
T-72M1

T-72B has

equivalent of 520 millimeter thick when faced by APFSDS kinetic energy penetrators, but an impressive 950 millimeters thick when attacked by HEAT shaped charge projectiles.

So T-72 ERA mk2 Or T-72 B3 with Kontakt-5
Will almost had same level of protection
With T-72B3 having slightly better.

Still Indian modification had edge in elbit
Thermal imaging Sights and over all
Situation awareness package

Lacks In the APFSDS department
With little availability
Though It can still fire 3BM42M/3BM44M ("Lekalo") or future DRDO APFSDS

But still T-72ERA mk2 modification will be superior or at par with to Al Khalid 1 & al Khalid 2

Weren't the export t72s watered down.to my knowledge only warsaw pact had the original

 

[t 90s]

Well it's slightly modification

Declassified documents from the CIA show an estimated turret armor protection equal to 450 mm & 500mm RHA against APFSDS and HEAT of basic
T-72M1

T-72B has

equivalent of 520 millimeter thick when faced by APFSDS kinetic energy penetrators, but an impressive 950 millimeters thick when attacked by HEAT shaped charge projectiles.

So T-72 ERA mk2 Or T-72 B3 with Kontakt-5
Will almost had same level of protection
With T-72B3 having slightly better.

Still Indian modification had edge in elbit
Thermal imaging Sights and over all
Situation awareness package

Lacks In the APFSDS department
With little availability
Though It can still fire 3BM42M/3BM44M ("Lekalo") or future DRDO APFSDS

But still T-72ERA mk2 modification will be superior or at par with to Al Khalid 1 & al Khalid 2

It's around 560mm against KE... add 150 to 200mm for K 5 & you have something like 700 to 760mm against KE in case of Russian tank & around 600 to 650mm in case of Indian.

Indian T 72 need an urgent replacement.

Weren't the export t72s watered down.to my knowledge only warsaw pact had the original

Yes. Soviets kept modifying there T 72 MBT. Most people get the opinion regarding T 72 from it's poor performance in gulf war without realising that Iraq used monkey models & its desi version, not the one russians were using.

Soviets were actually leading the charge.

T-72A - Protection: 410-500mm, APFSDS 3BM22: 380mm at 2km.
vs
M1 - Protection 350mm , APFSDS M735: 410mm at 2km.
1980 T-72 wins

T-72B/S w. Kontakt-1 - Protection 520–540mm, APFSDS 3BM26: 410mm at 2km
vs
M1A1 - Protection 400mm, APFSDS M829: 540mm at 2km.
1985 T-72 wins

T-72B w. Kontakt-5 - Protection 770–800mm, APFSDS 3BM48: 650mm at 2km.
vs
M1A1HA - Protection 600mm, APFSDS M829A1: 700mm at 2km.
1991 T-72 wins