Indian Army Armored Vehicles

[Blood+]

It is not a false assertion as of now,

It is, as of now, has been since almost half a century now actually!!

Please compare Arjun MK1`s accuracy preform ace to those tanks using similar FCS but smooth-bore gun ..

I have compared them, but have you??More over, are you actually aware of the physics involved in the stabilization of sub-caliber rounds (aka APFSDS) and the effects of rifling on the same??I seriously doubt you are, going by your nearly fanatical and hellbent opposition to the acceptance of a fact that is as real as you are!!Rifling can never give more accuracy to a sub-caliber projectile with such a large L ratio usually found in a typical kinetic energy penetrator, in fact, it actually has a negative effect on the accuracy of the same!!Only if you had cared to find out the science involved with it, you would've got it by now.

 

[harsh]

It of now, has been since almost half a century now actually!!


I have compared them, but have you??More are you actually aware of the physics involved in the stabilization of sub-caliber rounds (aka APFSDS) and the effects of rifling on the same??I seriously doubt you are, going by your nearly fanatical and hellbent opposition to the acceptance of a fact that is as real as you are!!Rifling can never give more accuracy to a sub-caliber projectile with such a large L ratio usually found in a typical kinetic energy penetrator, in fact, it actually has a negative effect on the accuracy of the same!!Only if you had cared to find out the science involved with it, you would've got it by now.

Man you just went through history of
APFSDS rounds. So you are right about some part but please go through development of APFSDS rounds.
you are right about these rounds loose their kinetic energy when fire from rifled gun but now modified APFSDS rounds can be fired from rifled gun.

if you want to find this development in indian contest then please search
about
drdo T1 120 mm
Drdo T2 120 mm
for 125 mm For smoothbore
125 mm mk1
125 mm mk2
AMK 340
AMK 340A
and AMK339

 

[Blood+]

Man you just went through history of
APFSDS rounds.

History??Trust me when I say this bro, I haven't even started yet!!

So you are right about some part

I'm right about the entire length of my post bruh.

but please go through development of APFSDS rounds.

I have and trust me, practically all of them are basically relics by today's standards, which belongs in museums rather than in actual combat use!!

you are right about these rounds loose their kinetic energy when fire from rifled gun

I never even cared to touch that point in my post because that is something as obvious as the sun being a sphere of plasma and not of fire!!But you are right.

but now modified APFSDS rounds can be fired from rifled gun.

Trust me man, I was among the first ones in this whole forum who actually described the so called modification process and how it works and ARDE's solution is nothing path breaking or unique, because the Brits had done the same much earlier and so did the French but the later did it for HEAT rounds rather than ADFSDS!!And yeah, those modifications do in fact reduce the effects of the rifling to a good extent but do not mitigate the problem altogether!!
And besides, if you need to further modify a design, just so you can fire them through a rifled gun, there by increasing their manufacturing cost and also further complicating the manufacturing process, making it more time consuming, and in return, get no advantage worth mentioning, then what's the point in retaining the rifled gun??Not to mention, the rifled guns are more expensive and time consuming to build than their smooth barrel counterparts.

And there are just a host of other problems that comes as bonus with a rifled barrel, I can put light on them if you want me to.

if you want to find this development in indian contest then please search
about
drdo T1 120 mm
Drdo T2 120 mm
for 125 mm For smoothbore
125 mm mk1
125 mm mk2
AMK 340
AMK 340A
and AMK339

What makes you think I haven't research about those rounds already??I have been in this block for so long for nothing m8!!

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I have already given you facts few days back, I have only requested you do a better research on the topic and return with facts to continue debate ..

Read last few pages here, It will refresh your memory which seems to be weak that i 'DIDNOT' talked about APFSDS at all, If your reply was deliberated personal than my dear you have already lost the debate ..

Carry on..

I have compared them, but have you??More over, are you actually aware of the physics involved in the stabilization of sub-caliber rounds (aka APFSDS) and the effects of rifling on the same??

I seriously doubt you are, going by your nearly fanatical and hellbent opposition to the acceptance of a fact that is as real as you are!!

 

[Blood+]

I have already given you facts on other thread few days back, I have only requested you do a better research on the topic and return with facts to continue debate ..

That's rather presumptuous on your part to presume that I haven't done my studies.

I never said about APFSDS instead i have raised its about regular low pressured rounds..

Not rounds but only one particular type - HESH, which had become pretty much a relic many decades ago!!And besides, where in your post, you ever mentioned rounds other than APFSDS??You never specified anything, instead, you just gave a vague statement which went something like rifled guns are more accurate than smooth barrel ones, not once you mentioned the rounds!!So I assumed you were talking about APFSDS like anyone would, since we are talking about tank guns here and that's the principle anti tank round in use across the globe.
===============

It is your replies coming without source backing your claim ..

One doesn't need to back up with source something as obvious as this simple fact.

 

[Blood+]

Read last few pages here, It will refresh your memory

I never said you did!!I said you didn't mention a thing and your statement was pretty vague to begin with!!Again you are being presumptuous.

which seems to be weak

More presumptions.

that i 'DIDNOT' talked about APFSDS at all,

Did you even care to read my earlier comment or did you not understand it??This is what I said - "And besides, where in your post, you ever mentioned rounds other than APFSDS??You never specified anything, instead, you just gave a vague statement which went something like rifled guns are more accurate than smooth barrel ones, not once you mentioned the rounds!!So I assumed you were talking about APFSDS like anyone would, since we are talking about tank guns here and that's the principle anti tank round in use across the globe". Read it again.

If your reply was deliberated personal than my dear you have already lost the debate ..

You are the one who's being presumptuous yet somehow I end up deliberately attacking you personally??!!How does that work??

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Post no : #1382 And whole discussion afterwards, It right here ..

I rather say your whole claims are rather vague to start with, Every thing you are starting today we talked this in last few days ..

That's rather presumptuous on your part to presume that I haven't done my studies.

Not rounds but only one particular type - HESH, which had become pretty much a relic many decades ago!!And besides, where in your post, you ever mentioned rounds other than APFSDS??You never specified anything, instead, you just gave a vague statement which went something like rifled guns are more accurate than smooth barrel ones, not once you mentioned the rounds!!So I assumed you were talking about APFSDS like anyone would, since we are talking about tank guns here and that's the principle anti tank round in use across the globe.
===============

One doesn't need to back up with source something as obvious as this simple fact.

That's rather presumptuous on your part to presume that I haven't done my studies.

Not rounds but only one particular type - HESH, which had become pretty much a relic many decades ago!!And besides, where in your post, you ever mentioned rounds other than APFSDS??You never specified anything, instead, you just gave a vague statement which went something like rifled guns are more accurate than smooth barrel ones, not once you mentioned the rounds!!So I assumed you were talking about APFSDS like anyone would, since we are talking about tank guns here and that's the principle anti tank round in use across the globe.
===============

One doesn't need to back up with source something as obvious as this simple fact.

I never said you did!!I said you didn't mention a thing and your statement was pretty vague to begin with!!Again you are being presumptuous.

More presumptions.

Did you even care to read my earlier comment or did you not understand it??This is what I said - "And besides, where in your post, you ever mentioned rounds other than APFSDS??You never specified anything, instead, you just gave a vague statement which went something like rifled guns are more accurate than smooth barrel ones, not once you mentioned the rounds!!So I assumed you were talking about APFSDS like anyone would, since we are talking about tank guns here and that's the principle anti tank round in use across the globe". Read it again.


You are the one who's being presumptuous yet somehow I end up deliberately attacking you personally??!!How does that work??

 

[Blood+]

I rather say your whole claims are rather vague to start with,..

Unbelievable..............simply unbelievable!!

Every thing you are starting today we talked this in last few days ..

Just because we talked about this a few days ago with some other member, doesn't mean we can't discuss again, especially when a conclusion is yet to be reached!!This is supposed to be a discussion forum afterall, or have I got it all wrong??

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Their is so much less we know abt our own, Its a achievement the men of this tank unit who can fire 30rnds in a min, With 80% accuracy, Wonder how Arjun crew do with their`s gun ( No taking official 6rnds per min general benchmark for all MBTs in service ) ..

 

[WolfPack86]

Operation Calm Down: Army introduces bullet-proof vehicles to counter Kashmir stone pelters
State-of-the-art Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle will protect our security forces from Kashmir stone-pelters and marauding terror attacks.
To keep security personnel away from harm's way, the government has introduced an all new armoured personnel carrier in Jammu and Kashmir where stone-pelting has reared its ugly head as a new form of attack by a few wayward Kashmiri youth.

In violence-hit Kashmir, where stone-pelting incidents are reported on a regular basis, Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle will prove its mettle as a saviour. The state-of-the-art combat vehicle will also protect our forces from marauding terror attacks.
Know more about the armoured personnel carrier:

1. The cost of one Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle is around Rs 75 lakh and is built to deal with irate mobs and stone pelters.
2. It is a light armoured personnel carrier and will be deployed in violence hit areas.
3. The counter-terror vehicle is air-conditioned with a seating capacity for eight jawans.
4. It has real-time public monitoring system and high resolution camera, which can monitor a mob around 360 degrees.
5. The vehicle is quipped with stretcher, medicines and tow bars.
6. Each Army unit will be equipped with two of these bullet-proof vehicles to record movements within 500 metre.
7. MSPV develops Panthera T6 from Toyota land cruiser. It is armored personnel carrier.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...o-counter-kashmir-stone-pelters/1/765471.html

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Another Scam in shadow of conflict ..

Government should take note of this ..

Address: Minerva Special Purpose Vehicles L.L.C، Saih Shuaib -3 532-202 Warehouse No: 1, 2,3 &4، Adjacent to Transworld Metal Works L.L.C، Dubai Industrial City Dubai UAE. - إمارة دبيّ - United Arab Emirates
Phone: +971 4 425 1761

Minerva Special Purpose Vehicles Pvt.Ltd

611/ B1 Mumbai Agra Road
Near HP Petrol Pump
Gonde , Nashik – 422403
Maharashtra , India

Tel: +91 2553 225526
Fax: +91 2553 225526
Mob: +91 70 28 199994
+91 89 40 060606

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6

 

[ezsasa]

Operation Calm Down: Army introduces bullet-proof vehicles to counter Kashmir stone pelters
State-of-the-art Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle will protect our security forces from Kashmir stone-pelters and marauding terror attacks.
To keep security personnel away from harm's way, the government has introduced an all new armoured personnel carrier in Jammu and Kashmir where stone-pelting has reared its ugly head as a new form of attack by a few wayward Kashmiri youth.

In violence-hit Kashmir, where stone-pelting incidents are reported on a regular basis, Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle will prove its mettle as a saviour. The state-of-the-art combat vehicle will also protect our forces from marauding terror attacks.
Know more about the armoured personnel carrier:

1. 
   
   
   • The cost of one Panthera-T6 armoured vehicle is around Rs 75 lakh and is built to deal with irate mobs and stone pelters.
   • It is a light armoured personnel carrier and will be deployed in violence hit areas.
   • The counter-terror vehicle is air-conditioned with a seating capacity for eight jawans.
   • It has real-time public monitoring system and high resolution camera, which can monitor a mob around 360 degrees.
   • The vehicle is quipped with stretcher, medicines and tow bars.
   • Each Army unit will be equipped with two of these bullet-proof vehicles to record movements within 500 metre.
   • MSPV develops Panthera T6 from Toyota land cruiser. It is armored personnel carrier.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...o-counter-kashmir-stone-pelters/1/765471.html

This should be a good lesson for TATA LAMV. if they don't get their product ready on time, others will take it's place.
i don't remember reading of any such deal prior to this article. it's quite rare that IA purchases something out of the blue.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

TATA LAMV originally designated for COIN operation but when General Bikram Singh took over he undo most what General V.K Singh done in his time.

One of the changes was changing role of TATA LAMV from Coin to Recon, Basically a BRDM replacement.

========================

Worst the vehicle was bought under the tag of RIOT control vehicle, when more matured indigenous machine was available within country for RIOT control and as a Armound personal carrier at much cheaper price tag providing same capabilities ..

1. Indian Marksman with 360 degree Surveillance package, They camera payload has multiple options ..

2. Indian Marksman exported and custom designed for Chilean Law enforcement agencies and in service with Chilean Government.

This should be a good lesson for TATA LAMV. if they don't get their product ready on time, others will take it's place.i don't remember reading of any such deal prior to this article. it's quite rare that IA purchases something out of the blue.

 

[WolfPack86]

Armoured Personnel Carrier PANTHERA T6 I Military vehicles I Peacekeeping Vehicles | MSPV APC

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6

 

[WolfPack86]

MSPV Armored Personnel Carrier- Panthera T6